Voldemort vs. Grindelwald

Originally posted by Surtur
The only way it wouldn't work properly for Grindelwald is if he wasn't accepted as the true owner. It makes sense he wouldn't be when you think about it...he stole the wand right? I don't think he used magic to disarm someone of it.

But whatever reason he wasn't accepted as the true owner...that would mean anyone who defeats Grindelwald wouldn't have become the true owner either. So why did Dumbledore seem to have control over it?

Okay, the Elder Wand can only be fully controlled if the previous owner of this gets defeated in duel by the current opponent.

Gellert Grindelwald stole the Elder Wand. Which cause the Elder wand to reject him.

Similarly, we saw that Voldemort couldn't use the Elder Wand, since he wasn't the wizzard who killed Albus (Remember that Severus Snape was the one who killed Albus).

So when Voldemort used the Elder Wand, it broke.

Later we see that Voldermort kills Snape, and is finally able to use the Elder Wand.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cL527bg0II

See, Voldemort himself confirms it. So Voldermort killed snape to have control over the Wand.

So that means that neither Gellert nor Tom had control over the wand. However in the end Voldemort did had control over the wand.

Remember that Albus defeated Gellert, which makes him the owner of the wand.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Okay, the Elder Wand can only be fully controlled if the previous owner of this gets defeated in duel by the current opponent.

Gellert Grindelwald stole the Elder Wand. Which cause the Elder wand to reject him.

Similarly, we saw that Voldemort couldn't use the Elder Wand, since he wasn't the wizzard who killed Albus (Remember that Severus Snape was the one who killed Albus).

So when Voldemort used the Elder Wand, it broke.

Later we see that Voldermort kills Snape, and is finally able to use the Elder Wand.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cL527bg0II

See, Voldemort himself confirms it. So Voldermort killed snape to have control over the Wand.

So that means that neither Gellert nor Tom had control over the wand. However in the end Voldemort did had control over the wand.

Remember that Albus defeated Gellert, which makes him the owner of the wand.

But if Gellert never had control why would defeating him give Dumbledore control?

Originally posted by Surtur
But if Gellert never had control why would defeating him give Dumbledore control?

Well cause Albus defeated Gellert.

I think its more of, the one defeating the wearer of the Elder Wand that becomes the owner.

Albus defeated Gellert, which means he becomes the owner.

As long as the wand is obtain through defeat the person will be able to own it.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Albus didn't had problems with the Wand. He wasn't the rightful owner, but doesn't mean the wand resisted him.

Well, the battle between Albus and Gellert is known to be the most powerful duel of all times.

Both Gellert and Voldemort didn't had wands to outclass the Elderwand. Gellert never control the Elderwand nor did Voldemort.

We will have to wait for FB sequels to conclude this debate.

Based on ?

Albus had the best wand against Voldemort not against Gellert.

As of now Voldemort wins based off the evidence.

I'll do you one better, josh. Provided this forum still exists when this duel is finally filmed and the new films wrap we can do a proper battlezone with me representing Voldemort vs. your Gellert. I'll definitely be game for this battle of the numero uno dark wizard. What say you ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
So Albus failed to defeat Voldemort despite being the rightful owner.

Based on ?

Albus had the best wand against Voldemort not against Gellert.

As of now Voldemort wins based off the evidence.

Again, you keep forgetting Harry in the equation. You keep forgetting that Albus is Older and weaker.

Also you keep forgetting that Albus never really engaged Voldemort into a 1vs1.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Again, you keep forgetting Harry in the equation. You keep forgetting that Albus is Older and weaker.

Also you keep forgetting that Albus never really engaged Voldemort into a 1vs1.

Yes, he did. Watch the duel. He looked terrified the entire time.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Harry was in the background while Albus was one on one against Voldemort in a duel. Based on what is Albus older and weaker.

Yes, he did. Watch the duel. He looked terrified the entire time.

Albus was focused on protecting harry. He was stoping and holding Voldemort giving time for the Aurors.

Else Albus could have moved, or could have used other spells. But it could risk Harry's life. Albus was defending not attacking.

He is much older. When he faught Grindelwald he was young.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Albus was focused on protecting harry. He was stoping and holding Voldemort giving time for the Aurors.

Else Albus could have moved, or could have used other spells. But it could risk Harry's life. Albus was defending not attacking.

He is much older. When he faught Grindelwald he was young.

Sending flames at him is an attack. Using a water bubble to engulf Voldemort is an attack. He defended and attacked when he saw the chance. Both wizards do in a duel.

