Originally posted by quanchi112
He was cheapshotted. He was too powerful to be attacked directly. Dying pitifully is Vader hurling a screaming Sidious to his death imo.
Vader would crush kylo or Rey, that’s whySnoke holds him in high esteem 😂
Also how is Snoke being cheap dying via cheap shot any different then Sidious being grabbed FROM BEHIND, by someone with cybernetic arms and thrown down a shaft?
There is no difference.
I don’t think anyone disputes Snokes power, but we do dispute the claims he’s stronger then Sidious. When have you or anyone proven this?
It is kinda different, with Sidious it's at least plausible given the way it's setup. With Snoke....it's kinda lazy, it doesn't help that he says something along the lines of "Kylo cannot betray me! I know his every thought!" Then he doesn't see this and dies. I mean, does Snoke lack peripheral vision too?
Originally posted by DarthPlaguis12Iyo not mine. He used Vader to manipulate or drive Ren into doing what he wanted.
Vader would crush kylo or Rey, that’s whySnoke holds him in high esteem 😂Also how is Snoke being cheap dying via cheap shot any different then Sidious being grabbed FROM BEHIND, by someone with cybernetic arms and thrown down a shaft?
There is no difference.
I don’t think anyone disputes Snokes power, but we do dispute the claims he’s stronger then Sidious. When have you or anyone proven this?
So Snoke being attacked quickly without being aware is fair game but a one handed guy with no lightsaber with time to respond is no bueno. Chuckles.
Common sense, serkis, statements from the film all leading to this conclusion.
Actually Snoke said (in the novels I believe) that Vader led an exemplary life and his only downfall was his sentiment for Luke.
Snoke also wears a black ring found under Vader’s fortress.
Odd you don’t know this for being such a fan boy 🙄 or maybe it’s just that you’re a lame ass troll 😂
Again, how is Sidious being cheap shot vs Snokes cheap shot different? No answer.
Serkis made no mention of Snokes power only resources, if one actors quote is all you’re going with it’s pretty weak proof.
Originally posted by DarthPlaguis12Vader was weak and lost his way due to his son.
Actually Snoke said (in the novels I believe) that Vader led an exemplary life and his only downfall was his sentiment for Luke.Snoke also wears a black ring found under Vader’s fortress.
Odd you don’t know this for being such a fan boy 🙄 or maybe it’s just that you’re a lame ass troll 😂
Again, how is Sidious being cheap shot vs Snokes cheap shot different? No answer.
Serkis made no mention of Snokes power only resources, if one actors quote is all you’re going with it’s pretty weak proof.
I do know it. This is all covered in the Star Wars visual dictionary for the last Jedi. Loved buying it and supporting the film.
Serkis also states Snoke is more powerful than Sidious and Vader. That is relevant to the discussion at hand not his accessories. 😂
When asked if his character is more powerful than Darth Vader and the Emperor, Andy Serkis said, "Oh, without question. He has limitless resources, let's put it that way." The actor's comments, though, can be interpreted as Snoke in a few different ways. The first is that Snoke has a bigger team behind him, which is the least exciting of the options. The more exciting way to look at Serkis' comments is that he may be more powerful in the ways of the Force, which could make for some interesting moments coming our way. Andy Serkis just confirmed once and for all that Snoke is the most powerful Dark Side user we have ever seen on screen.
Mic drop.
That wasn’t my point so why change the subject? Obviously he wasn’t weak or Snoke wouldn’t think of him so highly.
If you know then how do you disagree with Snoke thinking he was a powerful force user?
Again where’s the evidence 🙄 serkis is just a voice actor, there’s nothing to prove Snoke is more powerful then Sidious.
Is that all you have...Andy Serkis said so! 😆
Originally posted by Zenwolf
It is kinda different, with Sidious it's at least plausible given the way it's setup. With Snoke....it's kinda lazy, it doesn't help that he says something along the lines of "Kylo cannot betray me! I know his every thought!" Then he doesn't see this and dies. I mean, does Snoke lack peripheral vision too?
Because he wasnt that powerful in comparison to Kylo.
Thats why Kylo was able to pull it off. And why he would never face Kylo without his guards.
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Because he wasnt that powerful in comparison to Kylo.Thats why Kylo was able to pull it off. And why he would never face Kylo without his guards.
So then Kylo is top dog and not Snoke, so we got that established then. Which means if Kylo is afraid of not being able to be Vader....hm? Still though a little peripheral vision doesn't hurt anyone.
