Originally posted by Zack M
Ray Palmer solved a universal destroying event, Niles Caulder created a being so powerful that they were throwing his victims into our reality, Lex Luthor stole the powers of a cosmic/god like being that got the notice of Death of the Endless, etc...They all have their uber feats. Didn't even include guys like Ultra-Humanite, Dr. Sivana, TO Morrow, etc...
When did lex do that
Originally posted by SquallXNah, remember that time Darkseid and his tech couldn't figure out a way to get a brainless brick off his planet.
How are the New Gods overrated? It's actually the opposite really. The New Gods if ever written to there true potentials are beast with few beings been able to stop them.
Originally posted by Sin I AMAction Comics #899-900.
When did lex do that
Via significant prep, he was able to absorb the Zone Child's [nigh-infinite] power.
Originally posted by DigiI know nothing of the Time Lords... Literally nothing at all.
Debatable, imo. It gets to be tough splitting hairs once you get into universal/multiversal-level tech.
What are the feats of their high-end tech? It must be uber as phuck if you're putting them on par with Monitors.
Originally posted by quanchi112Even you've got to admit that New God tech has been written extremely uber ever since Final Crisis.
Nah, remember that time Darkseid and his tech couldn't figure out a way to get a brainless brick off his planet.
Hell, the DCnU(and Morrison, obviously) has given the New Gods their biggest push... Like ever.
Originally posted by Galan007
Action Comics #899-900.Via significant prep, he was able to absorb the Zone Child's [nigh-infinite] power.
I know nothing of the Time Lords... Literally nothing at all.
What are the feats of their high-end tech? It must be uber as phuck if you're putting them on par with Monitors.
Even you've got to admit that New God tech has been written extremely uber ever since Final Crisis.
Hell, the DCnU(and Morrison, obviously) has given the New Gods their biggest push... Like ever.
Thx galan
Originally posted by Galan007
I know nothing of the Time Lords... Literally nothing at all.What are the feats of their high-end tech? It must be uber as phuck if you're putting them on par with Monitors.
So, for a reference point, the Doctor's time machine (TARDIS) is an "outdated" model, and it alone possesses a couple of universal-level feats. Accessing its core and temporarily taking the full nature of it into herself, one of the Doctor's companions became an omniscient reality warper capable of viewing and manipulating all of time and space.
The TARDIS also self-destructed in a way that destroyed the entire universe, but simultaneously recreated it from scratch bc the Doctor was able to save some kind of universal signature which the explosion spread out (it was a weird arc).
The Time Lords also reportedly are responsible for the creation of black holes in their universe, are able to travel between dimensions without much trouble (the Doctor alone couldn't do this, but the Time Lords' collective tech made it possible).
Their time machines have also been rigged to permit paradoxes in the timeline. E.g. killing your own mother, but it doesn't simultaneously kill you. This allowed the last beings in the universe to go back in time and invade the past without consequence.
The Doctor's TARDIS (again, one in a fleet of presumably millions), also "towed" an inhabited planet through space, which means it has a planetary-level tractor beam that can also apparently keep an atmospheric shell intact while traveling at superluminal speeds. As further proof of concept, the Time Lords have rearranged entire galaxies using similar tech. It was sort of a magnetic cannon (think Star Wars Centerpoint Station for a reference).
Then there's the Matrix (which the movies may have borrowed from slightly). It's a database in its most simplistic form, but contains the biological signatures and memories of the Time Lords, and also has access to input from every TARDIS in the "fleet." This combined "time data" allows it to literally predict the future. It can also act as a virtual reality simulation because it's advanced enough to simulate life and basically has entire people downloaded into its memory. In more recent arcs, it's been used to download and "edit" people before re-uploading them into a new host body.
And the most classic Time Lord tech is the "bigger on the inside" schtick, allowing them to house entire civilizations in a backpack, for example. We never get a complete explanation of this - they like keeping it a mystery - but it's not shrinking tech and there appears to be no practical limit to how much space they can store in a smaller space.
A few others that I know of but not the specifics (many because they're from the older 1960s/70s stuff):
- "The Moment," which is a sentient weapon created by the TLs capable of instantly wiping out at least galaxies.
- Hand of Omega - could force a star to go supernova.
- The Eye of Harmony - a black hole singularity that is contained by their tech and used to access the timestream...there's a master one on the home planet, and also one in each TARDIS.
- Dematerialization Gun - an old plot device from like the 60s, it would retcon you from time.
- The Glove of Rassilon - An offshoot of the demat gun, when worn this can wipe people from history with a thought. Rassilon is an historically badass Time Lord and would use it to correct alterations to the timeline. Also more recently reverted the entire human race at once (they had been biologically altered to be the same person).
- As, well, lords of time, they can also put individuals all the way up to planets in a time loop or time lock, essentially cutting them off from existence outside a specific pocket of time. They've done similar things with pocket dimensions.
Those are off the top of my head with a little help from the Wiki to fill in the details. The Doctor's a walking tech plot device, at least on par with Reed in Marvel. And they have to keep the Time Lords as a whole ominous, so there isn't much they haven't done.
