Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Also we're probably just arguing semantics about what an A-Lister is. Point is though Affleck and Reynolds are certainly much much bigger stars than the likes of Hemsworth and Evans were (and still are). Let's not even go there with Will Smith.
So were Downey and Norton. So what's you're point?
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Oh and I completely forgot The Rock!Come on man!
Just Will Smith and The Rock are Massive box office draws. Affleck and Reynolds are "stars" at the very least and do sell.
The MCU never needed to go their with those kind of names.
I guess you're not reading my posts, because I've already said the Rock. The Rock is a draw, but only recently became a truly box office star.
On average WB are hiring relative unknowns for their movies.
And it's only smart business wise to hire a draw, because at the end of the day it's mostly always about money.
Originally posted by ares834
So were Downey and Norton. So what's you're point?
If you read my posts, my point is pretty clear.
No they weren't. Norton's always had more of a cult classic following for things like Fight Club. Downey was a nobody when Marvel hired him. He had a certain level of range going back to the days of Chaplin, but wasn't well known at all by younger audiences. He hadn't had a big career in years.
WB are hiring big named actors to lead their Dc properties. Marvel didn't do that. They just found the guy who best suited the role.
If you look at the NUMBERS and stop ignoring them, Edward Norton's BO average is actually higher than Ryan Reynolds, but lower than Affleck. HOWEVER, Affleck was in 2 Michael Bay films, which increased his total. Take those 2 away and Edward Norton is on the same level.
Robert Downey's average is above both of them. Even before Iron Man.
After reviewing a lot of lists from various sites, it gets kinda confusing and each list is different, but from all the lists I have seen, neither Affleck or Ryan Reynolds crack top 100 highest grossing actors.
It's usually Emma Watson, Tom Hanks, and Samuel L. Jackson at the top.
Even Will Smith doesn't crack the top 10, but usually top 20 or so. The Rock isn't anywhere near the top, either, but will probably get there one day.
While I think WB definitely does look for big stars for their roles more than Disney does, they are playing catchup, whether that's a good idea or not. I do think calling RDJ a nobody is a gross exaggeration. While not a box office draw, he was still well-known, and as I said before, his star was climbing.
Iron Man just gave him a massive boost, was all.
Originally posted by -Pr-
While I think WB definitely does look for big stars for their roles more than Disney does, they are playing catchup, whether that's a good idea or not. I do think calling RDJ a nobody is a gross exaggeration. While not a box office draw, he was still well-known, and as I said before, his star was climbing.Iron Man just gave him a massive boost, was all.
I never said he was a nobody. He was well known for be a brat pack in the 80s. However, he's not a huge box office star as side from Iron Man.
Huge box office stars are rare.
Originally posted by ares834
Except you're completely wrong. Norman and Downey were every bit as big as Affleck and Reynolds.
I Guess they were as big as Will Smith and The Rock too right?
Not to mention Norton was replaced after 1 film. Marvel generally doesn't like negotiating with big stars. They don't need to.
Robert Downey is by Far their biggest named lead. And even his name wasn't anywhere near as big Pre-IM.
Originally posted by ares834
And they aren't playing any of the big Justice league members..
Who said anything about the Justice League?
I'm talking about WB's casting lead characters for DC movies compared with Marvel's for Marvel movies.
DC tends to get bigger named actors to push it's movies.
Originally posted by ares834
Seriously, you're whole point is so laughably overblown it's rather hilarious.
No it's a perfectly valid point. But your denial of it is pretty laughable- switching the topic to Justice League in a silly attempt to deny my point.
It's just a fact the DC has generally gone for bigger names for it's lead characters. Obviously hoping those bigger names will push their movies. Not that there's anything necessarily wrong with that, as many film studios do the same.
But Marvel never really felt the need to, and just cast actors who best suited the role. That's when you tend to get actors owning the role like Chris Hemsworth, Chris Evans and Chris Pratt. Now those are household names thanks to Marvel.
I'm not switching anything. If we bring up side characters Marvel has Portman, Hopkins, and Hugo. Not to mention they just cast Cumberbatch as Strange.
