Mace vs Plagueis

Which of these valk+ combatants takes victory?

Can Plagueis handle someone who can compete with Sidious?

Can Mace handle Sidious's master?

-Combatants at their peaks

Plagueis dispatches him with a gesture.

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Plagueis dispatches valk with a gesture.

Mace.

Originally posted by The Merchant
Mace.

Plagueis. What's the case for Mace winning?

The reason they always give for Mace being able to take opponents far outside of his range; Vaapad.

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
The reason they always give for Mace being able to take opponents far outside of his range; Vaapad.

From what I've heard, Vaapad is extremely inconsistent and ambiguous. Are supposed to assume that Mace can just fight and defeat people more powerful than himself strictly due to using Vaapad? Because I thought his performance against Sidious was extremely circumstantial with factors contributing other than Vaapad.

It is. People are dumb though and will never learn unfortunately.

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
It is. People are dumb though and will never learn unfortunately.

How do we evaluate Mace and Vaapad when he's fighting dark side users other than Sidious?

He's drawing on his own inner darkness. That's it. The superconducting loop was a product of his fight with Sidious and not how Vaapad normally functions.

Plagueis blitzes

Mace could take sabers 5-6/10 if vaapad amped ; otherwise Plagueis wins force 10/10 and all-out 8-9/10

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
He's drawing on his own inner darkness. That's it. The superconducting loop was a product of his fight with Sidious and not how Vaapad normally functions.

So the darkness of his opponent doesn't matter? I thought the novel was portraying it as if Mace was drawing on both his own darkness but also channeling Sidious's darkness to amp himself even further. Or is that the outlying showing of Vaapad as you stated?

How Vaapad works doesn't change depending on who he's fighting, that's inane. Vaapad allows Mace to draw on his inner darkness without corrupting him, and yes, he can also draw on the darkness of those around him. It's not rocket science; it's a tactic that several Sith have employed as well, feeding on the fear of their enemies.

Plagues destroys

Originally posted by nfactor1995
So the darkness of his opponent doesn't matter? I thought the novel was portraying it as if Mace was drawing on both his own darkness but also channeling Sidious's darkness to amp himself even further. Or is that the outlying showing of Vaapad as you stated?

The outlier.

Plagueis ragdoll's. He won't restrict himself to saber combat or hold back in any way, meaning Windu will have no opportunity to scope out shatterpoints or utilize Vaapad

Lucas's statement that mace could compete with sids wasn't specific to saber combat

Vaapad also works on Force abilities, not just lightsaber combat; he used it to successfully repel Sidious' Force Speed and Lightning. So if we assume Mace can do it without any other factors, Plagueis isn't winning this.