Who truly has the faster reaction speed: Supes or Diana

Originally posted by TGATES
He may actually be. It may be like 1-2 mph. By how much is he faster? That is the central issue. Is it enough to matter? Has it mattered in the past?

I think writer intent puts them equal since she he is able to blitz her ala Sacrafice but the fight took a turn. Diana got more clean punches off Superman.

It's usually blow for blow or Diana getting more licks. This would not happen if writers want him to be significantly faster when they meet, not in other scenarios from other books.

Same with "For Tomorrow". He blitz, but it didn't really do anything to change the tide of the fight. She still uses speed to kick the shit out of him. Why didn't he didn't dodge the kick if she is significantly faster? Why didn't he dodge her tiara when she slit his throat? We can go back and say "oh she wasn't able to get brackets up before he blitz her to the sun". We could also say she is faster or just as fast since she was able to slit his throat.

In each and every fight, he simple is not able to get more licks off of her.

We also need to take into consideration how Cheetah( a reg WW villain) scales to Superman and other speedsters.

Writers intend for her to be as fast or faster when they fight. It's been like that almost all the time.

Superman has enemies that can keep up with him too. That can keep up with Wonder Woman, so I wouldn't say Cheetah is in a league of her own.

Superman has done just fine against her in the past. Even in Sacrifice, when he's compromised, he'd still easily fast enough to keep up with her if not faster. In For Tomorrow he, if we're being honest, kind of embarassed her, and it wasn't like they were just sparring.

If you want to argue that the gap between them isn't really that big either way, I'm honestly not going to argue with you. I actually like the idea of them, in reflexes at least, being pretty close.

The problem is the multitude of "Superman builds x really fast" feats, and he has considerably more of those than Diana does. And they do translate to combat ability.

Originally posted by carver9
Diana always tend to seem near untouchable when facing Kryptonians. You will probably find a couple of instances where she does get tag but majority of the time, she overwhelms them with her speed.

Originally posted by carver9
This is what Wonder Woman is doing...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/comicnewbies.com/2015/12/30/superman-and-wonder-woman-vs-dichara/amp/

Just like she did against Eradicator just now? Or random daxamites?

Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
being genetically superior to an amped Daxamite

only league member to beat eradicator after evolving past the JL capability to harm him...

defeated phantom stranger

She'd molly whoop Superman at this point

Originally posted by TGATES

WOW! I mean WOW.

Blitzing Cheetah!

Bullrushing Cheetah and bearhugging her is blitzing now?

Originally posted by TGATES
He may actually be. It may be like 1-2 mph. By how much is he faster? That is the central issue. Is it enough to matter? Has it mattered in the past?

I think writer intent puts them equal since she he is able to blitz her ala Sacrafice but the fight took a turn. Diana got more clean punches off Superman.

It's usually blow for blow or Diana getting more licks. This would not happen if writers want him to be significantly faster when they meet, not in other scenarios from other books.

Same with "For Tomorrow". He blitz, but it didn't really do anything to change the tide of the fight. She still uses speed to kick the shit out of him. Why didn't he didn't dodge the kick if she is significantly faster? Why didn't he dodge her tiara when she slit his throat? We can go back and say "oh she wasn't able to get brackets up before he blitz her to the sun". We could also say she is faster or just as fast since she was able to slit his throat.

In each and every fight, he simple is not able to get more licks off of her.

We also need to take into consideration how Cheetah( a reg WW villain) scales to Superman and other speedsters.

Writers intend for her to be as fast or faster when they fight. It's been like that almost all the time.

This was while Vixen had drained him of his powers BTW.

Even in the speed department by the writer, she has been consistently left out. Like in human race, she isn't among the top five fastest beings without Wally, Superman is.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-pg_qjO-2YJ4/VnuwiWzF_fI/AAAAAAAAa80/c7XcNg0Cb6A/s1600-Ic42/RCO014.jpg

Cue the current speed rankings where Wonder Woman is several steps behind Superman.

So no, the writers don't think she is as fast as Superman, not even close.

Originally posted by carver9
That same Cheetah blitzed the entire JLA.

Originally posted by carver9
That same Cheetah blitzed the entire JLA.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Superman has enemies that can keep up with him too. That can keep up with Wonder Woman, so I wouldn't say Cheetah is in a league of her own.

