Originally posted by Galan007
Tbf, Vader/Anakin doing so is even more "wtf".At least Ben had trained under Luke for a number of years before the events of the ST... Vader somehow managed to become a Force Spirit on the fly, without ever receiving any training/guidance in that area.
Didn't Obi-Wan/Yoda teach him when he died?
Canon hasn't said anything definitive, but yeah, they must have taught him the ability postmortem(akin to how Qui-Gon learned), because his physical body didn't sublimate into the Force when he died.
...But Anakin learning how to fully manifest himself as an actual spirit(and not just a disembodied voice) a few hours after he died is pretty crazy. I get that he's the Chosen One and a prodigy, but damn...
So evidently "The Doctrine of the Dyad" predates even the Sith Rule of Two...
"The Emperor gasped. Stared at his hands, which hand begun knitting themselves back together, bones regrowing, pale flesh closing over them. "The life-force of your bond," he said, his voice tingled with wonder. "A Dyad in the Force!"
His gleeful triumphant thoughts washed over Rey, as she struggled against his grip, unable to move. He had won. At last. All those years, all that searching. He'd tried to create a Dyad with Anakin, as his Master had tried to create one with him. The Rule of Two, a Master always in search of a yet more powerful apprentice, was a pale imitation, an unworthy but necessary successor to the older, purer Doctrine of the Dyad.
"Unseen for generations," he crowed. "And now the power of two restores the one true Emperor!"
He raised his perfect, healed hands, and called on all the dark power of the Force and the Sith who had come before him, and pulled their life from their very bodies. It poured from them like a river of light, leaving them weaker and weaker.
The Emperor laughed as his body strengthened, became whole. The milky film faded from his eyes, revealing golden irises around obsidian pupils."
So they’ve retcon the Rule of Two now with the Dyad nonsense...
😂
**** Disney.
Originally posted by Galan007
There's no way he couldn't have known. Even if he wasn't part of the storygroup, this info has been exploding the internet the past few days.
And yet he didn’t. He even dismissed it initially as click bait nonsense.
Originally posted by ares834The Rule of Two is now the second-string("unworthy"😉 variation of The Doctrine of the Dyad. So essentially, when the Sith realized how hard it was to create a Dyad in the Force, they adopted the RoT out of necessity.
So they've retcon the Rule of Two now with the Dyad nonsense...😂
**** Disney.
...Because god forbid they just keep the Dyad BS between Rey and Ben. ermm
Originally posted by ares834That's really f*cking bad. 😘
And yet he didn't. He even dismissed it initially as click bait nonsense.
Originally posted by Galan007So creating a dyad is always a Sith's main goal with their apprentices?
So evidently "The Doctrine of the Dyad" predates even the Sith Rule of Two..."The Emperor gasped. Stared at his hands, which hand begun knitting themselves back together, bones regrowing, pale flesh closing over them. "The life-force of your bond," he said, his voice tingled with wonder. "A Dyad in the Force!"
His gleeful triumphant thoughts washed over Rey, as she struggled against his grip, unable to move. He had won. At last. All those years, all that searching. He'd tried to create a Dyad with Anakin, as his Master had tried to create one with him. The Rule of Two, a Master always in search of a yet more powerful apprentice, was a pale imitation, an unworthy but necessary successor to the older, purer Doctrine of the Dyad.
"Unseen for generations," he crowed. "And now the power of two restores the one true Emperor!"
He raised his perfect, healed hands, and called on all the dark power of the Force and the Sith who had come before him, and pulled their life from their very bodies. It poured from them like a river of light, leaving them weaker and weaker.
The Emperor laughed as his body strengthened, became whole. The milky film faded from his eyes, revealing golden irises around obsidian pupils."
Plaguies tried creating one with Sidious, and Sidious tried creating one with Anakin. When they couldn't create a dyad, they just went with the Rule of Two.
Quite a revelation. 😕
Originally posted by Galan007
👆Seems like the main difference is that Force bonds can be initiated at will, whereas these Dyads just sort of happen naturally and can't really be learned. Does that seem about right?
Force bonds happen naturally too as far as I remember. But sounds about right, that and Sith could also have bonds too, wasn’t just a Jedi thing.
Originally posted by Eli VantoYep.
So creating a dyad is always a Sith's main goal with their apprentices?
But because Dyads are evidently nigh-impossible for Sith to create, they use the less-preferable Rule of Two.
Originally posted by Zenwolf👆
Force bonds happen naturally too as far as I remember. But sounds about right, that and Sith could also have bonds too, wasn’t just a Jedi thing.
Originally posted by Galan007
Yep.But because Dyads are evidently nigh-impossible for Sith to create, they use the less-preferable Rule of Two.
👆
Yeah from what I've read on the Wookiee(I know, not too reliable, but the basis I mean)...Canon has Force bond separate from Dyad, the Bond in Canon can only have the pair connected and communicate across distances. The Dyad seems to be that amplifying aspect or whatever.
....So Canon essentially took Force Bond from Legends and split it in two because....reasons?
Yeah, Luke explained bonds a bit in Secrets of the Jedi. Funnily enough, he lists it under "Dark Force Abilities":
https://i.imgur.com/qdEOaXi.jpg
The bond itself is relatively benign, and essentially just allows the users to communicate across vast distances, sense each other's feelings, etc., but they are also very exploitable -- like when Palpatine used the bond between Yoda and Dooku to project the illusion into Yoda's mind to try and break him in TCW S06.
Dyad connections, however, not only amp the users' powers/abilities, but they can also inextricably teleport/materialize the users across galactic distances and have them occupy the same space, pass matter back and forth, etc. Based on what we saw with Rey and Ben(who had barely even scratched the surface of the ability), I imagine that a perfected Dyad connection would allow for absolutely ridiculous shenanigans to take place... Which is likely why the Sith always tried to create Dyads with their apprentices first.
One of the other leaked quotes implies that Plagueis also knew how to preform essence transfer, but wasn't able to when Sidious killed him because he didn't have any vessels ready.
So I wonder how far back that ability goes, and how many Sith knew it? I also have to wonder HOW Sidious was able to gather the power of every Sith before him?
Well, it sort of makes sense if you think about it. The only reason is doesn't work is because it comes out of nowhere and they have to have these breaks in the text just to explain what's going on.
The same can be said for a bunch of stupid things about this movie: Palpatine coming back, the way he looks, being "all the sith," etc. I'm open to the ideas, had they executed them properly.
Originally posted by ZentrexAs much as I love Sidious wank, they should not have brought him back.
Well, it sort of makes sense if you think about it. The only reason is doesn't work is because it comes out of nowhere and they have to have these breaks in the text just to explain what's going on.The same can be said for a bunch of stupid things about this movie: Palpatine coming back, the way he looks, being "all the sith," etc. I'm open to the ideas, had they executed them properly.
Originally posted by Sheev
As much as I love Sidious wank, they should not have brought him back.
I still can't get over the fact....Abrams could have literally undone Snoke's death with the cloning thing and yet...he didn't. ...He had the means to continue off of TFA, the movie he made....but didn't...just...uughh...
