Nick gillard interview

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Has Obi-Wan improved? Anyways Maul at least has improved to going toward Siege of Mandalore and possibly more looking at his potential and superior raw power. So even if TCW Maul is an equal to TCW Obi-Wan, which I disagree with but that's a fight for another day, Maul's at least going to be equal to prime Kenobi and possibly superior to.

By all logical accounts, he would've improved. He seems to have improved more in the three years of the Clone Wars than in the ten years between TPM and AotC.

If you do want some evidence, Obi-Wan's massive improved performance between S6 TCW and the RotS fight against Dooku does suggest quite a growth in skill, yes.

Originally posted by SunRazer
By all logical accounts, he would've improved. He seems to have improved more in the three years of the Clone Wars than in the ten years between TPM and AotC.

If you do want some evidence, Obi-Wan's massive improved performance between S6 TCW and the RotS fight against Dooku does suggest quite a growth in skill, yes.

Don't get me wrong, I agree he improved but I was just suprised by the lack of actual conclusive evidence on that part.

Massive improvement? I even find the duo's performance in S6 better then in RotS, they had Dooku backing down and breathing heavily while Obi-Wan was still unharmed and Anakin wasn't tapping into the Dark Side. Then again Maul would still grow at least equally fast and probably faster looking at his potential, raw power, ...

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Don't get me wrong, I agree he improved but I was just suprised by the lack of actual conclusive evidence on that part.

Massive improvement? I even find the duo's performance in S6 better then in RotS, they had Dooku backing down and breathing heavily while Obi-Wan was still unharmed and Anakin wasn't tapping into the Dark Side. Then again Maul would still grow at least equally fast and probably faster looking at his potential, raw power, ...

There's a lot of things that have a surprising lack conclusive evidence. You have to make your own judgment. I haven't researched Obi-Wan in-depth for a while - such a quote may well exist but without my knowledge or recollection.

Anyways, the S6 performance isn't better at all. Obi-Wan couldn't get close to Dooku without being hit or thrown around. Anakin was being constantly forced back, etc.

Dooku wasn't breathing heavily anywhere. There's even a part in the S6 fight where Dooku surrenders no ground at all against Obi-Wan and Anakin's collective assault, whereas in RotS, their combined assault always forces him back.

SOD Maul should be a match for ROTS Kenobi even in Sabers.

Obi-Wan disarmed and floored a Windu-tier opponent, as a padawan. haermm

^ Is that like the 2nd time you wrote that in the space of a few minutes?

Originally posted by SunRazer
There's a lot of things that have a surprising lack conclusive evidence. You have to make your own judgment. I haven't researched Obi-Wan in-depth for a while - such a quote may well exist but without my knowledge or recollection.

Anyways, the S6 performance isn't better at all. Obi-Wan couldn't get close to Dooku without being hit or thrown around. Anakin was being constantly forced back, etc.

Dooku wasn't breathing heavily anywhere. There's even a part in the S6 fight where Dooku surrenders no ground at all against Obi-Wan and Anakin's collective assault, whereas in RotS, their combined assault always forces him back.

Indeed.

Yes he was, just before the Pykes came into the picture you saw breathing heavily (or close to it). In season 6 Dooku was forced back since the very beginning of the fight and only held his ground when Obi-Wan was balancing on the edge, after that he was again driven back almost immediately. In the end Obi-Wan was still very much conscious in Season 6 after a longer fight alongside an inferior Anakin compared to his performance in RotS.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
SOD Maul should be a match for ROTS Kenobi even in Sabers.

That that's even a question to be honest, Kenobi is probably the only character that can get dominated through the Force half a dozen times and run away from Maul while still people support his superiority.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
That that's even a question to be honest, Kenobi is probably the only character that can get dominated through the Force half a dozen times and run away from Maul while still people support his superiority.

I'd give Maul the definite superiority in TK, but I can see why the idea of Maul ragdolling Kenobi whenever he likes is in dispute tbh.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Indeed.

Yes he was, just before the Pykes came into the picture you saw breathing heavily (or close to it). In season 6 Dooku was forced back since the very beginning of the fight and only held his ground when Obi-Wan was balancing on the edge, after that he was again driven back almost immediately. In the end Obi-Wan was still very much conscious in Season 6 after a longer fight alongside an inferior Anakin compared to his performance in RotS.

I never saw that as breathing heavily. It looks more like recognition that Obi-Wan nearly got his foot.

The part I'm referring to is the part before Dooku kicks Obi-Wan onto the ledge. The three of them fight for a good while without Dooku surrendering any ground. Before that, Dooku was retreating on his own, even when the Jedi weren't attacking him. In RotS, it was always the Jedi actually driving him back - he never retreated of his own accord.

Obi-Wan was only rendered unconscious by Dooku's TK in RotS, which he never brought to bear against him in S6. Invalid comparison.

