Originally posted by TheGrat1
She still had hundreds if not thousands of years of training under her belt before then. Her first serious battle of note was against Ares, 100 years ago. Thor's first serious battle of note was against the Destroyer, 6 years ago.
How do you know that she's had hundreds of thousands of years of training? In Thor1, it's already mentioned that Thor and the warriors 3 has had countless battles.
I said hundred if not thousands, not hundreds of thousands. Important difference. When Ares killed the Greek pantheon and Zeus died it was in ancient times. Obviously Diana was concieved before Zeus died so she is at least 2000 years old. We can see that she was being trained since she was a small child so she has hundreds if not thousands of years of training.
Yes, but battles against who? The mooks of the nine realms? Quan implied that Thor was fighting opponents better than the Amazons during his adventures. What we have seen of the 9 realms makes me call that into question.
Originally posted by TheGrat1Speculation. WW trained and her Amazonians were fearful of WW 1 Germans. Her aunt was killed in this battle and she was one of the elite warriors from this pitiful tribe. Older sher does not denote into greater exerience especially since we see him in battle.
Can you count? Stepp, Diana, and Ares are all over twice Thor's age. Stepp is probably old enough to be Thor's father"Thor has fought much more formidable foes..."
Thor has fought Loki, Ultron, Vision, Hulk, Kurse, Malekith amped infinitely stone, frost Giants, Hela, Surtur, etc. the Justice league villain alone is laughable and not even a serious threat to the team. Ares admits he can't take out humanity and begs her to join his quest. He was weak and unable to overcome his petty emotions and hatred of mankind. He died. Pitifully. This is the guy the Amazonians were afraid of but considering the WW1 Germans were killing them I can see why.
WW1 German fodder killed Amazonians and one of their greatest warriors. That's far worse than frost Giants who Thor handily bested. WW needed aid to escape No Man's Land from Steve and his pals. Destroyer would solo the Germans easily in No Man's Land. 😂Like who? Frost giant cannon fodder that took his daddy's eye and Sif can defeat? Dumb rock monsters? Dungeons and Dragons cosplayers? The nine realms are filled with nothing but mooks. The first impressive being we see him fight is a lumbering, slow, zero intelligence automaton called the Destroyer. That was 6 years ago.[/B]
Loki is not a weakling he's just not a brute. He is a cunning sorcerer with magic and tricks up his sleeve. Iron Man was a challenge for him but obviously without the amp he isn't up to Thor's level. Kurse was very formidable but Thor walked away without any injuries. Hulk is the definitive brute in all of comicdom. Thor wasn't injured and was distracting him. He weathered the assault just fine. Thor contributed 1/3 the power to critically injure Ultron Prime.
Thor's only other notable combatants are Loki (lol), Iron Man, Kurse, Hulk, Ultron Prime, and Hela.
Loki is a weakling, Iron Man is not a challenge for him, Kurse bloodied him and rocked his world, Hulk is decent but a predictable brute, Ultron Prime dominated him 1 on 1, and he had to run away from Hela.
Doomsday, Kal-El, Ares, and Steppenwolf would smoke any of those guys save Hela with minor effort in a serious fight, and Diana has held her own against all of them. The DCEU operates on a generally higher plane than the MCU.
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False as these guys are vastly overrated. Firstly doomsday is their greatest character and Hulk would beat him as he overcame Abom through a battle. Superman has very exploitable weaknesses and was ko'd by a tower, bomb, stunned by a Knian laser, etc.
Ares was laughable and was killed by lightning. Thor would end him rather easily since he's the god of thunder. Steppenwolf didn't smoke or even have anyone impressive on the ropes. Killing the same kinds of women the WW1 Germans did isn't impressive.
Dormammu solos the entire dceu. The Thor trilogy itself defeats the entire dceu in a battle. The dceu consists of bricks and what's pretty much it. Marvel has them beaten on every single level.
Hulk seems to do more damage than Steppenwolf. Steppenwolf is strong enough to hurt the Cyborg not Superman or even WW. Thor never bested the Hulk and he used his hammer and lightning to amp his attacks. That hasn't bested the Hulk yet.
"Steppenwolf does not do much more..."We don't see Hulk do much more than jump around and punch things. Your point? Sure Thor can do a lot of things but he only needed striking to best Hulk. Steppenwolf, likewise, will only need his axe and hilarious reach advantage to best Hulk.
Are you seriously asking me to prove that an axe can cut? LMAO
Prove Abom's spike and Fenris' teeth are equal to Diana's sword. Because Stepp's axe is.He survived longer against them than any of the clowns Hulk and Thor fought would. 😂 [/B]
He hasn't used his reach advantage to best even Aquaman who is weaker and less durable than the Hulk. Hulk will beat the shit out of him as soon as he closes the distance especially when sconsidering how quickly he moves and jumps should be no time at all.