Doctor Who rarely goes multiversal, so there's the potential Achilles heel. But he's thwarted at least 1-2 threats that were multiversal in scope, and some of the above tech/weaponry/manipulation could pretty conceivably apply to a multiversal level, especially given the fact that they deal in pocket dimensions and the like on the regular.
When Tardis exploded, it destroyed ALL reality. Every single universe. And restored it using Pandorica.
Also Donna saved entire multiverse when Davros threatened to explode his reality bomb. That's one of my favorite villain speeches in any medium.
Davros : Electrical energy, Miss Tyler. Every atom in existence is bound by an electrical field. The reality bomb cancels it out, structure falls apart. That test was focused on the prisoners alone. Full transmission will dissolve every form of matter.
Rose Tyler: The stars are going out...
The Doctor : The 27 planets... they become one vast transmitter, blasting that wavelength...
Davros : Across the entire universe, never stopping, never faltering, never fading. People and planets and stars will become dust. And the dust will become atoms and the atoms will become... nothing. And the wavelength will continue, breaking through the rift at the heart of the Medusa Cascade into every dimension, every parallel, every single corner of creation. *This* is my ultimate victory, Doctor! The destruction of reality *itself*!
And it was actually destroying every single universe as Rose was hopping through alternate universes while they got destroyed.
Originally posted by abhilegend
When Tardis exploded, it destroyed ALL reality. Every single universe. And restored it using Pandorica.
I don't remember the exact wording enough to corroborate or refute, but which line refers to multiple realities in that arc?
And the Pandorica itself wasn't the vessel iirc, but rather that it was such a perfect prison that it trapped the information from the universe inside it (the universe's DNA, for lack of a better term) that was necessary to recreate it.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Also Donna saved entire multiverse when Davros threatened to explode his reality bomb. That's one of my favorite villain speeches in any medium.
That was one of the multiversal events I referenced. Not Time Lord tech, though, so it's not much use in this thread. She just managed to hack it, so to speak, and reverse it.
Originally posted by Raisen
Man, I really trolled a lot of emotions on this thread
*pats on head*
Originally posted by DigiThanks for this detailed response. Much appreciated. 👆
So, for a reference point, the Doctor's time machine (TARDIS) is an "outdated" model, and it alone possesses a couple of universal-level feats. Accessing its core and temporarily taking the full nature of it into herself, one of the Doctor's companions became an omniscient reality warper capable of viewing and manipulating all of time and space.The TARDIS also self-destructed in a way that destroyed the entire universe, but simultaneously recreated it from scratch bc the Doctor was able to save some kind of universal signature which the explosion spread out (it was a weird arc).
The Time Lords also reportedly are responsible for the creation of black holes in their universe, are able to travel between dimensions without much trouble (the Doctor alone couldn't do this, but the Time Lords' collective tech made it possible).
Their time machines have also been rigged to permit paradoxes in the timeline. E.g. killing your own mother, but it doesn't simultaneously kill you. This allowed the last beings in the universe to go back in time and invade the past without consequence.
The Doctor's TARDIS (again, one in a fleet of presumably millions), also "towed" an inhabited planet through space, which means it has a planetary-level tractor beam that can also apparently keep an atmospheric shell intact while traveling at superluminal speeds. As further proof of concept, the Time Lords have rearranged entire galaxies using similar tech. It was sort of a magnetic cannon (think Star Wars Centerpoint Station for a reference).
Then there's the Matrix (which the movies may have borrowed from slightly). It's a database in its most simplistic form, but contains the biological signatures and memories of the Time Lords, and also has access to input from every TARDIS in the "fleet." This combined "time data" allows it to literally predict the future. It can also act as a virtual reality simulation because it's advanced enough to simulate life and basically has entire people downloaded into its memory. In more recent arcs, it's been used to download and "edit" people before re-uploading them into a new host body.
And the most classic Time Lord tech is the "bigger on the inside" schtick, allowing them to house entire civilizations in a backpack, for example. We never get a complete explanation of this - they like keeping it a mystery - but it's not shrinking tech and there appears to be no practical limit to how much space they can store in a smaller space.
A few others that I know of but not the specifics (many because they're from the older 1960s/70s stuff):
- "The Moment," which is a sentient weapon created by the TLs capable of instantly wiping out at least galaxies.
- Hand of Omega - could force a star to go supernova.
- The Eye of Harmony - a black hole singularity that is contained by their tech and used to access the timestream...there's a master one on the home planet, and also one in each TARDIS.
- Dematerialization Gun - an old plot device from like the 60s, it would retcon you from time.
- The Glove of Rassilon - An offshoot of the demat gun, when worn this can wipe people from history with a thought. Rassilon is an historically badass Time Lord and would use it to correct alterations to the timeline. Also more recently reverted the entire human race at once (they had been biologically altered to be the same person).
