Hulk's strength - Already have judges!!!

Originally posted by Stoic
He has the extremis in his brain, but he also has that serum in him that was injected into him as well. Carver. Do you ever think before you type out the things that you do? What happened before the Sun God battle? I may have been poorly written, but that's not my fault, however it is still canon. Don't say stupid things.

He doesn't take the serum anymore (lol). He was brain damaged for months, and lost all the serum he had. There is no serum. Hell, the last time he took it was around the Avengers story when he fought Sun God. You see, this is what I'm talking about. You won't admit it but you haven't been keeping up with the Hulk. Hulk has been hospitalized for months. When he got shot in the head, he was knocked out for two weeks. Shield found him and he was with them knocked out for no telling how long. Tony then built Extremis and injected it into his brain. The serum doesn't even last long. I think it last for hours. After that, it burns off. Read some Hulk comics. I have every Hulk book since 2003, you will not win a debate against me. I have stories before then as well but not all of his material. How about this, show us him using the serum before going Doc Green.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... misrepresenting? Yeah right. Nothing was misrepresenting about my scans and if you are debating a topic and you feel confident in what you are saying PROVIDE PROOF. Here's an example...

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f105/t598461.html

Everything these guys mentioned, they brought a scan backing up their claims. It's no off the top of my head debating here. All evidence. Learn from it before debating against a character.

What does this have to do with your lies? I'm not telling you something that you don't already know. What you want are scans so that you can't lie about the things that you know, while attempting to play stupid until you actually see what you know. This is your blatant disrespect for people that you deal with. You are literally trying to play people for idiots. not sure why you can;t see this. Anyways, I have better things to do, than deal with deceitful people.

Originally posted by Stoic
Are you comparing a real pyramid to the one that was in Vegas? Do you know the disparity between the two in terms of weight? See you're doing it again. You really have to think about these things before you go painting yourself into the corner. i mean seriously, why would I have to even mention this, if you comprehended what you read?

😂

It was said to be a Pyramid. 😂

Do you have anything proving otherwise that it wasn't as Hollow, etc... as the Pyramid in the scan I posted with Superman? Change your name to denial.

Originally posted by Stoic
What does this have to do with your lies? I'm not telling you something that you don't already know. What you want are scans so that you can't lie about the things that you know, while attempting to play stupid until you actually see what you know. This is your blatant disrespect for people that you deal with. You are literally trying to play people for idiots. not sure why you can;t see this. Anyways, I have better things to do, than deal with deceitful people.

Give up Stoic. The people here read the books of every scan i posted. If you think I lied then oh well. You lost and you have no proof of anything except what you think. Move on. Hulk starts at High Herald strength which still doesn't mean he will drop everyone from the onset of the battle because you have to take durability into consideration as well, along with the fact that even though Hulk is dumb, he still holds back.

Originally posted by carver9
He doesn't take the serum anymore (lol). He was brain damaged for months, and lost all the serum he had. There is no serum. Hell, the last time he took it was around the Avengers story when he fought Sun God. You see, this is what I'm talking about. You won't admit it but you haven't been keeping up with the Hulk. Hulk has been hospitalized for months. When he got shot in the head, he was knocked out for two weeks. Shield found him and he was with them knocked out for no telling how long. Tony then built Extremis and injected it into his brain. The serum doesn't even last long. I think it last for hours. After that, it burns off. Read some Hulk comics. I have every Hulk book since 2003, you will not win a debate against me. I have stories before then as well but not all of his material. How about this, show us him using the serum before going Doc Green.

This I can admit, however wasn't the serum that he took actually small robots that was injected into his brain to give him tiny shocks when he lost control. Also Carver you really need to slow it down when telling me what i have read, and not read. You don't really know anything about me, so keep it straight. I have not read every single Hulk comic, this i admit, but it's been more to the tune of missing 2 or maybe 3 issues that were too boring for me to bother.

Originally posted by carver9
By the way, lifting a Pyramid is a High Herald ft. Not only lifting it but tossing it. Example...Superman is by far one of the strongest Heralds minus Hulk and he didn't easily lift a Pyramid like it's a cake walk per Stoic. Grey actually snatched one off the ground and threw it like a baseball.

And this is what I meant by cherrypicking feats.

Are you trying to say pyramids have some special property intrinsic to them, which we can use as a measure of HH strength?

Don't be stupid.

Superman has feats beyond that pyramid, and you know it. Using it as a yardstick to judge strength is idiotic.

