Originally posted by Surtur
And having things as they are hasn't brought peace either. Next.
Seems you support Trump and this on the "it's something different" reason. That's fine and all for some things but when outside forces like The State Department are warning that even more bloodshed will ensue and we're talking about lives being lost. How do you justify that?
edit: Innocent lives, not just terrorist. In case that's not clear
Originally posted by Bashar Teg
it's just more of his pathetic strategy of "i suddenly and conveniently don't care about moral and ethical issues"
Lol, the funny part is I'm not saying everyone. I am talking about pieces of shit willing to murder over this. The reaction to this is that it is somehow wrong to call these people pieces of shit. Or to strawman and say I mean all of them.
Originally posted by SurturYou have a limited perspective on this issue it seems like. Completely unaware of the history of that region. Terrorism is never okay, neither is invading another people’s homeland, slaughtering entire villages and sending massive populations into exile.
Lol, the funny part is I'm not saying everyone. I am talking about pieces of shit willing to murder over this. The reaction to this is that it is somehow wrong to call these people pieces of shit. Or to strawman and say I mean all of them.
It’s not just black and white.
Trump is doing the wrong thing. You’re allowed to disagree with specific actions of his and still support him. You don’t have to agree with every single thing he does.
Originally posted by Surtur
Nope, we've given them 22 years to change. They have failed.
"They have been putting water on the fire for 22 years and it has not worked, so gasoline will do the trick," is substantively no different than, "This water is not putting the fire out, so I better put this gasoline on it!"
So that makes you twice as retarded.
Originally posted by Surtur
I just have to disagree. And see here is the problem. People like you always seem to think that if someone disagree's with you it must be because they just are uninformed.That's hogwash. I'm aware of what is going on. I never said the situation was black and white in terms of the reasons for strife. But yes I WILL say people who are going to go murder others because the city that contains the Israeli parliament was finally named the capital are pieces of shit. Committing murder over that IS black and white. Nobody said people had to do a jig in the streets over this, it is complicated, but when people murder they go to far, and they do not get the excuse of "the strife in the area" to fall back on. Nor can they use the "invaders" excuse.
My view is that it has been over two decades. How much longer are we to wait? Do you have a number?
I just have to disagree. And see here is the problem. People like you always seem to think that if someone disagree's with you it must be because they just are uninformed.
That's hogwash. I'm aware of what is going on. I never said the situation was black and white in terms of the reasons for strife. But yes I WILL say people who are going to go murder others because the city that contains the Israeli parliament was finally named the capital are pieces of shit. This does not mean I am not aware of why this is important to the other side and why it would anger them. Committing murder over that IS black and white. Nobody said people had to do a jig in the streets over this, it is complicated, but when people murder they go to far, and they do not get the excuse of "the strife in the area" to fall back on. Nor can they use the "invaders" excuse.
My view is that it has been over two decades. How much longer are we to wait? Do you have a number?
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
"They have been putting water on the fire for 22 years and it has not worked, so gasoline will do the trick," is substantively no different than, "This water is not putting the fire out, so I better put this gasoline on it!"So that makes you twice as retarded.
Give me a number then.
Yo, surt. How do you justify an act that experts are saying will lead to MORE innocent deaths, on the "he's trying something different" reasoning?
Originally posted by Robtard
Seems you support Trump and this on the "it's something different" reason. That's fine and all for some things but when outside forces like The State Department are warning that even more bloodshed will ensue and we're talking about lives being lost. How do you justify that?edit: Innocent lives, not just terrorist. In case that's not clear
Originally posted by SurturFirst of all, **** the dea that WE are having to wait on anything. We created this problem. The entire conflict was started by the British who unjustly gave land that belonged to the Palestinians to the Jewish Zionists. It was the British who sparked a civil war and then they went away without resolving the shit they started. And WE supported the British the whole ****ing way.
My view is that it has been over two decades. How much longer are we to wait? Do you have a number?
Second of all, have a broader perspective on things and you won’t have these views. It’s not about terrorism going up because of Jerusalem being gifted to the Israelis and taken from the West Bank, it’s because of the weakening of the Palestinian authority and the strengthening of Hamas.
