Superman; Strongest member in the League?

Physically strongest? Yes. Best durability? Yes. Best stamina? Yes. Best physical stats? Yes. Most versatile? NO!

DC criminally jobs Martian Manhunter out to make the other League members (aside from Superman) look good. In fact, Jon is a one man Justice League. CL85-100 physical stats? Check. Powerful telepath? Check. Shapeshifting? Check. Density manipulation power? Check. Energy discharge powers (Martian Vision)? Check.

The most powerful League member is Superman. Jon is a distant second but no one else comes close.

J'onn can't be a distant second when Hal Jordan exists.

I'd put Jon Stewart above J'onn as well, and the Justice League cartoon agreed, putting Stewart as the number 2 on the rung.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Even if you want to use Sacrifice (which is already murky due to the mind control) at no point during the fight they have does Diana come across as being stronger than Superman.

We're trying to prove strength here, aren't we?

Like?

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
When has supes subconsciously did something without an mind

I'm not sure I understand your question.

I was talking about how, on this forum, a character that's been mind-controlled or hypnotised? Anything they do in that state cannot be considered them operating as well as they would were they in their right mind. They aren't themselves, etc.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm not sure I understand your question.

I was talking about how, on this forum, a character that's been mind-controlled or hypnotised? Anything they do in that state cannot be considered them operating as well as they would were they in their right mind. They aren't themselves, etc.

How would mind control decrease Superman's strength? I mean he thought Diana was Doomsday, and literally blitzed her FTL distance etc

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
How would mind control decrease Superman's strength? I mean he thought Diana was Doomsday, and literally blitzed her FTL distance etc

It doesn't diminish his strength, but it does diminish his use of it effectively. Superman is out of his mind with grief and rage (which the writer also said), so he isn't going to use his abilities properly.

But let's say I'm wrong; what in Sacrifice makes you think she's stronger than he is?

Originally posted by -Pr-
It doesn't diminish his strength, but it does diminish his use of it effectively. Superman is out of his mind with grief and rage (which the writer also said), so he isn't going to use his abilities properly.

But let's say I'm wrong; what in Sacrifice makes you think she's stronger than he is?

Why would Superman hold back his strength against someone who he thinks is DD? and Diana bloodied, and landed more hits imo

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Why would Superman hold back his strength against someone who he thinks is DD? and Diana bloodied, and landed more hits imo

I don't recall saying he was holding it back. Feel free to correct me.

I'm asking what about that fight scene, or any fight scene she has with him, shows evidence of her being stronger.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't recall saying he was holding it back. Feel free to correct me.

I'm asking what about that fight scene, or any fight scene she has with him, shows evidence of her being stronger.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11125/111258855/5192816-8413632426-tumbl.jpg

Also, If Superman truly is the strongest how come at full power he only gave Bruce a damage lung and bones cracked?

Now, yes Batman stated desaad treatment "dulled" Superman but it was reference to superman getting slower hence why Bruce was able to dodge the first couple of punches which he then stated he soon wouldn't be able to dodge for longer then he got punched

^Desaad also gave the instructions for superman to kill batman meaning all those punches landed were intended to kill

Superman couldn't have held back because his mind was removed from his body and his brain wasn't working
( stated he had no mind his brain wasn't even functioning synapses weren't working):

I would think someone like Diana, J'onn or other top tiers in the League would do more than that to a simple peak human like Bats

if its just strength he is the strongest. when it comes to overall power rankings, manjobber&stewart arent more than an inch far away(billy can be considered too).

N52 WW, with the GoW amp, couldn't even KO Batman without his armour and injured, even with a cheap shot.

I KNEW BATMAN WOULD BE TOP

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11125/111258855/5192816-8413632426-tumbl.jpg

Also, If Superman truly is the strongest how come at full power he only gave Bruce a damage lung and bones cracked?

Now, yes Batman stated desaad treatment "dulled" Superman but it was reference to superman getting slower hence why Bruce was able to dodge the first couple of punches which he then stated he soon wouldn't be able to dodge for longer then he got punched

^Desaad also gave the instructions for superman to kill batman meaning all those punches landed were intended to kill

Superman couldn't have held back because his mind was removed from his body and his brain wasn't working
( stated he had no mind his brain wasn't even functioning synapses weren't working):

I would think someone like Diana, J'onn or other top tiers in the League would do more than that to a simple peak human like Bats

What you're talking about is PIS. He can't kill Batman because the plot demands he doesn't.

And besides, why are THOSE feats your barometer, and not ones like him pushing Warworld, or benching Earth for days, or pulling Darkseid out of the source wall?

Originally posted by -Pr-
What you're talking about is PIS. He can't kill Batman because the plot demands he doesn't.

And besides, why are THOSE feats your barometer, and not ones like him pushing Warworld, or benching Earth for days, or pulling Darkseid out of the source wall?

lifting strength equals to striking now?

Why would pulling Darkseid out of the source wall be top tier?

PIS would be an excuse, but it's happened again and again. Do you think Darkseid would struggle to KO Batman?

Not too long ago Future Aquaman beat Bats

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11125/111258855/5192816-8413632426-tumbl.jpg

Also, If Superman truly is the strongest how come at full power he only gave Bruce a damage lung and bones cracked?

Now, yes Batman stated desaad treatment "dulled" Superman but it was reference to superman getting slower hence why Bruce was able to dodge the first couple of punches which he then stated he soon wouldn't be able to dodge for longer then he got punched

^Desaad also gave the instructions for superman to kill batman meaning all those punches landed were intended to kill

Superman couldn't have held back because his mind was removed from his body and his brain wasn't working
( stated he had no mind his brain wasn't even functioning synapses weren't working):

I would think someone like Diana, J'onn or other top tiers in the League would do more than that to a simple peak human like Bats

Superman could have heat visioned Batman or decapitate him with a slap.

Everything you mentioned here is PIS. The same way Zoom recently blitz'ed Batman but someone batman survived.

All you managed to prove in these scans is that you are lowballing, nit picking, and being biased

Even though a LOT of his fts are questionable, he is the strongest leaguer.

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11125/111258855/5192816-8413632426-tumbl.jpg

Also, If Superman truly is the strongest how come at full power he only gave Bruce a damage lung and bones cracked?

Now, yes Batman stated desaad treatment "dulled" Superman but it was reference to superman getting slower hence why Bruce was able to dodge the first couple of punches which he then stated he soon wouldn't be able to dodge for longer then he got punched

^Desaad also gave the instructions for superman to kill batman meaning all those punches landed were intended to kill

Superman couldn't have held back because his mind was removed from his body and his brain wasn't working
( stated he had no mind his brain wasn't even functioning synapses weren't working):

I would think someone like Diana, J'onn or other top tiers in the League would do more than that to a simple peak human like Bats

This isn't the first time this happened. 🙂

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Diana beating a bloodlusted superman mind controlled by maxwell is just one example.

What's yours?

She did it with strength? He broke her arm like a twig and oneshotted her across sun to earth.

Originally posted by carver9
This isn't the first time this happened. 🙂

oh, definately not. only way you can defend this instance is if supes shown to act subconsciously with a mind

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
oh, definately not. only way you can defend this instance is if supes shown to act subconsciously with a mind

Batman has straight up embarrassed Wonder Woman in h2h while she was amped by a demon BTW.