So prove he was better when he was younger. Voldemort wasn't a young man either.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He was engaged in a duel. He did what he could to win but was unable to do so. To not try to disarm or defeat Voldemort makes no sense.

Sending flames at him is an attack. Using a water bubble to engulf Voldemort is an attack. He defended and attacked when he saw the chance. Both wizards do in a duel.

So prove he was better when he was younger. Voldemort wasn't a young man either.

He engaged himself in a duel he didn't want to win. It was a duel in which Albus wanted to protect Harry. He placed himself between Harry and Voldi. He couldn't move away, or use other spells which could endanger's Harry's life.

He used water to Engulf him so he could by time. Else Albus could have sent' flames. Or use other spells.

No. It wasn't a 1vs1 duel. It was a "Voldemort trying to kill; Albus trying to repel" type of battle. Voldemort wanted them dead, while Albus wanted to protect Harry. So, no, it isn't the same.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
He engaged himself in a duel he didn't want to win. It was a duel in which Albus wanted to protect Harry. He placed himself between Harry and Voldi. He couldn't move away, or use other spells which could endanger's Harry's life.

He used water to Engulf him so he could by time. Else Albus could have sent' flames. Or use other spells.

No. It wasn't a 1vs1 duel. It was a "Voldemort trying to kill; Albus trying to repel" type of battle. Voldemort wanted them dead, while Albus wanted to protect Harry. So, no, it isn't the same.

He still attacked Voldemort with the flames and the water. He isn't some jackass wizard who can't use precision with his magical attacks.

He did send flames at Voldemort in the duel. Come on.

You clearly watched a different duel since drowning and sending flames at someone kills them.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So you believe Albus didn't want to win because logic dictates the opposite. What purpose would it serve not to disarm Voldemort ?

He still attacked Voldemort with the flames and the water. He isn't some jackass wizard who can't use precision with his magical attacks.

He did send flames at Voldemort in the duel. Come on.

You clearly watched a different duel since drowning and sending flames at someone kills them.

You say it as if disarming an opponent is easy. If an opponent attacks you and you try to disarm him then you'll die (Since you should instead have tried to avoid/repel the attack).

Logic proves that Voldermort was attacking while Albus was defending. It wasn't a 1vs1 in where both sides want to kill each other.

Still, he was on defense mode. He was shielding harry, else Albus could have move away, use his environment, or use more powerful spells (But such a spells could endanger Harry's life).

Albus didn't want to kill Voldemort. Atleast that wasn't his endgoal. Albus would have killed Voldemort if he had the chance, but that wasn't his objective. His objective was protecting Harry which is clear enough.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I give a troll like you an inch you try to take a troll mile. I need to keep you in check, troll.

So iow you're a hypocrite. I already knew that but thanks for the confirmation

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
You say it as if disarming an opponent is easy. If an opponent attacks you and you try to disarm him then you'll die (Since you should instead have tried to avoid/repel the attack).

Logic proves that Voldermort was attacking while Albus was defending. It wasn't a 1vs1 in where both sides want to kill each other.

Still, he was on defense mode. He was shielding harry, else Albus could have move away, use his environment, or use more powerful spells (But such a spells could endanger Harry's life).

Albus didn't want to kill Voldemort. Atleast that wasn't his endgoal. Albus would have killed Voldemort if he had the chance, but that wasn't his objective. His objective was protecting Harry which is clear enough.

No, logic proves you don't know the difference between an attack or a defensive spell.

Albus did use the environment and the director even says both wizards use the environment in their duel against each other. What duel did you watch ?

Albus wanted to win. I didn't say he was hurling killing curses but he tried twice to kill him in their duel. Albus tried to win the duel. He didn't.

Originally posted by juggerman
So iow you're a hypocrite. I already knew that but thanks for the confirmation

Originally posted by quanchi112
You are the guy who just shows up as my shadow. You're my *****.

"Poster A went off topic! No fair! Hey remember how you upset me in that other thread that has nothing to do with this one? It's ok when I do it cuz reasons!"

Originally posted by juggerman
"Poster A went off topic! No fair! Hey remember how you upset me in that other thread that has nothing to do with this one? It's ok when I do it cuz reasons!"

Originally posted by quanchi112
You are an emotional shadow. Try to pull yourself together.

Looks you're passed trying to even deny it. You're finally smartening up

voldemort smashes. you need to put him against someone like khan

Originally posted by juggerman
Looks you're passed trying to even deny it. You're finally smartening up