Originally posted by Jaggarath
[B]A dark side nexus weakening Satele Shan's battle meditation (note Bastila Shan's greatest display of battle meditation is on the Star Forge)
Do you have evidence that Satele Shan's BM > the Yavin IV nexus that she considered incomprehensibly strong? If you have proof as you imply that her BM > Bastila's BM > Star Forge nexus > Yavin IV nexus, feel free to provide it.
=/= Revan's spirit explicitly ("I am with you. Be strong."😉 taking an active role to aid the coalition strike teams.
Revan's spirit was so weak he couldn't even appear directly in front of dark! Revan until he had been defeated. It isn't obvious that his passive buffs and a one-time phoenix down if we take game mechanics literally would make him more powerful than Yavin IV's nexus. Would Satele Shan consider weak light! Revan who struggles to affect the physical world incomprehensibly strong as she does Yavin IV?
Do you have evidence that Satele Shan's BM > the Yavin IV nexus that she considered incomprehensibly strong? If you have proof as you imply that her BM > Bastila's BM > Star Forge nexus > Yavin IV nexus, feel free to provide it.
I'm saying only Satele Shan's battle meditation itself will be hindered by the Yavin 4 nexus.
Revan's spirit was so weak he couldn't even appear directly in front of dark! Revan until he had been defeated.
I'm not sure what you're implying here, but spirit Revan obviously couldn't confront Revan directly because he'd be destroyed.
It isn't obvious that his passive buffs and a one-time phoenix down if we take game mechanics literally would make him more powerful than Yavin IV's nexus.
The two are so different in nature (active aid versus a passive decrease in one party member's powers) that I don't see how you can possibly compare them.
Originally posted by Jaggarath
Let's see:NEXUS:
- Weakens Satele Shan's battle meditation
Makes Revan himself far stronger, weakens all the light siders in the party, weakens spirit Revan.
SPIRIT REVAN:
- An invisible force defending and resurrecting the coalition strike team
Well you seem to be assuming that a weakened spirit who struggles to manifest physically is more important than a dampener on battle meditation (and everything else the nexus is doing). Why, aside from appealing to incredulity? A onetime resurrection is cool but not obviously better than a nexus on the other side.
After edit:
Originally posted by Jaggarath
Satele Shan just is only contributing +5 BM points instead of +10, but the +5 is noted to have an extreme effect anyway, [b]"greatly increasing" the team. [/B]
There's no reason to think that this description is "greatly increasing" AFTER subtracting the nexus but rather as an independent buff that is also being hindered by the nexus, but that isn't necessarily the only thing the nexus is doing.
Makes Revan himself far stronger, weakens all the light siders in the party, weakens spirit Revan.
You're being hilariously misleading, but I guess that's not a surprise.
The only character that we can verifiably say was weakened is Satele Shan. However, given that Satele Shan is using battle meditation anyway, it doesn't matter. Despite the nexus, her battle meditation still "greatly increased" all the coalition strike team, meaning characters like Darth Marr were double-amped. Further, given the effects of battle meditation, Revan was likely negative effected by Shan's battle meditation as well.
Your claim that Revan benefits from the nexus is easily debatable, given Revan uses both sides of the Force equally to ragdoll the coalition strike team. Also, considering Revan's injuries just sustained from the Temple of Sacrifice fight, such as a one kilometer-destroying blast overloading inside of him and his Force essence being violently stripped, coupled with the potential negative effects of the battle meditation, it's likely Revan was operating at significantly less than normal if anything.
There's no reason to think that this description is "greatly increasing" AFTER subtracting the nexus but rather as an independent buff that is also being hindered by the nexus, but that isn't necessarily the only thing the nexus is doing.
It's stating the battle meditation is "greatly increasing the combat effectiveness" of each party member as an active effect on each member. It clearly factors it in.
Well you seem to be assuming that a weakened spirit who struggles to manifest physically.
???
Originally posted by Jaggarath
You're being hilariously misleading, but I guess that's not a surprise.
don't relapse bro
The only character that we can verifiably say was weakened is Satele Shan.
Ah yes, the Smuglander was unaffected
It's stating the battle meditation is "greatly increasing the combat effectiveness" of each party member as an active effect on each member. It clearly factors it in.
This doesn't counter my point at all. "Greatly increasing" =/= "increasing more than this external source is decreasing or increasing the other party"
Your claim that Revan benefits from the nexus is easily debatable, given Revan uses both sides of the Force equally to ragdoll the coalition strike team.
Alright all trolling aside:
Nobody is forcing Revan to do that. Given that the dark side would be far stronger on Yavin IV, particularly where they are fighting, Revan is obviously going to use the dark side more frequently. You can point to ONE technique he uses that, if we take the gameplay mechanics literally, uses the light side, and then a bunch of stuff that is quite clearly of a dark side nature. If you wish to confine the part of the fight that is an unambiguous feat to unamped Revan to Revan being able to overpower Darth Marr, Lana Beniko and some non-Force sensitives using the light side, OK cool.
But the rest of everything Revan does in SoR is done on a nexus. It isn't just some sort of weaksauce troll nexus we use to say that Bane dies, it is a nexus Satele states to be "incomprehensibly" strong and wherein its power has been a plot point across multiple narratives (e.g. Exar Kun). Is this nexus more "powerful" than spirit Revan? What about strafing runs? Or Revan being injured by a backlash? We can't say for sure, but it doesn't strike me as implausible. Specifically all the claims about him being able to hold his body together (clearly a dark side power given light side Revan's monologues about it)* are suspect. Yes, this is off-topic, but you get the point.
* That's another key point here - the claim that the DS nexus is balanced out by {BM, etc.} only works in judging the fight as a whole, but not necessarily if you want to wank specific techniques Revan uses.