You said cut his head or make him bleed out. We see Fenris pierce but how much did it weaken the Hulk. He is fine and beats Fenris in the water no less.
False, Steppenwolf isn't fighting weak Amazonians he'd get annihilated by Hulk or Thor.
Originally posted by TheGrat1
I said hundred if not thousands, not hundreds of thousands. Important difference. When Ares killed the Greek pantheon and Zeus died it was in ancient times. Obviously Diana was concieved before Zeus died so she is at least 2000 years old. We can see that she was being trained since she was a small child so she has hundreds if not thousands of years of training.Yes, but battles against who? The mooks of the nine realms? Quan implied that Thor was fighting opponents better than the Amazons during his adventures. What we have seen of the 9 realms makes me call that into question.
Training is not the same as battle. The Amazons are human. Very skilled but human nonetheless. WW would have been training with people far weaker and slower than her. Whereas Thor grew up among Asgardians who are all superhuman, and fought beings in the 9 realms who were mostly superhuman. Let's take stock of what we've seen in the films:
So far the opponents WW have fought were:
German Soldiers
Ares
Doomsday (assisted in a 3v1 fight)
Bank robbers
Parademons
Steppenwolf (assisted in a 6v1 fight)
So she's really only dedeated fodder: mostly humans and a few parademons. Her only win against a noteworthy opponent was Ares whom she only defeated via plot armor which is that she was specifically made to kill him.
In the other corner let's look at the opponents Thor have fought:
Frost Giants
SHIELD agents (while human)
Destroyer
Loki
Dark elves
Kurse (2v1)
Malekith
Malekith w/ aether (had some assistance)
Hydra agents
Ultronbots
Ultron (7v1?)
Hulk
Ironman
Undead Asgardians
Hela
Sakaarians
Surtur
Surtur's minions
So you see, Thor has a way more impressive resume, fighting fodder way more impressive than WW's fodder and fighting solo against more 'boss' opponents than WW ever had. Even if we took their training into account, Diana trained with Amazons whereas Thor trained with Agardians. No comparison there.
Originally posted by FrothByte
The Amazons are human. Very skilled but human nonetheless.
Not sure I totally agree with this one after Justice League. They seemed to be low level superhuman in that film. For example, a pair of Amazons were strong enough to catch and hold the one huge stone door leading into the temple where the motherbox was kept. Yes, they were struggling, and slowly letting it drop. But a stone door of that size would easily weigh a good couple of tons, so two of them being able to support it for even a couple of seconds (long enough to get the motherbox out) shows some serious strength. And at one point, one of the Amazons (Hippolyta, I think) leaps probably about 15+ feet far and high enough to land on Steppenwolf's shoulders. But yeah, the point about them being well below Diana still stands regardless.
Originally posted by FrothByte
Training is not the same as battle. The Amazons are human. Very skilled but human nonetheless. WW would have been training with people far weaker and slower than her. Whereas Thor grew up among Asgardians who are all superhuman, and fought beings in the 9 realms who were mostly superhuman. Let's take stock of what we've seen in the films:So far the opponents WW have fought were:
German Soldiers
Ares
Doomsday (assisted in a 3v1 fight)
Bank robbers
Parademons
Steppenwolf (assisted in a 6v1 fight)So she's really only dedeated fodder: mostly humans and a few parademons. Her only win against a noteworthy opponent was Ares whom she only defeated via plot armor which is that she was specifically made to kill him.
In the other corner let's look at the opponents Thor have fought:
Frost Giants
SHIELD agents (while human)
Destroyer
Loki
Dark elves
Kurse (2v1)
Malekith
Malekith w/ aether (had some assistance)
Hydra agents
Ultronbots
Ultron (7v1?)
Hulk
Ironman
Undead Asgardians
Hela
Sakaarians
Surtur
Surtur's minionsSo you see, Thor has a way more impressive resume, fighting fodder way more impressive than WW's fodder and fighting solo against more 'boss' opponents than WW ever had. Even if we took their training into account, Diana trained with Amazons whereas Thor trained with Agardians. No comparison there.
The amazons are superhuman. They have superstrength feats as well as being immortal. Did you even see Justice League?
Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Not sure I totally agree with this one after Justice League. They seemed to be low level superhuman in that film. For example, a pair of Amazons were strong enough to catch and hold the one huge stone door leading into the temple where the motherbox was kept. Yes, they were struggling, and slowly letting it drop. But a stone door of that size would easily weigh a good couple of tons, so two of them being able to support it for even a couple of seconds (long enough to get the motherbox out) shows some serious strength. And at one point, one of the Amazons (Hippolyta, I think) leaps probably about 15+ feet far and high enough to land on Steppenwolf's shoulders. But yeah, the point about them being well below Diana still stands regardless.
