Karness Muur vs Darth Nihilus

Fight takes place on Had Abbadon.

Round 1: No Drain or Dark Transfer.

Round 2: Unrestricted.

1. Nihilus
2. Nihilus

It's not much of question here 👆

Any reasons?

Severing Kreia with a gesture, instantly incapacitating Meetra Surik and Visas Marr, and draining the life of an entire planet of Force-sensitives including the Jedi Council strikes me as beyond Muur.

I wasn't aware of any gesture, actually. And it's more impressive for him to Sever Kreia without needing to gesture, though Sion aided him as well.

Incap'ing Meetra and Visas is beyond Muur? I doubt it. A Muur who was wrestling with Celeste Morne for control over her body managed to use a Maelstrom that sent Krayt over the cliff to his near-death, almost killed Azelyn Rae, and sent Darths Talon, Maladi and Stryfe into bacta tanks just because they stood in the vicinity of the Maelstrom.

For his Drain feat, well, that happened in a medium where the likes of Muur would be at least a match for Nihilus. Avellone's take on things has to be factored him somewhat, at least.

I'll have to recheck the game files if Darth Sion also contributed to the severing. The KotORCG is inconsistent, claiming her powers were drained when they visibly weren't. I'm on my phone at the moment so I'll get back to you in an hour.

Fair enough.

I'm not sure it works like that, lol. If we begin to assume how powerful different characters would be under different authors, things would get messy. Stick to what we have. It is worth noting, however, that Muur viewed the Star Map as his main source of power, and yet was still affected by its energies, as per Ajunta Pall. The effects of the actual Star Forge, which is similar in nature to Darth Nihilus based on Bastila Shan's description of it, would probably destroy him.

I never really liked Nihilus, all he can do is force drain and everyone says he so damn powerful. He drained 100 Jedi but Vitiate drained 8000 sith for Christ sake. Muur wouldn't really know what to do against Nihilus though so he most likely loses.

He's shown so many more powers than just drain.

The notion he can only drain is, I assume, a YT myth.

BTW, Revan vs Dooku is still on the table.

I still reckon Dooku takes Revan (In combat anyway). Dooku is one tier down in terms of combative force powers but is a tier or two up in Sabers. IMO

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I'll have to recheck the game files if Darth Sion also contributed to the severing. The KotORCG is inconsistent, claiming her powers were drained when they visibly weren't. I'm on my phone at the moment so I'll get back to you in an hour.

Fair enough.

I'm not sure it works like that, lol. If we begin to assume how powerful different characters would be under different authors, things would get messy. Stick to what we have. It is worth noting, however, that Muur viewed the Star Map as his main source of power, and yet was still affected by its energies, as per Ajunta Pall. The effects of the actual Star Forge, which is similar in nature to Darth Nihilus based on Bastila Shan's description of it, would probably destroy him.

1. Does a source state that Nihilus was exclusively the one who stripped Kreia of the Force? Otherwise, it still stands to reason that Sion contributed, especially since Sever Force doesn't have an in-game animation.

2. Alright.

3. Well, Ragnos/Pall etc. are supposed to be Nihilus' betters. Muur shouldn't be far off from either. The Star Map stuff seems to be related to character as much as it is to power.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
1. Nihilus
2. Nihilus

Muur I consider to be around Nadds level and both above Sadow but not by a lot. Nihilus in his prime would have rivaled the Ancient Sith according to Traya and she did mention Nadd and Sadow so yeah. Muur by extension should be around their level. But I think Nihilus could win cause of his Drain being really hax.

There's a round without Drain...

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
I still reckon Dooku takes Revan (In combat anyway). Dooku is one tier down in terms of combative force powers but is a tier or two up in Sabers. IMO

Dooku could defeat Darth Revan depending on starting conditions, I don't think he can beat KotOR + Revan IMHO.

Anyway Nihilus wins.

Muur wins, tbh.

Nihilus has much better feats, and Murr doesn't really have anything beyond being above Vong Krayt and implied to be above pre-prime Vader, but I'm open to having my mind changed.

Nihilus is at best considered to potentially rival the ancient Sith. I'd rather give Muur the benefit of the doubt, especially given his Krayt feat.