Re: Re: If Batman is 100%
Originally posted by shadowknight
Overall in Everything, I take this to mean in intelligence, omni-skills and physical attributes. Not just 1 or the other.Nightwing-75%
Punisher-30%
Iron Man-35%
Iron Fist-25%
Lex Luthor-40%
Doom-50%
Kingpin-30%
As an example, Iron Msn makes up for a huge deficit in physical attributes when compared to Bats, in other areas, like tech.
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Nightwing -30%
Punisher -30%
Iron Man -10%
Iron Fist -40%
Lex Luthor -10%
Doom -10%
Kingpin -80%
"-" is a minus.
Originally posted by shadowknightYou both have made this Raptor proud.
Overall in Everything, I take this to mean in intelligence, omni-skills and physical attributes. Not just 1 or the other.Nightwing-75%
Punisher-30%
Iron Man-35%
Iron Fist-25%
Lex Luthor-40%
Doom-50%
Kingpin-30%
Re: If Batman is 100%
Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
Overall in EverythingNightwing
Punisher
Iron Man
Iron Fist
Lex Luthor
Doom
Kingpin
What you ask is more complicated than it first appears. What, for example, does everything mean?
Obviously, in terms of power, the only ones Bruce can honestly say he is more powerful than are Dick and Frank (the assumption is obviously that Tony and Lex are wearing their respective armors).
In terms of fighting ability it gets better for Bruce, but he is still behind the likes of Iron Fist (and while this is not Classic Kingpin, most would be surprised how good a fighter KP is).
Damage soak? Even better ...but arguably matches Frank, and KP pushes what is possible for a 'human.'
Intellect - well, intelligence is a tricky subject since there are different types. Let's just say Bruce can't beat Stark in technical depth intellect, can't bear Lex in total intellect (if only Lex didn't have his ego ...), and can't beat Doom in any type of intelligence.
Magic - it's been hinted severally that Bruce is very aware of magic, but refuses to use it in the same way he refuses to use a motherbox. But with Doom present, even if Bruce decided to explore the abilities of Homo Magi, he would never come close to Victor (who has legit rights to being the Sorcerer Supreme).
Bottom line ->
Bruce is not number one in ANYTHING. What sets him apart though is that he will often be near the top in EVERYTHING. That is what sets Bruce apart. He is a high-performing generalist. He can hold his own in a thing ...be in making armor, fighting skills, damage soak, intelligence, leadership, business, and even magic. The only one in that listing that can say the same is Doom, who can also tick off 'anything' as an ability. Anything as an ability.
Finally, add positioning. Bruce has added considerable value to the JLA, including significantly changing the course of history in certain cases. E.g. In the Obsidian Age, it is seen how Bruce's prep came into play when they were sent thousands of years into the past. Bruce may not punch as hard as Iron Fist, but then again it wasn't punching ability that was important when White Martians invaded Earth! Bruce may not own armor as versatile as Tony's, but when the JLA needs to fight a god you see him wearing the HellBat. Bruce may not spend his days wearing pinstripe suits and plotting against Kryptonians, but if needed he has plans on plans on plans like Lex (and owns a comparative company).
The only person on that list that matches Bruce ....and not only that, but can truly defeat Bruce, is Doom. He is the only one who can do everything Bruce can, and more. All the others can do one or two things better than Bruce, but not the other stuff that he can.
The only one there higher than Bruce is Doom. It's really that simple. That is, if we are looking beyond one dimension.
Re: Re: If Batman is 100%
Originally posted by spetznazSince when is Doom a master martial artist?
What you ask is more complicated than it first appears. What, for example, does everything mean?Obviously, in terms of power, the only ones Bruce can honestly say he is more powerful than are Dick and Frank (the assumption is obviously that Tony and Lex are wearing their respective armors).
In terms of fighting ability it gets better for Bruce, but he is still behind the likes of Iron Fist (and while this is not Classic Kingpin, most would be surprised how good a fighter KP is).
Damage soak? Even better ...but arguably matches Frank, and KP pushes what is possible for a 'human.'
Intellect - well, intelligence is a tricky subject since there are different types. Let's just say Bruce can't beat Stark in technical depth intellect, can't bear Lex in total intellect (if only Lex didn't have his ego ...), and can't beat Doom in any type of intelligence.
Magic - it's been hinted severally that Bruce is very aware of magic, but refuses to use it in the same way he refuses to use a motherbox. But with Doom present, even if Bruce decided to explore the abilities of Homo Magi, he would never come close to Victor (who has legit rights to being the Sorcerer Supreme).
Bottom line ->
Bruce is not number one in ANYTHING. What sets him apart though is that he will often be near the top in EVERYTHING. That is what sets Bruce apart. He is a high-performing generalist. He can hold his own in a thing ...be in making armor, fighting skills, damage soak, intelligence, leadership, business, and even magic. The only one in that listing that can say the same is Doom, who can also tick off 'anything' as an ability. Anything as an ability.Finally, add positioning. Bruce has added considerable value to the JLA, including significantly changing the course of history in certain cases. E.g. In the Obsidian Age, it is seen how Bruce's prep came into play when they were sent thousands of years into the past. Bruce may not punch as hard as Iron Fist, but then again it wasn't punching ability that was important when White Martians invaded Earth! Bruce may not own armor as versatile as Tony's, but when the JLA needs to fight a god you see him wearing the HellBat. Bruce may not spend his days wearing pinstripe suits and plotting against Kryptonians, but if needed he has plans on plans on plans like Lex (and owns a comparative company).
The only person on that list that matches Bruce ....and not only that, but can truly defeat Bruce, is Doom. He is the only one who can do everything Bruce can, and more. All the others can do one or two things better than Bruce, but not the other stuff that he can.
The only one there higher than Bruce is Doom. It's really that simple. That is, if we are looking beyond one dimension.
Re: Re: Re: If Batman is 100%
Originally posted by RadZoa
Since when is Doom a master martial artist?
Since he beat Matt Murdock and killed a lion empty handed. Now, he is normally written as relying mostly on his intellect/technology/magic, but he can trade hands when he wants to.
Again, my point - he is similar to Bruce, in that he is capable across most disciplines. Something that puts the two above the rest on that list.
Originally posted by abhilegend
He has never beaten Matt in a fight bare handed.
Doom vs Daredevil:
http://www.theothermurdockpapers.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/Daredevil-vs-Doom-panel-1.png
Doom vs Lion:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111118857/4304125-5974040049-FxUVs.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/111336/3781987-4843655927-DoomS.jpg
Now ...for the one against Daredevil, you might say that it's because he's wearing armor. Okay.
The next two scans are against a lion ...with Doom being completely naked. And defeating the lion with one blow to a nexus point.
It takes me to the point I am trying to make ...that Doom can actually fight. Whether he can beat Matt naked is debatable (probably not), but the point that Doom can fight is quite evident. He just uses his intellect/other abilities more, but I'd say defeating a lion naked is nothing to shake a stick at.
Which drives my point - in that list, there are only two people who can tick all the boxes. Bruce and Victor. The rest can tick one at a very high level, and some can tick several boxes.
Only two can represent - and represent well - across any discipline. Physical, mental, esoteric, technology, skill.