Originally posted by SunRazer
I never saw that as breathing heavily. It looks more like recognition that Obi-Wan nearly got his foot.

The part I'm referring to is the part before Dooku kicks Obi-Wan onto the ledge. The three of them fight for a good while without Dooku surrendering any ground. Before that, Dooku was retreating on his own, even when the Jedi weren't attacking him. In RotS, it was always the Jedi actually driving him back - he never retreated of his own accord.

Obi-Wan was only rendered unconscious by Dooku's TK in RotS, which he never brought to bear against him in S6. Invalid comparison.

Hmm could also be true I guess.

The duo is attacking Dooku one by one at that point while in RotS they are actually combining their attacks from the moment the fight begins so it's quite logical that Dooku can hold out in S6 but is immediately driven back in RotS. You clearly see how Dooku is retreating the moment Anakin and Obi-Wan 'combine' their attacks in the last part of the S6 fight.

Exactly, you don't know how Obi-Wan would've fared against Dooku had he used his TK in S6 so you can't compare both fights accurately since the circumstances are different.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I'd give Maul the definite superiority in TK, but I can see why the idea of Maul ragdolling Kenobi whenever he likes is in dispute tbh.

Maul's obviously first going to use his lightsaber since he's primarly a warrior but if he has to he definitely can do that, why not? We've seen it in the comic (forgot the name) and we've seen it on Florrum.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Maul's obviously first going to use his lightsaber since he's primarly a warrior but if he has to he definitely can do that, why not? We've seen it in the comic (forgot the name) and we've seen it on Florrum.

It was Sith Hunters.

Problem with using Florrum is that it was mostly a 2 on 1 against Kenobi. You have to give Kenobi some leeway for tiring there.

So Sith Hunters is the only legitimate showing and that's only in Legends now I believe.

But Maul's got better TK showings regardless.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
It was Sith Hunters.

Problem with using Florrum is that it was mostly a 2 on 1 against Kenobi. You have to give Kenobi some leeway for tiring there.

So Sith Hunters is the only legitimate showing and that's only in Legends now I believe.

But Maul's got better TK showings regardless.

Yes there is Florrum where Maul dominated him twice, notable is that kenobi was in a better state than usual (confirmed by Filoni) and there was no indication he was tiring at all.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
and there was no indication he was tiring at all.

It's a reasonable assumption thought that it's much harder to fight off 2 beasts than 1, and expends much more energy.

In any case, it's not like Maul actually defeated Kenobi either time he dominated him with TK on Florrum.

The only time he defeated him with TK was in Sith Hunters (and TPM if you count that).

Originally posted by Darth Thor
It's a reasonable assumption thought that it's much harder to fight off 2 beasts than 1, and expends much more energy.

In any case, it's not like Maul actually defeated Kenobi either time he dominated him with TK on Florrum.

The only time he defeated him with TK was in Sith Hunters (and TPM if you count that).

An assumption without conclusive evidence is hardly noticeable.

He held him in mid-air and slammed him against a wall and afterwards blasts him towards the other side of the cave, I call that pretty decisively.

Yeah, but that's rather one-shotting.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
An assumption without conclusive evidence is hardly noticeable.

Likewise I don't think it's conclusive proof of Maul being able that ragdoll Obi-Wan anytime, when there was clearly a 3rd factor there against Obi-Wan in Savage.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Likewise I don't think it's conclusive proof of Maul being able that ragdoll Obi-Wan anytime, when there was clearly a 3rd factor there against Obi-Wan in Savage.

Who was in both occassions out of the picture, especially the moment he got blasted across the cave.

So, if the difference between level 8 and 9 is the dark side, and dark side is "cheating", is Yoda the only one that reached level 9 in a fair way, and is the most stable lightsaber combatant of all?

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Hmm could also be true I guess.

The duo is attacking Dooku one by one at that point while in RotS they are actually combining their attacks from the moment the fight begins so it's quite logical that Dooku can hold out in S6 but is immediately driven back in RotS. You clearly see how Dooku is retreating the moment Anakin and Obi-Wan 'combine' their attacks in the last part of the S6 fight.

Exactly, you don't know how Obi-Wan would've fared against Dooku had he used his TK in S6 so you can't compare both fights accurately since the circumstances are different.

It's true that they were attacking one at a time in S6, but if we take that deleted portion of the fight just before Dooku Pushes Obi-Wan, you see Obi-Wan attacking Dooku solo briefly, and Dooku still elects to get rid of him through the Force as opposed to throwing him around physically. So there's still the implication that Dooku couldn't easily remove him with physical strikes in RotS, as opposed to S6.

I can compare the fights accurately because I never once compared the part where Dooku used TK to begin with. I was only comparing the lightsaber dueling aspects, obviously.