Would you then say that a high-end Amazon could beat Batfleck in h2h?
Originally posted by FrothByte
Would you then say that a high-end Amazon could beat Batfleck in h2h?
If we're talking completely without gear, based on current available feats, I would be inclined to potentially give characters like Hippolyta and Antiope a win over him. I could see him defeating fodder Amazons though.
Originally posted by quanchi112Thor has fought Loki, Ultron, Vision, Hulk, Kurse, Malekith amped infinitely stone, frost Giants, Hela, Surtur, etc.
All I see is a list of people Wonder Woman can solo with moderate effort at best. Whereas 3 of those people have beaten Thor up and 4 of them have made Thor bleed.
Originally posted by quanchi112
The Thor trilogy itself defeats the entire dceu in a battle.
Lol. I remember the thread you started on it. I have the last response, why don't you go respond to it? 😉
Originally posted by quanchi112
He hasn't used his reach advantage to best even Aquaman who is weaker and less durable than the Hulk. Hulk will beat the shit out of him as soon as he closes the distance especially when sconsidering how quickly he moves and jumps should be no time at all.
Aquaman and Wonder Woman have gear capable of blocking and deflecting Steppenwolf's axe. Hulk does not. Even then Stepp was smacking them around.
You think Hulk can close the distance faster than a hellfire missle? He can not even catch Blonsky on foot! 😂
Originally posted by quanchi112
You said cut his head or make him bleed out. We see Fenris pierce but how much did it weaken the Hulk. He is fine and beats Fenris in the water no less.False, Steppenwolf isn't fighting weak Amazonians he'd get annihilated by Hulk or Thor.
Fenris fell over the side of Asgard like a dumbass and Hulk cried out in pain when he was bitten. Getting ragdolled in all of 4 feet of water.
Amazons are multi-tonners and Steppenwolf literally walked through a half dozen of them.
Originally posted by TheGrat1You are free to speculate but we see WW clearly struggle with General Ludendorff who possessed weaker strength, durability and inferior skill. The guy was a walking joke of a semi villain. Even Ares was lackluster and he ended their pitiful gods yet quivered on the sidelines unable to take humanity out head on.
All I see is a list of people Wonder Woman can solo with moderate effort at best. Whereas 3 of those people have beaten Thor up and 4 of them have made Thor bleed.
Bump the thread.Lol. I remember the thread you started on it. I have the last response, why don't you go respond to it? 😉
Aquaman and Wonder Woman have gear capable of blocking and deflecting Steppenwolf's axe. Hulk does not. Even then Stepp was smacking them around.
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Hulk can withstand the axe. He also is capable of greater strength and power than the parademons who also lacked the reach advantage, sport.
Blonksy has skill on his side but he was unable to do anything significant in terms of damage to the Hulk prior to his transformation.
You think Hulk can close the distance faster than a hellfire missle? He can not even catch Blonsky on foot! 😂
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Hulk felt pain. Superman screamed out in pain holding up a tower and passing out. Anything you can do I can do better.
Fenris fell over the side of Asgard like a dumbass and Hulk cried out in pain when he was bitten. Getting ragdolled in all of 4 feet of water.[IMG]https://i.makeagif.com/media/11-28-2017/3xpV_C.gif]
Amazons are multi-tonners and Steppenwolf literally walked through a half dozen of them. [/B]
Asgardians are also superhuman yet Thir can wreck then as well. WW1 Germans were killing them. They aren't bulletproof. They are fodder so Steppenwolf'c claim to fame isn't impressive and he also had parademons aid. He wasn't Hela.
😂
Wait, Amazonian's are superhuman? They MIGHT be enhanced human I guess? But superhuman? Captain America would've stopped that block of stone and not been crushed to death after 2.5 seconds, he's legit superhuman but on the lower end of the scale. Amazon's are enhanced the same way the Spartan's from 300 are enhanced. Very stylized fighting. We saw them in combat against WW1 soldiers. VERY human.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIfPq3biW_o
One of the defining points of their origin is that early man enslaved them which is why Zeus gave them Paradise Island or whatever. Again, regular men with sticks and stones put them in chains and kept them as personal slaves under Hippolyta led the uprising. Trying to label them as superhuman in the face of everything we know based on one scene is just dumb.
Amazon's are Olympic level athletes that have dedicated their life to combat.
Also, Wonder Woman was a really good movie until the last act. Almost on par with Captain America's origin story. I'm sad they went all stupid CGI on us but whatever.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Wait, Amazonian's are superhuman? They MIGHT be enhanced human I guess? But superhuman? Captain America would've stopped that block of stone and not been crushed to death after 2.5 seconds, he's legit superhuman but on the lower end of the scale. Amazon's are enhanced the same way the Spartan's from 300 are enhanced. Very stylized fighting. We saw them in combat against WW1 soldiers. VERY human.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIfPq3biW_o
One of the defining points of their origin is that early man enslaved them which is why Zeus gave them Paradise Island or whatever. Again, regular men with sticks and stones put them in chains and kept them as personal slaves under Hippolyta led the uprising. Trying to label them as superhuman in the face of everything we know based on one scene is just dumb.
