Jakeem Thunder vs Jenny Quantum

Nay. I think SW was worse

Originally posted by cdtm
Well, it's limited to Jakeem's orders. Mordru beat it, but that could be seen as Jakeem only telling it to banish him into the pen, and it just stood there and let Mordru beat it down.

But as the character developed, it learnes to act on it's own volition (Such as attacking QWSP despite being subservient to him.)

Plus, Day of Vengeance was a pretty bad story in general. I believe it was connected to the terrible Countdown to Final Crisis storyline.

Good post.. I was going to bring up the Mordru incident next but youre spot on. Funny thing is i never considered the genies as on par with the imps. For one their willingly subservient to lesser beings. Two it's like two genies merged into one and when compared to their compatriots like mxy they fall laughably short. Has an imp even bear spectre in canon?

Few things.

1. I would not say that 5d djinn and 5d inps are anywhere near the same.being of the 5th dimension they are all certainly above lower dimensional characters but that doesnt make them equal. We have a lot of species on this earth and ot many are equal.
2. The Thunderbolts limitations ahve always been those of the thinking of the master. Hell every classic (GA) story of JT had him bumbling thru gettinf stomped by guys he should have whipped by just giving the right order to Thunderbolt. Then finishing with him bumbling onto the ri gb t order to gi e and win in a second (which should have happened first panel).
3. In a battle like this one we have to look at the way the character would normally act.
4. IIRC wasnt it stated that in the 5th dimension the Djinn werent limited to masters orders and were actually allowed to operate under independent thought? I vaguely recall somewhere thunderbolt ignoring Jakeem in the 5th dimension.

True. It was established in the golden age that johnny is actually insane. This happened in a story where the JSA went crazy due to brainwave's induced dreams, while johnny on the other hand turned sane. And this is why Johnny couldn't just solve all of JSA's problems. Although, pre-Crisis T-bolt wasn't as powerful as post-Crisis (specifically after he was retconned into being a 5-D being). Pre-Crisis T-bolt was still able to alter reality (in the SA only), and outperform the Spectre on at least one occasion that I recall (in the GA).

T-bolt disobeyed Jakeem's commands (Qwsp was in control of him at the time) in JSA #79-80. It also displayed Qwsp conquering (through Jakeem) the entire 5th dimension somehow, single-handedly.

Anyway, T-bolt's best feats include:

1) Matched Lkz who imprisoned the Spectre.

2) Ultra-humanite in command of t-bolt remade the entire world in his image and imprisoned all the super-heroes, thousands of them including the major ones. Jakeem reversed it all with one single wish.

3) Was stalemating Jakeem (possessed by Qwsp) who conquered the entire 5th dimension.

4) There was a lovecraftian entity called Morgauth which was handling the entire JSA including Spectre and Fate, t-bolt one-shotted it.

Regarding Jenny, she's definitely a reality warper. She's absorbing a universe, created a pocket dimension, and flipping the entire WS reality into a fictional one, she also held her own against the Doctor and was on the same level as her sister who was merging the entire multiverse. Admittedly though some writers did seem to forget she possessed reality warping abilities and portrayed her on a somewhat same level as her previous incarnation aka Jenny Sparks.

Personally, id give t-bolt the win in a raw power match. Unless Jenny plays it smart and severs Jakeem's vocal cords (like Mordru did) or even produce sound waves which will interfere with Jakeem's communication with the t-bolt (this has worked before).

Regarding the power of T-bolt and Lkz, I've always thought this dialogue(coming straight from the Quintessence) was quite telling: