Originally posted by carthage
Or you can actually show me anything Bane has done without a nexus that compares to Vader's feats.I mean ****ing breaking boxes and beating Kas'im? Lmao that's not even able Maul
What do you mean? DoE Bane is stated to be more powerful then he was at any other point including on said DS nexus.
Originally posted by Syndicate
What do you mean? DoE Bane is stated to be more powerful then he was at any other point including on said DS nexus.
Lel.
RotJ Vader was more powerful than ever. Meaning he's better than Anakin on Mortis when he made the Daughter and Son his *****.
Take your cancer elsewhere plox.
this is my thread ffs
i can't derail it
But yeah let's get back to the main business here. Opinion on the fight?
RotS Skywalker - completely superior to Bane, even more superior to Zannah, stomps either Kaan or Kas'im.
RotJ Vader - the same as above.
ANH Vader - superior to either Bane or Zannah, wins easily against the other two.
AotC Anakin - gives hell to either Bane or Zannah in a saber contest, may fall due to sorcery or classical Force powers though. Wins against Kas'im in a good fight, ravages Kaan.
So it's basically a retarded mismatch and Anakin/Vader team stomps 10/10.
Well he collapsed a Rakatan temple in PoD and he's stated to be more powerful then his previous incarnations in each novel meaning his baseline is being able to do this + the decades he's had to increase his power.
Bane was amped heavily when he "collapsed" the Rakatan temple, this really isn't in dispute beside anyone other than DMB and Neph. Multiple quotes from the text reveal Bane was standing on a potent wellspring of force energy:
As soon as Bane’s feet touched the Unknown World’s surface he felt it: a deep thrumming, similar to what he’d first felt on Korriban but much, much stronger. Even the air felt different: heavy with ancient history and secrets long forgotten.
e shook his head to clear it. The dark side was strong here, so strong it made him feel light-headed
Given that areas strong in the darkside have amplified other force users throughout Legends canon, and Bane hasn't shown any comparable destructive telekinetic feats in DOE comparable to his Lehon feat- he has nothing in telekinesis comparable to Vader. Vader's Cathedral feat was accomplished by virtue of his own power, and without any external darkside energies like the Lehon temple.
As for "increasing in power", I never denied that he got more powerful from way back from Path of Destruction. Only that none of his feats in DOE barring his lightning really compare to that amped feat, and nothing he's done in his telekinetic feats on neutral ground even come close
Then there's his lightning which he's used to disintegrate stone in a weakened state.
Bane disintegrating stone is inferior to Vader pulverizing multiple Lyleks with the wave of his hand. Throughout Lords of the Sith the carpace of the Lyleks repels blaster bolts from Imperial guards, and the Twi'lek soldiers muse its stronger than their armor:
Within the half hour they found the first of the lylek carcasses. The huge body lay in the undergrowth, its head missing. Isval eyed the body, which seemed all edges and spikes and points, covered in a dry, chitinous exoskeleton, that looked like weather stone and was probably sturdier than his armor
-Lords of the Sith
. Bane also doesn't have any of the limitations of Vader's suit.
You're right Bane admitted he was physically degrading, and that his strength had diminished.
The aging process was subtle, but inescapable. Bane accepted this; what he lost in strength and speed he could easily compensate for with his wisdom, knowledge and experience.
It was possible Zannah had noticed his deteriorating physical abilities and had simply decided to wait.
-Dynasty of Evil
Given that Vader's feats of blitzing Jedi, deflecting turbolaser fire, deflecting omnidirectional blaster fire, and deflecting omnidirectional fire from freighters is superior to deflecting rain drops. I'd say the burden is on you to show how Vader's suit is more hampering than Bane being slower and inferior in physical strength. Vader's enhanced limbs have enabled him to shatter Crystalline pillars, support the weight of 12 stormtroopers, crush blasters, smash stone pillars, and kill large beasts/Tuk'ata with his bare hands. He's not suffering from any decrease in strength and speed unlike Bane
Similarly Vader has collapsed a cathedral of unspecified size pre prime
He's also telekinetically collapsed a skyscraper:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11115/111155790/4504892-7214608567-44771.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11115/111155790/4504893-0664241660-44771.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11115/111155790/4504894-6667882775-44771.jpg
I could literally go on and on listing his telekinetic feats, Bane's got nothing to even compare. Again his unamped feats/neutral showings really aren't even about TCW Darth Maul
Then we have Bane being empowered by battle meditation and Vader being weakened by it along with Zannah's spells which, while I actually DO think Vader would be able to resist to some extent despite his traumatic past, I think makes the contest no longer in question.
Yeah, the guy who literally willed himself back to life via willpower/strength in the force is going to be downed by Zannah's spells. Lmao. He'd easily snap her neck without gesturing
Originally posted by Syndicate
Well considering we're talking about force lightning/energy manipulation which Vader doesn't possess under normal circumstances... Yes.
Vader can easily repel Bane's lightning with barrier, dodge it, or catch it on his saber, or use tutaminus. Bane's lightning has been dodged by far weaker force users, its not a game changer.
