Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
He might have a chance then here?
His power rises constantly while he's in LSSJ. However, this is also his weakness. His body can't withstand the increase in his own power, which is why he had to shoot energy blasts at random on several occasions, to stop himself from accidentally destroying himself. This also, presumably, led to him becoming weak enough for Goku to penetrate with a fully powered punch.
His body simply deteriorates when he builds up too much power.
Zenkai boosts are the obvious exception though. He most likely receives them the same way every other Saiyan does.
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
He might have a chance then here?
Yeah, he might.
We know that MV was stronger than SSJ2 Gohan from Cell Games.
Broly was winning in a beam struggle against Gohan, Goten and Goku, before Trunks inferfered.
Pre-Z sword Gohan, while inferior to his younger self from Cell Games, still had the SSJ2 form. Goten arguably was a MSSJ user. Goku (or the magical construct impersonating him, movie did not make it clear) was at least MSSJ, too. Broly's attack being superior to three kamehameha waves from those was a helluva feat, imo.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, he might.We know that MV was stronger than SSJ2 Gohan from Cell Games.
Broly was winning in a beam struggle against Gohan, Goten and Goku, before Trunks inferfered.
Pre-Z sword Gohan, while inferior to his younger self from Cell Games, still had the SSJ2 form. Goten arguably was a MSSJ user. Goku (or the magical construct impersonating him, movie did not make it clear) was at least MSSJ, too. Broly's attack being superior to three kamehameha waves from those was a helluva feat, imo.
No, Broly was definitely superior to Majin Vegeta.
Majin Vegeta was dead even with SSJ2 Goku from the Buu saga. The same SSJ2 Goku that was assisting SSJ2 Gohan, and MSSJ1 Goten in their beam struggle against Broly.
Here's a picture from the beam struggle:
This was clearly SSJ2 Gohan, SSJ2 Goku, and MSSJ1 Goten.
While Gohan had slacked off in his training, and was, according to Vegeta, less than HALF as strong as he was against Cell, that still puts him at around the same power level he was as a MSSJ1 during the Cell games.
So, essentially, it was SSJ2 Goku with the help of two SSJ1's. However, this is still quite a bit above just a SSJ2, especially considering it took ANOTHER MSSJ1 to tip the scales in the Z-fighters favors.
So Broly might not quite be SSJ3 tier, but he's definitely above MSSJ2 tier. Meaning he is above Majin Vegeta. By a wide margin, in fact, as it would take three other SSJ1's for Majin Vegeta to beat Broly.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Thanks 👆I also thought Goku was SSJ2 in that movie, but Galan disagreed and I wasn't sure anymore 😛
It makes perfect sense for Goku to be SSJ2 at that time.
Ya welcome. 😛
If Galan disagreed with that, then he's wrong.
Goku was definitely SSJ2 in the movie. So Broly is inbetween SSJ2 and SSJ3 tier, putting him far above Majin Vegeta. And honestly, probably on par with Majin Buu, when he first showed up.
Originally posted by Dark-Kenshin
Unless it's the Majin Vegeta in the same continuity as Broly (movie 8)(in which case, powerscaling takes hold), Broly wins. Manga Vegeta's feats are clearly inferior.
Well Manga Vegeta had the same feat as Anime Vegeta, essentially. He was roughly equal to SSJ2 Goku. Which is still pretty far below LSSJ SC Broly. Again, SC Broly wasn't quite SSJ3 level, but he was comfortably above SSJ2 level. Consider him a 50% SSJ3.
But yeah, Broly wins.
Majin Vegeta wins. Broly was defeated by a SSJ Gohan and Goten who had the moral support of an illusion that resembled Goku created by the Dragonballs. Plus we also know Goku defeated Broly in Hell at the end of movie 11, and we know he didn't use SSJ3 against him since he said to Janemba that the only person who pushed him to use SSJ3 was Buu before Janemba.
I peg Broly around the level of SSJ Buu saga Goku and Vegeta, and right below SSJ2 Adult Gohan.
Originally posted by The Merchant
Majin Vegeta wins. Broly was defeated by a SSJ Gohan and Goten who had the moral support of an illusion that resembled Goku created by the Dragonballs. Plus we also know Goku defeated Broly in Hell at the end of movie 11, and we know he didn't use SSJ3 against him since he said to Janemba that the only person who pushed him to use SSJ3 was Buu before Janemba.I peg Broly around the level of SSJ Buu saga Goku and Vegeta, and right below SSJ2 Adult Gohan.
1. Everything in your entire argument is assumption. Therefore you have no argument. 👆
2. You're acting like the Janemba movie is canon to the Broly movie, or vice-versa. They are not.
3. Did you NOT just see the picture I posted? Goku AND Gohan were BOTH SSJ2's when using the family kamehameha wave.
4. Illusion that resembled Goku? That was definitely NOT what happened. An illusion that resembled Goku was what happened when Gohan killed Cell. Goku was momentarily brought to Earth by the dragon balls, and legitimately doubled the size of the Kamehameha wave.
5. It doesn't matter how much you try to downplay Broly. He overpowered two SSJ2's, and a MSSJ1. He is near SSJ3 level, at least in the second coming.
The movies are canon to each other. Slug movie mentioned Turles events for example. Heck the Janemba movie had Paragus in it, which should mean that Broly did occur in the Janemba film.
That's what the Daizenshuu implied actually. That it was just an illusion boosting Gohan and Gotens resolve.
Having their hair blown back doesn't mean they were ssj2's. Goku had one bang when he fired a khh at Frieza.
I don't consider Broly being roughly around Ssj Buu saga Goku downplaying considering that would make him the strongest villain pre Majin Vegeta.
Originally posted by Agusto PinochetNo...wrong on all accounts except about Broli winning.
The Gohan that Broly fought was Post-Zeta Sword Gohan since Goten recognized Goku meaning that the tournament had already happened and Goku had proabably defeated Boo in Super Saiyan 3. Broly in movie 10 slaughters easily.
Goten would easily know what Goku looked like...they have pictures