Originally posted by Stoic
This I can admit, however wasn't the serum that he took actually small robots that was injected into his brain to give him tiny shocks when he lost control. Also Carver you really need to slow it down when telling me what i have read, and not read. You don't really know anything about me, so keep it straight. I have not read every single Hulk comic, this i admit, but it's been more to the tune of missing 2 or maybe 3 issues that were too boring for me to bother.

No it's a fluid that stimulates the brain.

http://s1143.photobucket.com/user/carver9/media-full//Screenshot_2014-06-25-13-46-15_zps3518d875.png.html

But it also fires electric impulses into the brain.

http://s1143.photobucket.com/user/carver9/media/Screenshot_2014-06-25-13-47-12_zps90a2b7e0.png.html?sort=9&o=134

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
And this is what I meant by cherrypicking feats.

Are you trying to say pyramids have some special property intrinsic to them, which we can use as a measure of HH strength?

Don't be stupid.

Superman has feats beyond that pyramid, and you know it. Using it as a yardstick to judge strength is idiotic.

Not what I'm saying but what I am saying that it takes an huge amount of strength to do it. I just used that as an example but not as a norm in a debate like this since Superman does have better.

Originally posted by carver9
😂

It was said to be a Pyramid. 😂

Do you have anything proving otherwise that it wasn't as Hollow, etc... as the Pyramid in the scan I posted with Superman? Change your name to denial.

That pyramid was a modern structure Carver. How can you confuse, an ancient pyramid with a modernized structure? How? Listen let's just drop it, because your level of comprehension just does not jive with me.

Originally posted by carver9
Give up Stoic. The people here read the books of every scan i posted. If you think I lied then oh well. You lost and you have no proof of anything except what you think. Move on. Hulk starts at High Herald strength which still doesn't mean he will drop everyone from the onset of the battle because you have to take durability into consideration as well, along with the fact that even though Hulk is dumb, he still holds back.

Every scan that you brought in were misrepresentations of the truth. none of them held any merit whatsoever. All the scans proved, was that you don't understand what you read. But for once we agree. Lets end this nonsense, because you either can not comprehend what you read, or you attempt to deceive people and think that they are too stupid to see what it is that you are doing.

I would like to see what DarkSaint believes, or anyone at that believes when they look at every single scan that you have presented in this thread. But you're right, it's obvious that we aren't getting anywhere, you continue to ignore logic, and post scans of things that are misrepresented out of context, twisted versions of the truth. Could someone else point this out, or is it just me? I'm done. I didn't lose, but I'm just going to agree to disagree with 98% of everything that you have stated Carver.

Originally posted by Stoic
That pyramid was a modern structure Carver. How can you confuse, an ancient pyramid with a modernized structure? How? Listen let's just drop it, because your level of comprehension just jive with me.

Every scan that you brought in were misrepresentations of the truth. none of them held any merit whatsoever. All the scans proved, was that you don't understand what you read. But for once we agree. Lets end this nonsense, because you either can not comprehend what you read, or you attempt to deceive people and think that they are too stupid to see what it is that you are doing.

I would like to see what DarkSaint believes, or anyone at that believes when they look at every single scan that you have presented in this thread. But you're right, it's obvious that we aren't getting anywhere, you continue to ignore logic, and post scans of things that are misrepresented out of context, twisted versions of the truth. Could someone else point this out, or is it just me? I'm done. I didn't lose, but I'm just going to agree to disagree with 98% of everything that you have stated Carver.

Oooooorrrrr, the scans might not be misrepresented, something might be wrong with your comprehension skills but you fail to see it. It's either or but like you've said, we are done here.

Well let me just ask Darksaint, krisblaze or anyone else that has read the scans that you presented on their merit. Were they misrepresentations of the truth or solid evidence? I mean why didn't Carver show the context of the scans? Was it because he doubted that there are other people that read comics, and not just browse the respect section? Why do you think that people are always telling you about these things Carver? you must think that they're just joking with you. You know what most people think? they think that you're taking them for fools, but it's too much of a trivial thing for them to actually dig into you. Look at how many times -Pr has nearly lost it on you. Oh and since you have to have the last word, like this is some type of kiddie thing, go on ahead knock yourself out.