Well considering DoE Bane has been honing his lightsaber skills for decades while Bane in PoD had only been training for a few years... I'd say the margin of skill between these two versions is great enough that there isn't much point in comparing them.
He's literally done nothing with a lightsaber blade apart from sparring matches with Zannah inbetween ROT/DOE. If you're claiming there isn't a difference the burden of proof is on you to show that there isn't a gap in skill between Vader and Bane. Bane's best skill feat is driving back Zannah, stalemating Kas'im, and beating Sirak. None of those duelists compare to Starkiller, Ben Kenobi, Commander Karbin, or Vader slaughtering multiple Jedi at once on Kessel or in Rise of Darth Vader.
Kas'im has beaten no one of note, Zannah's best feat is outdueling Set Harth who is featless, ergo Bane would get stomped in a duel to someone who can beat Starkiller
Along with the other circumstances involved like Kas'im hiding his knowledge and skill in Jar Kai to off balance Bane. We're not comparing PoD Bane and Vader here though I'd be happy to do that with you later if you'd like.
Vader outsparring Galen Marek who (perfected the art of lightsaber combat, is virtually unstoppable, and a practitioner of Juyo) who defeated Shaak Ti (one of the most skilled members of the Jedi order), and defeated the Starkiller clone (who inherited Galen's skill), as well as Ben Kenobi who was considered (One of the Greatest Jedi knights who ever lived) even after his prime in ROTS, as well as having slaughtered multiple Jedi on Kessel/killed groups of Jedi in Rise of Darth Vader, and is a master of all 7 lightsaber forms.
Bane isn't more skilled
From a power perspective? Ok, I'm willing to here your argument for why you believe that. Enlighten me. I've looked at about 5 or 6 Vader respect threads. There are quite a few.
Zapan's are the most compreheneisve
http://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/gen-discussion-1/darth-vader-respect-thread-part-1-1576417/
Well to address your first point I'm inclined to take the statements of the novel that he's more powerful then he's ever been at any point as legitimate. Thus him not demonstrating the feats to prove this doesn't really matter.
Really? Why? It's not as if he's breaking through their armor if he's blowing them up. It seems to me he's simply expanding the air within their body until they explode. What evidence is there to suggest a lylek is armored internally as well as externally? Also you neglected to mention that he did not so much disintegrate a lylek as simply blow it up. An important distinction given the arguments about Starkiller's own similar feat in the trailer and how such would have taken much more power then simply blowing them up.
I assume that to mean he's like Yoda or Dooku in that his physical body was deteriorating but he could sustain himself and even make himself superior to what he was when in his prime as his connection to the Force grew. This is backed up by Zannah being shocked at Bane's speed wondering how it was possible for him to move so quickly hinting that he was even faster by Rule of Two. Strength matters little as he already has a feat on par or around Vader's own by ripping a durasteel door off its hinges in a weakened state.
Why is it better though? I'll admit I'm not the best person to judge speed feats but I'm curious as to why those feats would be better then Bane's own. Also don't we always go off the basis that beings around the same or similar power level have mostly equal speed? I know that's what I've always done to avoid complications.
Well if that was the case I wouldn't say Vader's suit makes him inferior. But given you have yet to prove that it gives him advantages in these areas by a significant margin...
A skyscraper? You mean the bones of a would be structure that has no supports or actual weight aside from its metal frame.
You keep harping on this point. I feel like the fundamental difference between us here is that I believe the text of a novel when it states that someone's more powerful then they've ever been before that point which it does in each novel of the Bane trilogy.
Given Bane was unable to do this I see no reason why Vader would be capable of such.
I didn't say it was though if Vader's tagged by it it could be debilitating. I'm simply saying you can't compare the two since they fall under two different power sets.
Why is that? I'm not saying they do or do not but how would you know the skill level of said characters? Skill like speed is another tough subject to analyze. Here we have Kas'im who has master all 7 form of lightsaber combat to their greatest extent and Bane after a few years training is able to stand toe to toe with him. Is this due to his superior power in the force? Probably, but then the same can be said about Vader's many victories as well. I WOULD say Kas'im is more technically skilled then all the opponents you mentioned but then you have to cross compare the different opponents and does Kas'im stack up to them as a pure combatant? Probably not. But then to ignore the decades of improvement Bane would have had and just hand wave it to the side seems a little ignorant tbh.
Also I'm sorry to say but Vader didn't beat Starkiller. I have the novel beside me now if you'd like to open up that can of worms. You should know as well as anyone that a voice actor's opinion is not equivalent to fact.
Vader outsparred Galen Marek before he defeated Shaak you know...
( Note: You might want to get your facts straight when bringing up TFU. I'm pretty much a fanboy of that franchise and will call our your BS if you don't have accurate information. )
Also as I said he did not defeat the Starkiller clone.
Ben Kenobi? Really? Old Ben had physically deteriorated rapidly and not sparred or fought with anyone for over a decade by the time he fought Vader.
And getting his guard broken through multiple times in that situation not to mention having his guard pierced by singular opponents in multiple instances.
I'd like some evidence for Vader having mastered all 7 forms.
