Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Surik's role was to counterbalance Vitiate's Force drain, not directly assist in the mental war.Vitiate as well had "unlimited" reserves to draw off of because he was draining Revan simultaneously the entire time as well.
It counterbalanced, and thus the point is mute.
It was centuries of telepathic probing and attacking from seven of the greatest Sith sorcerers in history. 👆
It still doesn't matter. What's impressive is that Revan fended off the Emperor and the Dread Masters, not that he did so for centuries, which is exclusively a result of him being able to draw upon Surik's Ghost (however Vitiate sustained himself for centuries is irrelevant, we're only discussing Revan).
Also, the novel suggests that it's thanks to Surik's Ghost that Revan could do anything more than just hold the Emperor at bay - the Dread Masters hadn't even been involved yet.
Anyway, the Dread Masters count as one - as you've often told me before.
What? But he did do it for centuries. The fact he had additional resources to draw upon his mute when his attackers also did. You forget that the war wasn't just one way. Revan was also telepathically influencing Vitiate and forcing him to postpone and end galactic wars. Due to both Vitiate and Revan draining, their powers should have been counterbalanced and ended up with being around their normal levels for the entire conflict. The fact their command of the Force stayed roughly the same does not mean Revan's willpower did. You need more than an immense command of the Force to have willpower on Revan's scale. Revan, via willpower, held back the telepathic attacks of Vitiate and the Dread Masters for centuries. That is a fact. Writing that off is laughable, pathetic, and worthy of an heroing. The entire war was based on time. Toward the end of the conflict, Revan's strength finally began to waver, and Vitiate launched the war. In a final effort of will, Revan ended the war via the Treaty of Coruscant. Thus, time was clearly a major player in there. It took three-centuries for Vitiate to finally summon the will to go on with his plans - and even that was temporarily stopped by Revan, saving the Republic in the process. And in regard to the effects it had on Revan, Revan was affected gradually: his hatred toward the Emperor intensified throughout the conflict.
Also, the novel suggests that it's thanks to Surik's Ghost that Revan could do anything more than just hold the Emperor at bay - the Dread Masters hadn't even been involved yet.
1. No, via willpower, he held them off. By feeding off Surik's Ghost, he held them off for centuries. We're factoring in Drain.
2. I was under the impression that we're including that as well, since people seem to mention Revan being Drained when they talk about this feat?
I'm not denying that it's impressive, obviously. Nobody's writing that off.
I don't think Revan specifically held off the invasion or suppressed Vitiates will, I think Vitiate delayed that for other reasons. Could be wrong tho.
Also it should be noted that Vitiate influenced Revan as well by turning him insane and bloodthirsty. He kind of succeeded in turning him to the darkside.
Originally posted by SunRazer
1. No, via willpower, he held them off. By feeding off Surik's Ghost, he held them off for centuries. We're factoring in Drain.
Originally posted by SunRazer
2. I was under the impression that we're including that as well, since people seem to mention Revan being Drained when they talk about this feat?
Originally posted by Nephthys
I don't think Revan specifically held off the invasion or suppressed Vitiates will, I think Vitiate delayed that for other reasons. Could be wrong tho.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Then you have to factor in the drain on both sides, and recognize Revan feeding off Surik's ghost was relevant to a completely different spectrum of the fight than the telepathy war, which is what is relevant to the topic at hand.Tell me how the hell using Force drain (Revan and Vitiate both) has any relevancy to the topic at hand. It doesn't. They were counterbalanced and so the point was mute.
Alright, I'll let it go. Though I recall people touting Revan resisting both the Emperor and his Dread Masters for centuries even whilst being Drained, which is giving him a bit too much credit - but otherwise, fair enough.