Amazon's are Olympic level athletes that have dedicated their life to combat.
^Ummm, what is Cap's best lifting feat?
Because taking a rough estimate of that slab's dimensions (1.5 feet by 9 feet by 10 feet (135 cubic feet)) and assuming it is a dense as medium density limestone it would weigh in at over 20,000 pounds.
Being enslaved by men means little. Think "A bug's life" in reverse. Amazons are the grasshoppers, men are the ants. Individually inferior but have strength in numbers. Amazons can still be killed by arrows and swords.
There is no way two Spartans would have caught that. There is no way Stepp would be slowed down by a group of normal women.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusThat stone wall weighed over 10 tons easily. The strongest human can’t lift even 1 ton. Cap would have struggled his ass off and probably would have done worst.
Wait, Amazonian's are superhuman? They MIGHT be enhanced human I guess? But superhuman? Captain America would've stopped that block of stone and not been crushed to death after 2.5 seconds, he's legit superhuman but on the lower end of the scale. Amazon's are enhanced the same way the Spartan's from 300 are enhanced. Very stylized fighting. We saw them in combat against WW1 soldiers. VERY human.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIfPq3biW_o
One of the defining points of their origin is that early man enslaved them which is why Zeus gave them Paradise Island or whatever. Again, regular men with sticks and stones put them in chains and kept them as personal slaves under Hippolyta led the uprising. Trying to label them as superhuman in the face of everything we know based on one scene is just dumb.
Amazon's are Olympic level athletes that have dedicated their life to combat.
Also, Wonder Woman was a really good movie until the last act. Almost on par with Captain America's origin story. I'm sad they went all stupid CGI on us but whatever.
They are immortal and can leap superhuman distances. This is proof they are BOT HUMAN.
According to the director, Wonder Woman is around 800 years old in her movie and 900 by the modern DCEU.
Originally posted by TheGrat1
^Ummm, what is Cap's best lifting feat?Because taking a rough estimate of that slab's dimensions (1.5 feet by 9 feet by 10 feet (135 cubic feet)) and assuming it is a dense as medium density limestone it would weigh in at over 20,000 pounds.
Being enslaved by men means little. Think "A bug's life" in reverse. Amazons are the grasshoppers, men are the ants. Individually inferior but have strength in numbers. Amazons can still be killed by arrows and swords.
There is no way two Spartans would have caught that. There is no way Stepp would be slowed down by a group of normal women.
I guess, lifting that motorcycle? He's still far stronger than what it would take to lift that stone slab. Far stronger. And if that slab fell on him? He'd be far from crushed.
What? They were kept in chains as slaves and had a massive revolt which inspired their tenant to leave man's world. How does that mean little? They aren't a dozen vs. a few hundred. They're hundreds of them and their army (As we've seen) in full force would've rivaled any rival province of Greece could've assembled at the time.
The Amazon are not normal women. I just said, they're Olympic level athletes. Superhuman though? That flies in the face of everything we know about them. We've seen even Hippolyta and her sister face off against regular men, and they're the elite.....
This doesn't even change anything in the thread. Steppenwolf running through Olympic level women or MAYBE slightly enhanced doesn't matter at the level we're playing at here. Parademons have pushed Steppenwolf back twice and they're just psychotic humans. He's weak sauce. It just irritates me that you guys throw out logic because you think that one scene retcons everything we know about Amazon's lol.
The amazons might seem superhuman compared to your normal human in the real world but they're really not that much superhuman when compared to the average action hero. Guys like Dominic Toretto, Frank Martin, Black Widow, Conan (or almost any Arnold character)... these characters all displayed some degree of superhuman feat at one point or another.
Originally posted by FrothByteYou can put Cap in that category too. He's not much different compared to Arnold. Black Widow is not superhuman in any way in strength.
The amazons might seem superhuman compared to your normal human in the real world but they're really not that much superhuman when compared to the average action hero. Guys like Dominic Toretto, Frank Martin, Black Widow, Conan (or almost any Arnold character)... these characters all displayed some degree of superhuman feat at one point or another.
You are completely bias towards Marvel. You downplay DC feats and over exaggerate Marvel feats (sometimes to the point of complete falsity).
Originally posted by h1a8
You can put Cap in that category too. He's not much different compared to Arnold. Black Widow is not superhuman in any way in strength.You are completely bias towards Marvel. You downplay DC feats and over exaggerate Marvel feats (sometimes to the point of complete falsity).
Says the guy that claimed a large boulder weighed around 5 tons.