Pre-SSS Steve Rogers vs Arthur Fleck Joker
Let's run Steve before he became Cap vs Arthur Fleck Joker:
R1: H2H
R2: Steve has the trash can lid, Joker has a knife
R3: Steve has his basic training rifle (M1 Garand?) and Arthur has whatever pistol he used to kill MurrAY.
Battleground is the alleyway where Steve gets beat up until Bucky clocks the bully in the First Avenger, and both combatants can also use whatever is lying around.
By that logic the guy that was shown kicking Steve’s butt in FIRST AVENGER should have just breathed on him and won.
Steve wasn’t average, even pre SSS.
That same guy that was pummeling Steve would have ended Joker w. one punch.
I'm going to have to strongly disagree on some random guy "ending" Joker with one punch. He was weak but he wasn't that weak. If he was, he wouldn't have been able to still pull out his gun and kill these guys while they were beating on him:
And the gif I posted is from The First Avenger. So, whether it makes sense or not, that's what the writers chose to include.
Originally posted by riv6672
By that logic the guy that was shown kicking Steve’s butt in FIRST AVENGER should have just breathed on him and won.
Steve wasn’t average, even pre SSS.
That same guy that was pummeling Steve would have ended Joker w. one punch.
What am I supposed to be looking at here? I see Steve, with a phucking weapon no less, getting his ass beat with contemptuous ease by some normal looking dude. Lazily. With zero effort.
Who has Arthur lost to in a fist fight to justify you thinking a five foot tall asthmatic weakling with chronic health problems would beat his ass?
He got jumped by like five teenagers after having a piece of wood shattered over his face while he was running full-sprint into it. Not a single one of you who have posted in this thread would have performed noticeably better under the same circumstance.
And then what? He gets beat up by three grown men after being sucker-punched in the middle of a giggling panic attack.
Compare to Steve who got beat down with zero effort by a single random dude despite the fact that it was a "fair fight", at least as fair as it could be given that Steve is a genetic dead-end and one of God's mistakes.
Let us not also forget that Arthur is physically resilient enough to get hit hard enough by a taxi while sprinting to crack the windshield, and then keep sprinting along as if nothing happened. He also is only briefly knocked out after an ambulance t-bones the police car he's in on the side he's sitting in, and is perfectly fine afterwards. And of course he nearly strangled Alfred. I wonder if Steve with his weak girly short arms and small hands could have done the same?
Arthur isn't a badass by any real standard but when you put him up against a literal dead by thirty five foot tall weakling like pre-SSS Steve? Heart or no heart Steve gets his ass beat. And you've convinced me that Arthur wins round two as well.
Originally posted by NemeBro
He got jumped by like five teenagers after having a piece of wood shattered over his face while he was running full-sprint into it. Not a single one of you who have posted in this thread would have performed noticeably better under the same circumstance.
I was actually going to post about this bit as well, but figured the scene with the three guys in the subway train was already enough to get the point across. And I'm lazy.
Because I rewatched that scene with the teens in the alleyway as well. And, with more consideration, I think that was also partly down to Arthur's mental state there that he didn't do more. Because he was too much of a pu$$y to stand up for himself at the beginning of the film, and pretty much just started crying when the kids started kicking him. In contrast, in the vid I posted where he had already changed mentally to a degree, you can actually see the shift to anger at around the 2:40 to 2:42 mark. Beginning of film Arthur probably would have just played dead.