Originally posted by Firefly218
First of all, **** the dea that WE are having to wait on anything. We created this problem. The entire conflict was started by the British who unjustly gave land that belonged to the Palestinians to the Jewish Zionists. It was the British who sparked a civil war and then they went away without resolving the shit they started. And WE supported the British the whole ****ing way.Second of all, have a broader perspective on things and you won’t have these views. It’s not about terrorism going up because of Jerusalem being gifted to the Israelis and taken from the West Bank, it’s because of the weakening of the Palestinian authority and the strengthening of Hamas.
I do get what you're saying, but IMO I just think enough is enough. How much longer does the WORLD wait then?
Originally posted by Surtur
But yes I WILL say people who are going to go murder others because the city that contains the Israeli parliament was finally named the capital are pieces of shit.
That does not make the innocent people murdered in the resulting conflict any less dead, or this strategy an effective way to achieve the stated goal.
If the goal is to achieve peace, or minimally, end conflict, this strategy does neither of those. In fact, it does the exact opposite of what it purports to set out to do.
So tell me, why this is a good plan? Because "doing something different to do something different" is not a good enough justification when people are going to be killed.
Originally posted by Robtard
Yo, surt. How do you justify an act that experts are saying will lead to MORE innocent deaths, on the "he's trying something different" reasoning?
I say that it's the terrorists that will be out there murdering innocent people over this. I say we should not base our decisions on how Islamic terrorists will react. I do not want any innocent people to die. If they do that is on the piece of shit terrorists.
Originally posted by SurturThe World are not the victims of this conflict, nothing is happening to us. There is no burden on a Brit or an American. The Israelis and the Palestinians are the victims, and we should have the moral integrity to not be bribed by the corrupt Israeli government into choosing sides.
I do get what you're saying, but IMO I just think enough is enough. How much longer does the WORLD wait then?
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
That does not make the innocent people murdered in the resulting conflict any less dead, or this strategy an effective way to achieve the stated goal.If the goal is to achieve peace, or minimally, end conflict, this strategy does neither of those. In fact, it does the exact opposite of what it purports to set out to do.
So tell me, why this is a good plan? Because "doing something different to do something different" is not a good enough justification when people are going to be killed.
You keep citing this "doing something different!" thing. That isn't why I agree. Some people might be constantly bringing that up, but not me. If I said it once it is not something I'm using a lot.
I look at the situation, I look at what Congress decided in 1995. I see presidents promised and then backed out. I see 22 years having passed.
And it comes down to Islam. We all know what it means when experts talk about violence occurring. We all know who will be behind it. And yes, these savages will kill innocent people and try to use this as an excuse.
I don't know what else to tell you. I don't want people to die, but I do not want us to let an abhorrent religion dictate the decisions we make.
Originally posted by Firefly218
The World are not the victims of this conflict, nothing is happening to us. There is no burden on a Brit or an American. The Israelis and the Palestinians are the victims, and we should have the moral integrity to not be bribed by the corrupt Israeli government into choosing sides.
Okay man, I get it, I really do, I just want to know if you have a number. It has been 22 years, how many more?
Originally posted by Surtur
I say that it's the terrorists that will be out there murdering innocent people over this. I say we should not base our decisions on how Islamic terrorists will react. I do not want any innocent people to die. If they do that is on the piece of shit terrorists.
"I do not want innocent people to be harmed, but I am going to corner this dangerous animal. I know this will frighten it, but if it hurts anyone, that is its fault, and not mine. I could not have possibly deployed any other strategy that would have resolved this conflict in a way that would have reduced harm to the animal, the bystanders, and myself. Well, at least not one that satisfies my desire to be directly confrontational and needlessly provocative and puts everyone at risk."
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
"I do not want innocent people to be harmed, but I am going to corner this dangerous animal. I know this will frighten it, but if it hurts anyone, that is its fault, and not mine. I could not have possibly deployed any other strategy that would have resolved this conflict in a way that would have reduced harm to the animal, the bystanders, and myself. Well, at least not one that satisfies my desire to be directly confrontational and needlessly provocative and puts everyone at risk."
Lol, the terrorists are savages true, but they aren't animals. Animals react purely on instinct.