Superman has done just fine against her in the past. Even in Sacrifice, when he's compromised, he'd still easily fast enough to keep up with her if not faster. In For Tomorrow he, if we're being honest, kind of embarassed her, and it wasn't like they were just sparring.

If you want to argue that the gap between them isn't really that big either way, I'm honestly not going to argue with you. I actually like the idea of them, in reflexes at least, being pretty close.

The problem is the multitude of "Superman builds x really fast" feats, and he has considerably more of those than Diana does. And they do translate to combat ability.

They chose not to write her that way, but when she and supes square off, and all abilities considered, his feats of speed don't really tip the battles in his favor.

I don't see how he embarrassed her when she sheild slid and kicked the crap out of him into the sky. He didn't counter it. She did similar to him when she was going to save Steve Trevor and he did not block or duck. If someone is fighting me, I would hope they fight me back if I pull a dagger lol. Point is, it wasn't one sided. It was blow for blow.

Just imagine if she had used the weapon to it's maximum extent. It's almost certain death or severe injury.

May be they should better explain WW speed. They make special references to supes as far time taken (picosecond etc). But that still doesn't tip the scale. We would have to accept, at the very least, that in order for ww to land a single clean blow, her hands and feet have to be moving faster than supes can perceive for fight between them to be remotely interesting.

Maybe references need to be made concerning the nature of ww speed to make it more believable for people. The lack feats and references is what's killing her lol.

We have to assume that since she can keep up, that she is close or superior in some cases for her to get as many clean shots, parrying shots, plus blocking light-based attacks all at the same time reaching for weapons such as lasso etc would imply equal or greater reaction speed, skill, and dexterity with weapons. She did that with supergirl and supes. Might imply greater speed since she had to reach for weapon, get it out, aim all before Kara got her HV off.

In her fight with supes she was blocking supes punches, dodging HV at close range all while using a flexie weapon which hard to do lol. Speed, skill, and dexterity.

Originally posted by TGATES
They chose not to write her that way, but when she and supes square off, and all abilities considered, his feats of speed don't really tip the battles in his favor.

I don't see how he embarrassed her when she sheild slid and kicked the crap out of him into the sky. He didn't counter it. She did similar to him when she was going to save Steve Trevor and he did not block or duck. If someone is fighting me, I would hope they fight me back if I pull a dagger lol. Point is, it wasn't one sided. It was blow for blow.

Just imagine if she had used the weapon to it's maximum extent. It's almost certain death or severe injury.

May be they should better explain WW speed. They make special references to supes as far time taken (picosecond etc). But that still doesn't tip the scale. We would have to accept, at the very least, that in order for ww to land a single clean blow, her hands and feet have to be moving faster than supes can perceive for fight between them to be remotely interesting.

Maybe references need to be made concerning the nature of ww speed to make it more believable for people. The lack feats and references is what's killing her lol.

We have to assume that since she can keep up, that she is close or superior in some cases for her to get as many clean shots, parrying shots, plus blocking light-based attacks all at the same time reaching for weapons such as lasso etc would imply equal or greater reaction speed, skill, and dexterity with weapons. She did that with supergirl and supes. Might imply greater speed since she had to reach for weapon, get it out, aim all before Kara got her HV off.

In her fight with supes she was blocking supes punches, dodging HV at close range all while using a flexie weapon which hard to do lol. Speed, skill, and dexterity.

You can replace Superman with Batman and it's just as relevant. WW has never moved faster than Batman can perceive in their fights, certainly not in n52.

And it's interesting to note that in the example some people use for Cheetah (Carver), Cheetah wasn't moving faster than Batman could perceive.

Does that mean Batman is equal to WW? Of course not. It means the writers were creating a sexy fight scene readers will enjoy.

Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it isn't. Superman has been able to blitz Parasite, remove him from the ground so fast that Cheetah couldn't even react to him.

This was while Vixen had drained him of his powers BTW.

Even in the speed department by the writer, she has been consistently left out. Like in human race, she isn't among the top five fastest beings without Wally, Superman is.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-pg_qjO-2YJ4/VnuwiWzF_fI/AAAAAAAAa80/c7XcNg0Cb6A/s1600-Ic42/RCO014.jpg

Cue the current speed rankings where Wonder Woman is several steps behind Superman.

