Originally posted by Robtard
Fair enough and I apologize there 👆But it seems to me this tax plan is basically at it's core a giant boon to the top 1%, corporations and the uber wealthy who can list their personal earnings/profits under corporate status and will then get a nice tax rate of only 20%. (wouldn't you like to be taxed at only 20%?)
How does that make you feel and where do you think the money's going to come from to make up that 15% loss now, as the country runs on money?
Yes some rich will pay less tax in the % numbers but they won't get state and local tax deductions anymore. So they will end up paying more money overall.
Originally posted by BackFire
The important thing is the middle class needs to get the majority of the tax cuts, and the biggest percentage of them. Otherwise, this will not have much of a practical positive effect.
The MC pay the lion's share now, so if you give them a considerable break, the money has to come from somewhere else and the corps/1%ers will not be picking up that slack. Unless you believe in the trickle down theory where giving the rich more of break means they won't keep those extra profits but instead reinvest in ways that promote positive income to people and thereby then to the government.
Call me a cynic, but the ultra wealthy like staying as wealthy as they can, generally speaking.
Originally posted by Robtard
The MC pay the lion's share now, so if you give them a considerable break, the money has to come from somewhere else and the corps/1%ers will not be picking up that slack. Unless you believe in the trickle down theory where giving the rich more of break means they won't keep those extra profits but instead reinvest in ways that promote positive income to people and thereby then to the government.Call me a cynic, but the ultra wealthy like staying as wealthy as they can, generally speaking.
Yeah I'm not a supporter of the trickle down theory. It at best is a short term improvement that has very severe long term consequences, and in the end, the rich just end up hoarding the extra money anyways so it has no real benefit. It just sends more money to the rich on the backs of the middle class, and while some of these people may "create jobs", that doesn't generally last.
Really if you're going to have any meaningful tax cuts then the middle class needs to get them, and the small local business owners, while the wealthy pay more or you make up the means elsewhere (neither of which are likely to happen).
Originally posted by BackFire
The important thing is the middle class needs to get the majority of the tax cuts, and the biggest percentage of them. Otherwise, this will not have much of a practical positive effect.
So the rich have to pay more, how much more can they pay at 39%, not including state and local? Which ends up being like 55%
Sure I'm all for taxing the rich, seeing as the rich whom have lobbiests to represent them (Amazon, Microsoft, Apple, Walmart) end up getting to right the tax laws. How do you may them pay more then 55% and call that fair?
And where is all the Rich people like Hillary, Obama, Buffet, Gates, why are they not lining up to pay more?
Originally posted by SableBecause the not rich who do pay taxes pay the lion's share.
Reposting this for relevancy, this is our current tax code. How is it lined up for the rich when the poor don't pay tax.
But sure, I'm all for everyone paying taxes, aside from special cases like someone being seriously disabled, the elderly in some cases etc.
I also feel we really need to hammer down on people who abuse the wealth fare systems we have, like food-stamps, disability payments, workers comp etc. Get those leeches who really don't need it and could work off our tax dollars. Shit, deport them to international waters for the crime.
Originally posted by Sable
Top 10% of wage earners pay 60% of all taxes, the top 1% pay 40%.Democrats say the rich are not paying enough tax. So how much more should they pay?
Yet we have the top earners still making most of the money because of globalization and "betting" on the stock market.
Most of the wealth created isn't from creating new jobs its betting on the stock market.
Originally posted by Sable
So the rich have to pay more, how much more can they pay at 39%, not including state and local? Which ends up being like 55%Sure I'm all for taxing the rich, seeing as the rich whom have lobbiests to represent them (Amazon, Microsoft, Apple, Walmart) end up getting to right the tax laws. How do you may them pay more then 55% and call that fair?
And where is all the Rich people like Hillary, Obama, Buffet, Gates, why are they not lining up to pay more?
Well Buffet has for years stated that he thinks he should pay more in taxes, and that his secretary pays a larger percentage than he does.
Something you may not be considering is that the rich also have the means to hire high end tax attorneys and find various loopholes in the tax code that they can exploit, that normal people simply don't have the means or the money to take advantage of.
I'm not really arguing that the rich NEED to pay more than they currently do. Just that if you are going to do tax cuts, they need to target the middle class. Targeting the rich is not going to offer a benefit for most people.
Originally posted by Robtard
Because the not rich who do pay taxes pay the lion's share.But sure, I'm all for everyone paying taxes, aside from special cases like someone being seriously disabled, the elderly in some cases etc.
I also feel we really need to hammer down on people who abuse the wealth fare systems we have, like food-stamps, disability payments, workers comp etc. Get those leeches who really don't need it and could work off our tax dollars. Shit, deport them to international waters for the crime.
Loopholes, special interest, deductions for state and local taxes, slow the growth rate of Medicare, stop bringing in illegal immigrants, waste fraud and abuse.
11 million illegal immigrants generate 19 billion in tax revenue but cost the country $135 billion a year. How this makes sense on keeping them here is beyond me. At some point we have to say no.
$70 billion a year is spent on college education. If we cut illegal immigration by half, we could pay for every person to go to school.
No one thinks about these things.
Originally posted by BackFire
Well Buffet has for years stated that he thinks he should pay more in taxes, and that his secretary pays a larger percentage than he does.Something you may not be considering is that the rich also have the means to hire high end tax attorneys and find various loopholes in the tax code that they can exploit, that normal people simply don't have the means or the money to take advantage of.
I'm not really arguing that the rich NEED to pay more than they currently do. Just that if you are going to do tax cuts, they need to target the middle class. Targeting the rich is not going to offer a benefit for most people.
It's a lame excuse, there is a line to voluntarily pay more, he doesn't. It's a cut out "look at me I'm willing but I don't."
I agree, it's not going to, but if you listen to Pelosi and Schumer that's all you hear them say. "This is class warfare!" Chuck Schumer
Originally posted by BackFire
I'm not really arguing that the rich NEED to pay more than they currently do. Just that if you are going to do tax cuts, they need to target the middle class. Targeting the rich is not going to offer a benefit for most people.
Under this new code many of them will be paying less. As noted, if you're diverse and wealthy enough you can could claim your earnings and profits at a corporate status, which will now be taxed at a mere 20% from the previous 35%.
Originally posted by Robtard
Fair enough and I apologize there 👆But it seems to me this tax plan is basically at it's core a giant boon to the top 1%, corporations and the uber wealthy who can list their personal earnings/profits under corporate status and will then get a nice tax rate of only 20%. (wouldn't you like to be taxed at only 20%?)
How does that make you feel and where do you think the money's going to come from to make up that 15% loss now, as the country runs on money?
hey rob. see you're still in character
Looking at the numbers some more, the top 10% is paying 70% of the taxes in this country.
"The top 10 percent of taxpayers paid over 70% of the total amount collected in federal income taxes in 2010, the latest year figures are available, according to the Tax Foundation, a think tank that advocates for lower taxes. That's up from 55% in 1986.
The remaining 90% bore just under 30% of the tax burden. And 47% of all Americans pay hardly anything at all.
http://money.cnn.com/2013/03/12/news/economy/rich-taxes/index.html
Originally posted by Robtard
Fair enough and I apologize there 👆But it seems to me this tax plan is basically at it's core a giant boon to the top 1%, corporations and the uber wealthy who can list their personal earnings/profits under corporate status and will then get a nice tax rate of only 20%. (wouldn't you like to be taxed at only 20%?)
How does that make you feel and where do you think the money's going to come from to make up that 15% loss now, as the country runs on money?
Well he'll at least have cut tax avoidance by 15% as corporations will only be avoiding a 20% rate now instead of 35%