- As, well, lords of time, they can also put individuals all the way up to planets in a time loop or time lock, essentially cutting them off from existence outside a specific pocket of time. They've done similar things with pocket dimensions.Those are off the top of my head with a little help from the Wiki to fill in the details. The Doctor's a walking tech plot device, at least on par with Reed in Marvel. And they have to keep the Time Lords as a whole ominous, so there isn't much they haven't done.
Doctor Who rarely goes multiversal, so there's the potential Achilles heel. But he's thwarted at least 1-2 threats that were multiversal in scope, and some of the above tech/weaponry/manipulation could pretty conceivably apply to a multiversal level, especially given the fact that they deal in pocket dimensions and the like on the regular.
Based on this, it would definitely seem that Time Lord-tech is on par with Monitor-tech. Like you said, though: it's splitting hairs at these levels.
For a point of reference, though, here are the specs on some of the Monitors' tech:
Powered by baby universes... Possess 'bombs' that can wipe out(ie. "sterilize"😉 universes... Generate singularities just to keep certain materials in check... Operate faster than thought. Etc.
*And keep in mind: that's just their nanotechnology.
Then of course you have their standard ships, like the Ultima Thule, which are capable of traversing The Bleed:
http://i.imgur.com/vnJiv3k.jpg
The Thule also possesses infinite memory capacity, which enabled it to instantly download... Infinity(ie. the Book of Limbo):
http://i.imgur.com/KI8ppoE.jpg
Their tech/power was used to reconstruct universe-51, by using pieces of other times and places. They also corrected all time anomalies associated with the restructuring of this reality:
http://i.imgur.com/SSUdvaU.jpg
Even some of the Monitors' personal tech is ridiculously uber. Zillo Valla, for example, had a "Chrono Paralyzer", which can freeze time across entire universes... And it was about the size of a watch, lol:
http://i.imgur.com/Tnx08Cz.jpg
*That is how/why ALL the events of Superman Beyond were able to take place in between ONE of Lois' heartbeats.
Nix's Rubik's Cube was basically the gateway of all gateways. When solved in 17 moves or less(an impossibility by real-world standards, btw), it gave The Gentry uninhibited access to the Orrery/multiverse:
http://i.imgur.com/ZNLUPf8.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/KE31VJ6.jpg
Their personal shields can tank universe-busting explosions at ground zero:
http://i.imgur.com/HML6gPO.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/wrof7ot.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Vaw35iR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/43lfSPO.jpg
And of course, they built the mother of all haxx tech: Thought-Robot -- designed/created by Monitor Dax Novu:
http://i.imgur.com/2mPWzGF.jpg
Like the Time Lords, their tech is retardedly haxx. 👆
Yeah, I'm not going to jump into a debate against that kind of tech. The Thought Robot and Gentry portal give the Monitors some fourth-wall potential that might make them unassailable by conventional means. "Meta characters" are notoriously tough to debate against. Otherwise, there are some similar-sounding feats among their canon. I guess the other thing in the Time Lord cupboard is that they're technically isolationists. Yeah, there's a weapon list above, but most are from when war was brought to them and they had no choice. Even the Doctor has like a 50:1 ratio of thwarting others' plans compared to making his own. His tech creation feats are absurd, and they happen extremely rarely compared to his total appearances. So most of the TLs appearances are ironically of them sitting on their asses. Properly motivated, I honestly have no doubt they could wipe multiverses from existence, or rewrite them to their whim, without much trouble. So, imo, Monitors and TLs are leading the pack in this thread, at least among those that have been named and discussed, with the caveats of 4th wall stuff being beyond what we've seen from the TLs, and the 5D realm, which I honestly don't know much about but I assume is above pretty much anything mentioned so far.
Originally posted by Digi
I don't remember the exact wording enough to corroborate or refute, but which line refers to multiple realities in that arc?And the Pandorica itself wasn't the vessel iirc, but rather that it was such a perfect prison that it trapped the information from the universe inside it (the universe's DNA, for lack of a better term) that was necessary to recreate it.
That was one of the multiversal events I referenced. Not Time Lord tech, though, so it's not much use in this thread. She just managed to hack it, so to speak, and reverse it.
*pats on head*
And yet the Osirans were above the Timelords.
Originally posted by Truthsayer
And yet the Osirans were above the Timelords.
Had to check their Wiki. I'm not as familiar with the older stuff sometimes. It sounds like they're lacking in overall feats, even if they have some good head-to-head showings vs. Time Lord tech. But the sheer volume of TL technology that we've seen still puts them a leg up.
Originally posted by Digi
I don't remember the exact wording enough to corroborate or refute, but which line refers to multiple realities in that arc?
Daleks and Cybermen mention that every reality and universe is dying.
And the Pandorica itself wasn't the vessel iirc, but rather that it was such a perfect prison that it trapped the information from the universe inside it (the universe's DNA, for lack of a better term) that was necessary to recreate it.
I know.
👆
That was one of the multiversal events I referenced. Not Time Lord tech, though, so it's not much use in this thread. She just managed to hack it, so to speak, and reverse it.
*pats on head*
That's not absurd for ya?
