Planet Godzilla vs. Ragnarok Surtur

Originally posted by KingD19
Godzilla did tank 150 nukes dropping on him all at once. The damage was so great that the US ended up craters so wide and deep you can see them from space. That would have easily been enough to wipe out Asgard from what we see it as in the MCU.

And his atomic breath is simply insane. It puts out 3 terrawatts without him amping, which is equivalent to a 2.7 megaton nuke concentrated into a continuous beam. Also its powerful enough to destroy Ghidorahs force field which literally warps space-time around him. The beam also destroyed a black hole singularity.

So he's no pushover.

The thing about nukes vs ubersword is that the sword focused all that destructive power into a single point. I don’t remember the Godzilla movie fully (I watched it when it first came out,wasn’t that over a year ago?), but didn’t they manage to weaken/dissipate that force field with sub nuke weaponry as long as they were focusing their attacks? I really don’t see Godzilla suriving a hit from the Twilight sword.

Now as for the atomic breath, let’s say it is strong enough to blast thru Surtur. But Surt only needs maybe 2-3 steps to Godzilla to get to stabbing range. Even if we were to say that his breath would punch a hole thru Surtur, Surtur getting stabbed by Hela (with spears relatively similar to how big Zilla’s atomic breath would be compared to full sized Surt) seemed to have little to no effect on him. Wouldn’t Surtur just walk thru the damage and simply stab/slash him? This makes sense as Surtur’s body doens’t have any organs. From what can be seen, it’s just a giant body made of magma.

Now if Godzilla were to aim for the head and blast the crown off Surt, that could work. But zilla has no way of knowing this weakness.

I watched the refraction scene. It’s impressive but hard to quantify since we don’t know how tall those ranges were. Relative to godzilla, it seemed to be smaller that him or at least around the same size. This is around just above Surtur’s ankle. Defintely would give him a hotfoot but I don’t see this one shotting Surt.

I also watched Godzilla’s direct attacks vs Mechagodzilla city. Direct hits from his atomic breath was not doing damage even equal to Godzilla’s height much less Surtur’s.

Also, the movie says 3 terrawatts not terrawatt hour. The nuke is a 2.5 megatons is 3 terrawatthours. 😛

The only weakness of the shield was using a special counter interference wave that amplified the noise wavelength of the organ that generates the shield. This causes a fracture in the shield, and focusing on this fracture allows you to drop the shield for a very short time before it comes back up. And the organ only makes noise for 1/10,000th of a second.

So Surtur would have no way to bypass it.

I don’t think Surtur could tank Godzilla’s blast tbh

I was under the assumption Surtur was unbothered by Hela stabbing him because he was destined to bring about Ragnarok and once that process started, nothing could stop it.

Because before he started it, we can clearly see he feels pain as both Thor and Hulk fighting him caused him obvious discomfort. Imagine if Godzilla blasts him with a beam that can destroy a massive forcefield that actively warps space-time around Ghidorah to keep him safe, and simultaneously destroy a black hole/singularity.

Also Odin was able to take the Eternal Flame from Surtur after defeating him in a battle, so it's not like he's unbeatable.

Originally posted by KingD19
The only weakness of the shield was using a special counter interference wave that amplified the noise wavelength of the organ that generates the shield. This causes a fracture in the shield, and focusing on this fracture allows you to drop the shield for a very short time before it comes back up. And the organ only makes noise for 1/10,000th of a second.

So Surtur would have no way to bypass it.

Yeah, I remember that now after rewatching a few scenes in Netflix. XD

Except Godzilla’s shield has never taken a continent busting hit before from a physical piercing weapon that focuses all that power in a single hit.

I mean they even mentioned in the briefing that they’ve breached the shield before (w/c is how they found out about his regenerative abilities) so it def not indestructible.

The best it has taken are thermonuclear strikes w/c are firecrackers compared to what it would take to explode a freakin continent sized planet in a single shot.

Originally posted by KingD19
I was under the assumption Surtur was unbothered by Hela stabbing him because he was destined to bring about Ragnarok and once that process started, nothing could stop it.

Because before he started it, we can clearly see he feels pain as both Thor and Hulk fighting him caused him obvious discomfort. Imagine if Godzilla blasts him with a beam that can destroy a massive forcefield that actively warps space-time around Ghidorah to keep him safe, and simultaneously destroy a black hole/singularity.

Also Odin was able to take the Eternal Flame from Surtur after defeating him in a battle, so it's not like he's unbeatable.

That is a bit of a logical stretch, tho. You may be right, tho. But in the end we can only argue on what is explicitly shown. Hela stabbed him, he was mostly unbothered. We can of course create headcanon on why he was unbothered by it, but we cannot argue those as facts.

Again, didn’t say Surtur would deflect the beams. I said the beams could pierce him right thru. But getting pierced (by stabby things or beams) didn’t really do much to Surtur. And when the beams DID explode (such as when he was hitting Mechagodzilla city) the explosions were big but relative to Surtur, those were firecracker sized. W/c makes sense. 3TW’s for a few seconds beam would be around a couple of kilotons of power (around 1/10th of Nagsaski).

Would hurt, no doubt. But with the scale we are looking at, I don’t see the breath one shotting Surtur. It is either piercing thru (to about the slightly better effect as Hela’s spears) or exploding (w/c will hurt but will not take down Surtur, Surt will probably lose a good chunk of foot/lef though).

