Constantine Vs Odin

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Odin is surely craftier than that.

So here is the scene where he fools Darkseid (who was multiversal here):
http://imgur.com/1On0vyz
http://imgur.com/zYgsgJn
http://imgur.com/lk2UY8Y
http://imgur.com/jqNImGQ

Then Constantine falls from space to Earth, having been swatted there by Darkseid. And lives.

Traps Zauriel:
http://imgur.com/XHnpDY1

Impressive? This is what Zauriel did to the Phantom Stranger:

John has trapped and banished the Phantom Stranger himself:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/113883/3149058-phantomtrap1.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/113883/3149064-phantombanish1.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
You know the answer to that, hehe.

But that is not the nature of the turnabout spell.

It doesn't matter what the power level of the person is...because the whole point is that it whatever injury John gets, Odin will get.

So if Living Tribunal tried to attack John with that spell on..what would happen?

And as we have seen, due to the nature of magic, the wording is very important. If the spell says only the worthy may lift Mjolnir, it doesn't matter how powerful the spellcaster - only the worthy may lift it. Full stop.

Couldn't Odin just negate the spell because..well, he's Odin? But seriously, how does Odin not have a huge cache of magic shit to draw from, plus his own power? This is prep we are talking about.

It just seems to me both of them would have powerful magic items to draw upon, the only difference being one of them is a skyfather level being even without the magic items.

Originally posted by Surtur
So if Living Tribunal tried to attack John with that spell on..what would happen?

Couldn't Odin just negate the spell because..well, he's Odin?

Again couldn't Constantine negate the spell because well..., he's Constantine?

That isn't the best argument to propagate because you haven't really given any evidence to support it. I can just say the same thing and it doesn't make either of us right without evidence.

See my edit, I wasn't being really serious with that, but the Phantom Stranger thing seems to be one sided prep.

I mean, I'm not disagreeing with you that cosmic beings have underestimated John and been owned.

Johnny Boy summons some space ants.

DS get some bigger scans I cant see shit they are so small.

Originally posted by Surtur
See my edit, I wasn't being really serious with that, but the Phantom Stranger thing seems to be one sided prep.

I mean, I'm not disagreeing with you that cosmic beings have underestimated John and been owned.

Ah right my bad then never saw that mate.

The thing is Odin is a Skyfather in power and probably has a nice attache to boot. But so does Constantine. And I just think Constantine can tip the scales.

Originally posted by Surtur
So if Living Tribunal tried to attack John with that spell on..what would happen?

Couldn't Odin just negate the spell because..well, he's Odin? But seriously, how does Odin not have a huge cache of magic shit to draw from, plus his own power? This is prep we are talking about.

It just seems to me both of them would have powerful magic items to draw upon, the only difference being one of them is a skyfather level being even without the magic items.

Odin could. If he knew about it.

Maybe. We all saw what happened when he tried to negate his own spell with Mjolnir, lol.

Well, we all know in this thread what John can do with prep.

What would Odin do with prep?

If they both have insanely powerful artifacts to draw upon, but one of them is also way way more naturally powerful..why wouldn't that person win?

A lot of the feats seem John being able to momentarily do something. Like with fooling Darkseid and his "18" divine senses. That is kept up for a very short time until Darkseid just swats him aside and leaves. Either he temporarily fights off a powerful being or he takes advantage of one sided prep to trap one.

I guess I could be wrong and Asgard just has shitty magic items? But this is the place where things like the Asgardian Destroyer came from.

Surely with prep Odin rounds up some dwarves and shit and they..do stuff? With magic? They magic-up some stuff lol. Isn't that who builds their magic stuff though?

Originally posted by Surtur
If they both have insanely powerful artifacts to draw upon, but one of them is also way way more naturally powerful..why wouldn't that person win?

A lot of the feats seem John being able to momentarily do something. Like with fooling Darkseid and his "18" divine senses. That is kept up for a very short time until Darkseid just swats him aside and leaves. Either he temporarily fights off a powerful being or he takes advantage of one sided prep to trap one.

Erm, no - the Dolus spell was still in effect. Darkseid swatted him aside because he had no more need for him, believing (mistakenly) that he had already vaped Earth.

There was nothing temporary about it. DS left because, according to all his senses, the Earth was gone.

As for your first point - because in a prep war, it is down to cunning and trickery as well.

Not just showing up on the battlefied with the biggest gun you can get your hands on.

EDIT: Shit that was the movie universe.

I'm sure it's about cunning too, but I'm sure there are lots of items.

Originally posted by Surtur
But what about this:

http://marvel-movies.wikia.com/wiki/Odin's_Trophy_Room

Oh yes, I am not saying Odin has nothing to bring to the fight.

Or that it is an autowin because lulz, Constantine finds a way.

But in a prep war against a human magician? Even with prior knowledge, you think Odin will come out clad in the Destroyer Armour, wielding the Twilight Sword and Casket against a mere human?

If he knows the human fought off a multiversal being? Yes.

Originally posted by Surtur
If he knows the human fought off a multiversal being? Yes.

So, no lol.

Nobody knows John did it.

Basic Knowledge
Each side receives basic knowledge of the other. A good measure of this would be what the general population of the character's homeworld knows. For example, that Superman has a weakness to Kryptonite is general knowledge, but that he's Clark Kent is not.

Nobody knows who John is, much less that he fooled Darkseid.

Thanks to Broxton, am pretty sure Asgardians are well known. Even if not, the fact that he's fighting Odin (who's pretty famous in Norse mythology) would be a major advantage for John.

That doesn't make sense to me though. I mean obviously I understand John isn't very well known..but then that really just seems like basic knowledge more favors well known characters.

Like some characters are literally known by..not a single person. So the basic knowledge of them would be..nothing at all. But then what is the point of basic knowledge in the first place then?

Originally posted by Surtur
That doesn't make sense to me though. I mean obviously I understand John isn't very well known..but then that really just seems like basic knowledge more favors well known characters.

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Reed Richards, Doom etc wouldn't be underestimated. Zatanna, Constantine would be.

Hulk, Superman, Flash, WW would be well known, as well as their weaknesses.

Edit: the point is to bring their characters into play, rather than just relying on powersets.

Someone like Batman, or the Punisher, would be ultra paranoid, and even if they encounter a very little known foe, would still come loaded for bear.

Someone like Odin, who is arrogant and used to being top dog...would do less in his prep.

So we at least agree that Odin could indeed win this fight, he just won't because he underestimates John.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
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Reed Richards, Doom etc wouldn't be underestimated. Zatanna, Constantine would be.

Hulk, Superman, Flash, WW would be well known, as well as their weaknesses.

Edit: the point is to bring their characters into play, rather than just relying on powersets.

Someone like Batman, or the Punisher, would be ultra paranoid, and even if they encounter a very little known foe, would still come loaded for bear.

Someone like Odin, who is arrogant and used to being top dog...would do less in his prep.

If Odin brings his Machine Gun it's all bets off.

Originally posted by Surtur
So we at least agree that Odin could indeed win this fight, he just won't because he underestimates John.

Oh yes.

Like I said, Odin is still top dog. No autowin just because its Constantine.

But he thrives on being underestimated.

constantine will trick him and the end. Its just another big guy who wants a piece of concake.

It still basically seems to be "he'll trick him cuz he's Constantine".