The war heroes vs. Ancient Sith

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
^ To an extent and its circumstantial. You can't just say Mace defeated Sidious therefore he can defeat any lesser Sith :/

I can say that a person who has the means to mitigate or nullify outright the Force power of the strongest Sith ever in Palpatine has the means to do the same against Sith with less power.

Does that mean Mace necessarily wins all his battles against Sith? Not quite.

It isn't about raw power, Gid. 😬

Originally posted by AncientPower
They aren't conventional Force attacks though, this is thirty minute prepared sorcery on a dark side nexus, the attack probably isn't even a direct damage assault.

But neither is Force speed.

It's Sidious' augmentation/fury being used against him in turn, sort of like using an opponent's momentum to drive a victory. Sorcery that can rip your spirit out of your body or dominate your mind with illusions; just isn't going to tick that box.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
We went through this before on CV. Vaapad regurgitated passive Force displays (Force speed, fury, etc.) and direct attacks (lightning) from the most powerful Sith ever. There's little to no reason to believe that it wouldn't do the same for Force attacks from lesser Sith.

There's a far cry between lesser sith (singular), and 5 of the most powerful sorcerers in the mythos. There's virtually no evidence or argument that could be made for Mace getting canned. And that's after some kind of proof that Vaapad has a similar effect on sith sorcery.

Originally posted by AncientPower
It's Sidious' augmentation/fury being used against him in turn, sort of like using an opponent's momentum to drive a victory. Sorcery that can rip your spirit out of your body or dominate your mind with illusions; just isn't going to tick that box.

The metaphysical mumbojumbo of Vaapad is pretty ridiculous: let's not pretend there's a coherent explanation for why and how it regurgitates Sheev's Force speed, which is a directionless, passive use of the Force.

The entire concept is pretty hard to fathom but I see no reason why sorcery would be immune to Vaapad's effects, since Vaapad can effect passive and direct Force displays from the mightiest Sith of all.

You're assuming sith sorcery consisted of the same properties. It's very naive to assume because force attack a and b are stopped, y and z should also be stopped.

Did Mace's Vaapad actually reciprocate Sidious' Force speed? It seems like the huge amount of darkness within Mace was simply channeled through Vaapad, which made him stronger overall (ie. Force augmentation).

Originally posted by SunRazer
Did Mace's Vaapad actually reciprocate Sidious' Force speed? It seems like the huge amount of darkness within Mace was simply channeled through Vaapad, which made him stronger overall (ie. Force augmentation).

I think it was Vaapad's working (own inner darkness + Sidious's darkness) which amplified Mace, didn't Mace & Sidious also look almost invisible to Anakin during that duel according to the novel?

IT DID SAY THAT, BUT ANAKIN NEVER SEES THEM DUEL IN THE MOVIE, THEREFORE THAT QUOTE IS FAKE AND GARBAGE. SORRY.

As Luke said in the RotJ novelization, if something is from the Force, it can be deflected by the Force; he then manages to stop Palpatine's lightning, albeit for a brief instant, despite having never encountered it before or learned tutanimus. There's no reason to think sorcery is an exception.

There is no reason to think it's similar. Bane is able to stop all of Zannah's attacks. Then Zannah uses sith sorcery and he's screwed. Nothing states Vaapad can stop it just because it's using the force.