Originally posted by Zenwolf👆
It is kinda different, with Sidious it's at least plausible given the way it's setup. With Snoke....it's kinda lazy, it doesn't help that he says something along the lines of "Kylo cannot betray me! I know his every thought!" Then he doesn't see this and dies. I mean, does Snoke lack peripheral vision too?
In the TLJ novelization, while Snoke was mind-probing Rey, she explicitly noted that Snoke's psionic abilities/TP were vastly more powerful than Kylo's... Then a few minutes later, Snoke is duped by Kylo's inferior psionic abilities? Wtf.
At least when Palpatine was betrayed by Vader, all of his focus was diverted to torturing/killing Luke and not centered around Vader at all. Snoke was literally reading Kylo's f*cking mind, and STILL couldn't see through the fog of his betrayal. Stupid AF.
Originally posted by Zenwolf
So then Kylo is top dog and not Snoke, so we got that established then. Which means if Kylo is afraid of not being able to be Vader....hm? Still though a little peripheral vision doesn't hurt anyone.
Not necessarily saying Kylo > Snoke. Just that the difference clearly wasnt large enough to keep him as his apprentice. The threat level was just too high, and we know with darksiders they will take advantage of that ASAP.
Would be like Palpatine having Windu as an Apprentice. Just wouldnt work.
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Not necessarily saying Kylo > Snoke. Just that the difference clearly wasnt large enough to keep him as his apprentice. The threat level was just too high, and we know with darksiders they will take advantage of that ASAP.Would be like Palpatine having Windu as an Apprentice. Just wouldnt work.
Well according to what Galan said, the gap was big enough.
Rey could feel Snoke in her head, his consciousness a live, hungry thing, carelessly sifting and sorting through what wasn't his, what he had no right to. The Supreme Leader must have taught Kylo this ability, she realized. But he was far more skilled than his apprentice. Rey was unable to push back against him--his mere presence threatened to overwhelm her. And unlike with Kylo, she had no sense of that mind being left open to her. Snoke's presence felt like a pit, empty and cold and dark--as if the dark-side cave beneath Ahch-To had gone on forever.-TLJ
Originally posted by DarthPlaguis12Get off your iPad, ti. Your posts are not quotable. He was weak in the sense he lost his way and came back to the light in the end. Kylo is resisting the urges to the light.
Actually Snoke said (in the novels I believe) that Vader led an exemplary life and his only downfall was his sentiment for Luke.Snoke also wears a black ring found under Vader’s fortress.
Odd you don’t know this for being such a fan boy 🙄 or maybe it’s just that you’re a lame ass troll 😂
Again, how is Sidious being cheap shot vs Snokes cheap shot different? No answer.
Serkis made no mention of Snokes power only resources, if one actors quote is all you’re going with it’s pretty weak proof.
He was a powerful force user just not on Snokes, Lukes, Yodas, or Sidious level.
The films evidence all supports this due to the ease in which he dwarfed Reys power. Luke was fearful of her raw strength. We see Luke was not able to effortlessly put her in her place like Snoke was.
Originally posted by Darth ThorAbsurd. Per the director.
Because he wasnt that powerful in comparison to Kylo.Thats why Kylo was able to pull it off. And why he would never face Kylo without his guards.
In my mind, he walks in there knowing basically that he is going to betray Snoke but he does not know yet exactly what the mechanism is and what his opportunity is going to be. But he’s gone in there with the intent of, whether it is now or whether it is later or whenever it_is,_when he brings Rey in there, he has had that connection with her and what he says in the elevator… from that, in my_head_I thought, Okay, he knows he is going to do this but he does not know how yet and when he sees that opportunity with that lightsaber next to him and sees Snoke distracted and realizes he can give this an attempt, he goes for it.
As I said only reason this was possible was due to the situation.
I'm not sure how you can really call Snoke "distracted", though..? In the film he is clearly bringing all of his focus to Kylo's thoughts/feelings through the force. The novelization corroborates this:
"You think he will turn, you pathetic child?" Snoke asked Rey. "I cannot be betrayed. I cannot be beaten. I see his mind. I see his every intent." The Supreme Leader closed his eyes. This was a drama best appreciated through the Force, not the crude approximation offered by mundane senses.
So the only logical way for Kylo to completely dupe Snoke like that would be if his psionic abilities with the force were superior to Snoke's... But that very clearly was not the case. Imo, this is just PIS of the highest order, and really cannot be explained with any sort of logic. /shrug