Originally posted by Stoic
Well let me just ask Darksaint, krisblaze or anyone else that has read the scans that you presented on their merit. Were they misrepresentations of the truth or solid evidence? I mean why didn't Carver show the context of the scans? Was it because he doubted that there are other people that read comics, and not just browse the respect section? Why do you think that people are always telling you about these things Carver? you must think that they're just joking with you. You know what most people think? they think that you're taking them for fools, but it's too much of a trivial thing for them to actually dig into you. Look at how many times -Pr has nearly lost it on you. Oh and since you have to have the last word, like this is some type of kiddie thing, go on ahead knock yourself out.

Krisblaze hates the Hulk so he would have a bias opinion but anyone else, please feel free to point out the misrepresenting. How about you point them out Stoic. What was misrepresenting about my scans?

Uuuummmm, most people are commenting on how you give people abilities that they don't have. You went pages talking about Morg having cosmic awareness and fight at light speed, two things that he has not even shown on panel hut you gave him those abilities because Surfer showed them (WTF). That is how you debate though. That's your debating style. It all revolves around bios and what you think a character should be capable of, ignoring what is shown on panel. It's hard debating with someone like you who don't go by what's shown on panel. Difficult. Then when evidence is shown you ignore it. You ignored every single scan presented to you in this thread saying that it was context involved but never stating what the context is. Then you are saying the Pyramid isn't real. Said Thor know Martial arts in his fight against Kurse and didn't take the full hits. WTF man. How do we get through that shell of yours? Do you have an excuse for everything. That's why I brought judges into it because you're stubborn. With that said, stop responding to me.

Ok, I've read through this thread and should probably give my appreciation in more than one post, because it's difficult to fully explain how this issue is far from binary.

Personally, I don't think "high herald strenght" is one of those terms we could throw around. When does high herald starts and low herald ends? If we were to say for example that Superman at his absolute best was the standard for high herald strenght, there would be next to no heralds able to fit the bill. For me that term is part of the problem when discussing this. It needs to be clarified or put down.

The second problem even if there was a defined strength level that fits the concept of "high herald", it would hardly apply to fights. Because fight are about so much more than just physical strength. Many of the top dogs in the herald levels hold back often and have occasional dynamic strength, their battles are all over the place in that regard. Hulk is the epitome of dynamic strenght, but how come someone like Thing can put up a fight against him on occasion? Well, because Thing also has dynamic strenght. The idea of Hulk overpowering heralds in seconds because of his initial strength being increased is iffy at best, he is the prime example of dynamic growth but he's hardly the only one.

We should really focus in how each side reads the issue. Stoic says that if Hulk really started at a "high level", then he'd squash characters after a short struggle. This is downright false and makes for a dramatic take on the subject that only attemps to make Carver sound absurd. Carver's side is much less constricting, because he doesn't just assume Hulk will overpower everyone, because there are many things other than strenght in the fight. Kris echoed part of the problem a few posts ago: people assume Hulk's strength skyrockets each battle and that barely happens through his whole history.

So right now I think Carver is closer to the truth when it comes to describing Hulk's actual powers. But we really need to redefine and explore the true meaning of "high herald strenght", I don't think anybody thinks Thing has such level of power, but Thing or Namor can hang with Hulk for a period of time. You can be bellow some ideal strenght level and put up a serious fight against a given opponent, specially if you have dymanic strenght to catch up with them. Stoic brings a valid point when he says Hulk can start on a different level, but low enough to be matched by Spider-man or Cap? That's PIS at it's best like it would be PIS for Galactus to be hurt by the Human Torch even hungry.

Those are my two cents.

Great post Bently. To the judges, you all brought great comments in this debate and i thank you for that. Showed that you didn't just choose a side just because...you brought some of your opinions to this as well. Thanks again to the judges and to Stoic for participating.

Basically Carver stealing my shit again

Originally posted by Bentley
Stoic brings a valid point when he says Hulk can start on a different level, but low enough to be matched by Spider-man or Cap? That's PIS at it's best like it would be PIS for Galactus to be hurt by the Human Torch even hungry.

Those are my two cents.

Originally posted by HulkIsHulk
Excellent post Bentlely. As for this part, Stoic seems to easily be able to accept Spidey and Cap beating Hulk but not doing that to Thor.

👆

Don't think he grasp the concept that he is lowballing one character and praising the other.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
Basically Carver stealing my shit again

The 2 of you can't exist in the Gamma Nation.

This is clear.

When will you challenge, Carver, to a final showdown?

Originally posted by Insane Titan
Hope stoic destroys carver.

This is so painful to read....