Originally posted by DarthAnt66
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ESOrF_u1hg&t=0m42svs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ESOrF_u1hg&t=2m01s
mmm
Plo > Agen, and the OP quite clearly indicates Vapaad's force advantage is out of the question. Not to mention Mace has morals on so won't even be using Juyo.
That's like me quoting Mace needing "all of his skills" to beat someone Plo slaughtered with a broken arm and acting like its a viable argument, lmao.
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
He would also be hindered in his mobility, agility,... Because there is basically dead weight hanging on his chest.
Plo isn't even an agile fighter, nor a particularly mobile one. The best it would do is somewhat limit his defensive range...
Anyways, Mace obviously wins.
Originally posted by MythLord
Plo isn't even an agile fighter, nor a particularly mobile one. The best it would do is somewhat limit his defensive range...Anyways, Mace obviously wins.
So? He's no Ahsoka in terms of agility but that doesn't exclude the fact that he is hindered by it. Not to mention that any movement at all, mainly those which use the upper torso, is hindered by his broken arms since it's deadweight atrached to his torso.
I'm kind of getting tired with all those excuses, Ventress herself notes that it's hindering him, that's the end of it.
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
So? He's no Ahsoka in terms of agility but that doesn't exclude the fact that he is hindered by it. Not to mention that any movement at all, mainly those which use the upper torso, is hindered by his broken arms since it's deadweight atrached to his torso.I'm kind of getting tired with all those excuses, Ventress herself notes that it's hindering him, that's the end of it.
He rarely even uses it, and didn't even use it in the fight. So the fact that it hinders his agility is "meh".
How is his upper-torso movement hindered? As someone who has broken an arm and a leg -- plus studies the human anatomy on a daily basis -- I can assure you that simply sporting a broken arm doesn't mean your manuverability would be drastically hindered.
Was Plo hindered in the fight? Sure, nobody's denying it... Would the outcome of the fight had been much different? No, not really. He still would've been driven back by Asajj.
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Ventress was beating Plo? You mean when he threw her to the other side of the room or when he disarmed her?
I meant lightsaber combat. Plo landing an inconsequential Push doesn't affect that.
Depriving her of just one blade obviously didn't end the fight, did it? After being disarmed was when Ventress gained the edge by forcing Plo against the railing - he had to resort to throwing the detonator.
Originally posted by SunRazer
Mace SLAUGHTERHOUSE, by the way. He curbed Ventress, who was beating Plo.
Thinking a Mace who's holding back and trying not to kill Plo, with no use of the force bar augmentation could "slaughter" Koon is clinically retarded, TBH.
He has literally no answer to Electric Judgement or Telekinesis except to try and avoid it, he can't go on his usual brutal offensive which is what Mace excels at, and will be pretty diminished by his attempts at disarming his opponent instead of killing him.
Yoda couldn't "slaughter" Dooku for the same reason, tbh.
Allright let's begin, I'll start with responding to Wollf. Plo's left arm is attached to his torso isn't it? So when you move, or use, your torso this arm is directly or indirectly going to move with it, mostly the shoulder/upper arm, so this movement is hindered because Plo's supporting a broken arm (he can't use that arm or shoulder). Try to swing a stick with your right arm and you'll see that your left shoulder/upper arm is at least partly going to move to, it makes your swing more fluent then if the movement of this other arm is limited.
Regarding his fight with Asajj: First we see Ventress engage Plo in a lightsaber duel trading some blows with Plo even in one scane chasing after her. Then Ventress kicks Plo on his broken arm with him respond by throwing her across the 'room' (or cave whatever you want to name it). So far so good right? In the next scan we see Plo disarming Ventress after apparently driving her back on to the bridge. Then we see Ventress push Plo against the railing when engaging in a blade lock with Plo then ending the fight by pushing away the detonator when Ventress attempts to use it.
That's the fight in it's entirety, you put so much stress on Ventress having a (small) advanting near the end when they engage in a blade lock but completely ignore the rest of the fight, where Plo was seen to be the one chasing down Ventress and even disarming her. That it didn't end the fight hardly matters, Ventress has shown to be able to duel with one blade before but that doesn't mean you can utterly neglect Plo disarming her in the first place. Let me put forward a comparable fight in Rebels, Ahsoka vs Darth Vader where almost the entire board agrees that Vader was solidly the better fighter. In that fight we see how Vader pushes back Ashoka and eventually throws her off the temple, hereby ending the fight. When we compare that to Plo's fight against Ventress there are quite a bit of similarities. Both Ventress's and Ahsoka's fighting style are build around mobility and agility contrary to Vader's and Plo's more stationary and stronger Form V, that's why this comparison is usefull in the first place. Next we see that both Vader & Plo push back their opponent (Ahsoka & Ventress) for the majority of the fight while both of them also landed a Force hit on the other fighter (if you would put Plo & Ventress on that temple the latter would also be thrown off by Plo's push). The only difference is that Ahsoka also pushed Vader, something Ventress actually didn't which seems a good point for Plo, and that Vader didn't disarm Ahsoka, again a good point for Plo, while Ventress did land a kick and had an advantage during the blade lock.
In the end almost all of the good points are going to Plo, like Vader in the other fight, yet the general conclusion of most debaters here (or on CV) is the complete opposite from each other. So why is that? There are a few differences between both fights, Ventress having an edge in the blade lock for example, but those are easily compensated by the 'extra' edges Plo had, e.g. Plo disarming Ventress or Plo being injured in the first place. So if you look at the entire fight in the comic alone, Plo's the one that comes out best, if you look at another fight to compare it to (Ahsoka vs Vader) then again Plo's coming out as the best of the two fighters over the entire fight.
In general I find it quite odd that you would completely ignore the entire context of Plo's fight and look only at the end of it.