Does STTGL's Probability Alteration require claims of "No-Limit Fallacy"?

Originally posted by U need Leonard
Power has nothing to do with probability control.

An average human who has probability control can alter an event far outside their power set. They could stop a star from exploding and still die by being hit by a car. You're not stopping the star from exploding through sheer might, you are halting the star's death by altering the events and variables that would lead up to that outcome, by using "magic".

With probability, you're not actually preventing anything with awesome power, you're just changing the likelihood. Human's IRL actually have some unexplained degree of probability manipulation through mental avenues. If you view a random-repeating CG set of numbers, the number you actually focus on will appear more often. It's an odd and cool ability, but it's not powerful.

This is pretty accurate. 👆

I don't think Jmanghan quite gets it though. He's starting to sound more and more like BG. 😘

Originally posted by U need Leonard
I forgot to add, not only do we not know STTGL's level of control over probability, we don't know the probability of most fictional events the power is working against. How do we know that a punch from Superman that will destroy the moon isn't a 1/1 scenario; as in, 1 way and 1 outcome or 1 way and no way to fail. STTGL would not be able to effect that, no matter how powerful his probability control is. Superman is pulling off an impossible feat, so the probability can also be impossible to alter. We just don't know.

Now, the power to alter causality can alter Superman's absolute punch, but not probability.

Well, Superman has failed with punches, so it's a pretty sure thing it isn't absolute.

What I was thinking of when I say, "When you're talking infinity, it's quite possible to have things with a probability of '1'. "

Was like a scenario where one throws infinite seeking attacks. In that situation, if the defense is not absolutely perfect, if the odds are not 0, then one or more of them will hit. There's never going to be an in between, it'll be 0% or 100%, and a probability control power that reduces the odds of something happening to, say, one billion billion (pretend I kept saying billion a billion times here) billionth as likely, i.e. effectively perfect against any finite attack, applied to such an infinite attack, would still have infinite chances to hit, thus, the odds of being hit remain 1:1.

Originally posted by Q99
Well, Superman has failed with punches, so it's a pretty sure thing it isn't absolute.

What I was thinking of when I say, "When you're talking infinity, it's quite possible to have things with a probability of '1'. "

Was like a scenario where one throws infinite seeking attacks. In that situation, if the defense is not absolutely perfect, if the odds are not 0, then one or more of them will hit. There's never going to be an in between, it'll be 0% or 100%, and a probability control power that reduces the odds of something happening to, say, one billion billion (pretend I kept saying billion a billion times here) billionth as likely, i.e. effectively perfect against any finite attack, applied to such an infinite attack, would still have infinite chances to hit, thus, the odds of being hit remain 1:1.

Ah, okay. I thought you meant a 1/infinity probability.

Except Superman isn't even a threat to STTGL, not even Pre-Crisis Supes is.

I don't know about that, but if STTGL were going to be victorious, it wouldn't be through control over probability.

There's no way for STTGL to effectively use probability manipulation against a random Hollow, in an argument. That particular power just isn't effective without probability data.

Originally posted by U need Leonard
I don't know about that, but if STTGL were going to be victorious, it wouldn't be through control over probability.

There's no way for STTGL to effectively use probability manipulation against a random Hollow, in an argument. That particular power just isn't effective without probability data.

Lemme just point out that TTGL alone survived an attack on par with the creation of the universe.

You haven't paid attention to the fight in the series, and the fight in the movie.

Before Simon and the team had gotten the power of probability alteration, they weren't able to scratch even the Anti-Spiral's lackeys DESPITE being more powerful then them.

I agree, it's inconsistent, but we have to go by what we see from the movies and show, and in the show, after they acquire probability alteration, they are able to definitively hurt the Anti-Spiral, whereas before, main attacks on the Anti-Spiral had no effect.

So you can tell that you have to be at a certain level to be able to change probability like TTGL, letalone STTGL, or to even combat it.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
STTGL used probability alteration to overtake the Anti-Spiral several times.

Lemme just point out that TTGL alone survived an attack on par with the creation of the universe.

You haven't paid attention to the fight in the series, and the fight in the movie.

Before Simon and the team had gotten the power of probability alteration, they weren't able to scratch even the Anti-Spiral's lackeys DESPITE being more powerful then them.

I agree, it's inconsistent, but we have to go by what we see from the movies and show, and in the show, after they acquire probability alteration, they are able to definitively hurt the Anti-Spiral, whereas before, main attacks on the Anti-Spiral had no effect.

So you can tell that you have to be at a certain level to be able to change probability like TTGL, letalone STTGL, or to even combat it.

That does not tell you how effective the probability manipulation is, in this case. None of that does, not when you are using it outside of the plot against fictional characters who preform feats outside of probability. It just doesn't.

Being unable to do something and then changing the probability by some unknown degree so that you can is not useful when you have to argue how well it works. There is not enough data.

Now, if he had used probability to preform some feat that we can actually measure the probability or odds of, then we have something to work with. For all we know, his probability manipulation affords him the ability to turn a 1/1,000,000,000,001 situation into a 1/999,999,999,999.