So no, the writers don't think she is as fast as Superman, not even close.

Cheetah is FAST and WW battles her regularly.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B6nhyERIUAALxBW?format=jpg

Ignoring counter-evidence and doubling down with more of the same doesn't really change anything. For example, you've got a post of Cheetah taking down Batman and saying WW fights her often. But there are posts of Batman keeping up with and even outfighting Diana.

Originally posted by TGATES
They chose not to write her that way, but when she and supes square off, and all abilities considered, his feats of speed don't really tip the battles in his favor.

I don't see how he embarrassed her when she sheild slid and kicked the crap out of him into the sky. He didn't counter it. She did similar to him when she was going to save Steve Trevor and he did not block or duck. If someone is fighting me, I would hope they fight me back if I pull a dagger lol. Point is, it wasn't one sided. It was blow for blow.

Just imagine if she had used the weapon to it's maximum extent. It's almost certain death or severe injury.

May be they should better explain WW speed. They make special references to supes as far time taken (picosecond etc). But that still doesn't tip the scale. We would have to accept, at the very least, that in order for ww to land a single clean blow, her hands and feet have to be moving faster than supes can perceive for fight between them to be remotely interesting.

Maybe references need to be made concerning the nature of ww speed to make it more believable for people. The lack feats and references is what's killing her lol.

We have to assume that since she can keep up, that she is close or superior in some cases for her to get as many clean shots, parrying shots, plus blocking light-based attacks all at the same time reaching for weapons such as lasso etc would imply equal or greater reaction speed, skill, and dexterity with weapons. She did that with supergirl and supes. Might imply greater speed since she had to reach for weapon, get it out, aim all before Kara got her HV off.

In her fight with supes she was blocking supes punches, dodging HV at close range all while using a flexie weapon which hard to do lol. Speed, skill, and dexterity.

In theory, I actually agree with large parts of what you're saying, and I don't doubt that Diana is incredibly fast.

As far as For Tomorrow goes, I would argue that if nothing else, it proved that she's not too fast for him.

The problem for me is that we go by feats, as opposed to what/how we think the characters should be written.

Originally posted by KingD19
Ignoring counter-evidence and doubling down with more of the same doesn't really change anything. For example, you've got a post of Cheetah taking down Batman and saying WW fights her often. But there are posts of Batman keeping up with and even outfighting Diana.

No PIS/Full capacity rule is violated by batman WW. We know ww can beat batman easily since he is a reg human. Cheetah is consistent with rule as well.

Comics are inconsistent. There is either a point of reference for their speed or there isn't.

Originally posted by -Pr-
In theory, I actually agree with large parts of what you're saying, and I don't doubt that Diana is incredibly fast.

As far as For Tomorrow goes, I would argue that if nothing else, it proved that she's not too fast for him.

The problem for me is that we go by feats, as opposed to what/how we think the characters should be written.

Cool.

I think going by scaling and writer intent when they square off or fight similar or the same foes is a good point of reference.

I know they had her beating him in Wonder Woman: Dead Earth.

Originally posted by TGATES
No PIS/Full capacity rule is violated by batman WW. We know ww can beat batman easily since he is a reg human. Cheetah is consistent with rule as well.

Comics are inconsistent. There is either a point of reference for their speed or there isn't.

Why is it PIS for BatmanWW and not PIS for Superman/WW?

Originally posted by TGATES
Cheetah is FAST and WW battles her regularly.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B6nhyERIUAALxBW?format=jpg

She Sucker punched both Superman and Flash, actually got beat up by Aquaman later.

Amped by Zoom, Wally took away her amp.

Question to old-timers.

Is TGATES = fangirl = nvrbeenthatgirl?

Wonder Woman has no other fans on the whole Internet, as far as I know.

Heck Steve Trevor oneshotted Cheetah along with Green Arrow.

Superman.

Originally posted by abhilegend
She Sucker punched both Superman and Flash, actually got beat up by Aquaman later.

Amped by Zoom, Wally took away her amp.

No she didn't and if you're faster, how can you sucker punch/hit someone? Stop.