And yes, you've been blowing this way out of proportion. Hell, you were initially saying Mamoa had star power. 😂
And it's not as if DC hasn't cast relative unknowns in large roles as well. Cavil, Miller, Gadot, and Ray Fisher are every bit as unknown as those three.
Originally posted by ares834
I'm not switching anything. If we bring up side characters Marvel has Portman, Hopkins, and Hugo. Not to mention they just cast Cumberbatch as Strange.And yes, you've been blowing this way out of proportion. Hell, you were initially saying Mamoa had star power. 😂
And it's not as if DC hasn't cast relative unknowns in large roles as well. Cavil, Miller, Gadot, and Ray Fisher are every bit as unknown as those three.
Did you see the MoS cast? Just about every side character was a big name actor. That leads me to believe that rather than look for the best fit in a well organized process WB went "wouldn't it be cool to get [big name actor] for [role]". Admittedly, no studio is terrible enough to completely eschew the casting process. But WB seems to be inconsistent.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
I Guess they were as big as Will Smith and The Rock too right?Not to mention Norton was replaced after 1 film. Marvel generally doesn't like negotiating with big stars. They don't need to.
Robert Downey is by Far their biggest named lead. And even his name wasn't anywhere near as big Pre-IM.
Smith isn't even that big domestically, like I've been saying. And the Rock has only one movie under his belt that's a relatively big blockbuster success. San Andreas.
Originally posted by ares834
I'm not switching anything. If we bring up side characters Marvel has Portman, Hopkins, and Hugo. Not to mention they just cast Cumberbatch as Strange.And yes, you've been blowing this way out of proportion. Hell, you were initially saying Mamoa had star power. 😂
And it's not as if DC hasn't cast relative unknowns in large roles as well. Cavil, Miller, Gadot, and Ray Fisher are every bit as unknown as those three.
Yup. Not to mention Edward Norton, Liv Tyler, Gwyneth Paltrow, Jeff Bridges, Guy Pearce, Don Cheadle, BEN ****ING Kingsley, Tim Roth, Hugo Weaving, Samuel L Jackson, ROBERT REDFORD, etc...
Yeah, Marvel uses just as many big names so far.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Who said anything about the Justice League?I'm talking about WB's casting lead characters for DC movies compared with Marvel's for Marvel movies.
DC tends to get bigger named actors to push it's movies.
No it's a perfectly valid point. But your denial of it is pretty laughable- switching the topic to Justice League in a silly attempt to deny my point.
It's just a fact the DC has generally gone for bigger names for it's lead characters. Obviously hoping those bigger names will push their movies. Not that there's anything necessarily wrong with that, as many film studios do the same.
But Marvel never really felt the need to, and just cast actors who best suited the role. That's when you tend to get actors owning the role like Chris Hemsworth, Chris Evans and Chris Pratt. Now those are household names thanks to Marvel.
Again, on AVERAGE WB is using relatively unknowns. Ezra Miller, Jason Mamoa, Gal Gadot, Henry Cavil, and Ray Fisher are less known than Chris Evans, Scarlet Johanson, Mark Ruffalo, and Jeremy Renner. It's not even close, to be honest.
Stop ignoring THE OTHER LEADS.
Originally posted by Firefly218
Did you see the MoS cast? Just about every side character was a big name actor. That leads me to believe that rather than look for the best fit in a well organized process WB went "wouldn't it be cool to get [big name actor] for [role]". Admittedly, no studio is terrible enough to completely eschew the casting process. But WB seems to be inconsistent.
No bigger than IM's or Thor's.
It's funny, because I think the cast for Iron Man 1 is overall more well known than Man of Steel. Let's break it down:
The Lead: Robert Downey Jr> Henry Cavill
The female lead: Gwenyth Paltow>>Amy Adams
The Villain: Jeff Bridges>>>>Michael Shannon
Russell Crowe is the only one in MOS that is more well known from the 2.
Originally posted by Golgo13
I never said he was a nobody. He was well known for be a brat pack in the 80s. However, he's not a huge box office star as side from Iron Man.Huge box office stars are rare.
If you didn't say it, then why did you think I was responding to you? 😛
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Should probably get back on topic though, guys.