Hulk definitely made him flinch when Mega Surt was still in his smaller size (Thor did not attack him though). He was much much bigger by the time he was full sized. And Hulk making him flinch is as much of an uber “feat” for Hulk than it is a low “feat” for Surtur (kinda like Thor moving those gigantic rings around Nidavellir). And Surtur has grown much larger by the time he was Asgard-busting in size. There are just some senseless “feats” in the MCU.

I mean, let’s look at the star “feat”, according to the science guy (https://youtu.be/bOLOBJSJL0I) Thor tanked 2x 10^20J. That is, (to my math, correct me if I am wrong) 800,000x more energy than Godzilla’s atomic breath. And Hela, someone who is supposed to be superior to Thor in every way, was one shot by Surtur’s sword. Of course, don’t take this comparison literally, just take it as a means of understanding that some absurd “feats” do exist. So Hulk moving Mega Surtur should just be taken in stride and not used to lowball Surtur.

The problem I have with this fight is the sense of scale. Godzilla is just so much smaller than Surtur. With Surtur being able to deal so much more damage than what Godzilla has ever been shown to take.

I’m not saying Surtur wins (yet). But for now, I see a much closer fight than ppl are making it seem.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
That is a bit of a logical stretch, tho. You may be right, tho. But in the end we can only argue on what is explicitly shown. Hela stabbed him, he was mostly unbothered. We can of course create headcanon on why he was unbothered by it, but we cannot argue those as facts.

Again, didn’t say Surtur would deflect the beams. I said the beams could pierce him right thru. But getting pierced (by stabby things or beams) didn’t really do much to Surtur. And when the beams DID explode (such as when he was hitting Mechagodzilla city) the explosions were big but relative to Surtur, those were firecracker sized. W/c makes sense. 3TW’s for a few seconds beam would be around a couple of kilotons of power (around 1/10th of Nagsaski).

Would hurt, no doubt. But with the scale we are looking at, I don’t see the breath one shotting Surtur. It is either piercing thru (to about the slightly better effect as Hela’s spears) or exploding (w/c will hurt but will not take down Surtur, Surt will probably lose a good chunk of foot/lef though).

Hulk definitely made him flinch when Mega Surt was still in his smaller size (Thor did not attack him though). He was much much bigger by the time he was full sized. And Hulk making him flinch is as much of an uber “feat” for Hulk than it is a low “feat” for Surtur (kinda like Thor moving those gigantic rings around Nidavellir). And Surtur has grown much larger by the time he was Asgard-busting in size. There are just some senseless “feats” in the MCU.

I mean, let’s look at the star “feat”, according to the science guy (https://youtu.be/bOLOBJSJL0I) Thor tanked 2x 10^20J. That is, (to my math, correct me if I am wrong) 800,000x more energy than Godzilla’s atomic breath. And Hela, someone who is supposed to be superior to Thor in every way, was one shot by Surtur’s sword. Of course, don’t take this comparison literally, just take it as a means of understanding that some absurd “feats” do exist. So Hulk moving Mega Surtur should just be taken in stride and not used to lowball Surtur.

The problem I have with this fight is the sense of scale. Godzilla is just so much smaller than Surtur. With Surtur being able to deal so much more damage than what Godzilla has ever been shown to take.

I’m not saying Surtur wins (yet). But for now, I see a much closer fight than ppl are making it seem.

2 x 10^20J is only enough energy to destroy an island.

Divided by 800,000 times that leaves us with Godzilla only being capable of destroying a town, which, honestly, I find hard to believe, that would make this a pretty weak Godzilla, but I haven't personally seen the movies so can't comment.

Originally posted by NemeBro
2 x 10^20J is only enough energy to destroy an island.

Divided by 800,000 times that leaves us with Godzilla only being capable of destroying a town, which, honestly, I find hard to believe, that would make this a pretty weak Godzilla, but I haven't personally seen the movies so can't comment.

Well my math was a bit shoot from the hip. I kinda head-computed it. Let me do it a bit more properly.

3 terrawatt hour is 2.5 megatons. W/c if u divide it by the 3600, a terrawathour would generate .7 kiloton per second.

2x10^20J equal to 46k megatons or 46m kilotons. Divide that by the amount of time Thor was getting blasted (2min) = 383k kilotons/second.

383k/0.7 = 547,000x

I was a bit off but that’s at least how I got it. XD

Correct me if there is an error there somewhere.

It would have been easier to simply convert Watt/second to Joules tbh but I wanted to showcase the megatons aspect so ppl can have a more familiar metric to determine destructive capability.

Originally posted by KingD19
The only weakness of the shield was using a special counter interference wave that amplified the noise wavelength of the organ that generates the shield. This causes a fracture in the shield, and focusing on this fracture allows you to drop the shield for a very short time before it comes back up. And the organ only makes noise for 1/10,000th of a second.

So Surtur would have no way to bypass it.

I didn't know we had any other well versed Godzilla scholars on this site 😍😍😍 I don't have much to add, you've listed most of it.

Nibedicus is just to ****ing good tho and a lot of great points for both sides. Surturs lack of feats somehow help him and he's pretty damn big but I just don't see him being able to get past that field very easily. I dunno

Also, the movie says 3 terrawatts not terrawatt hour. The nuke is a 2.5 megatons is 3 terrawatthours.

So Godzilla's atomic breath would be significantly more powerful if he blasted out 3 terawatts in a few seconds.

Ummm as far as math goes....I have no idea.....I simply go by people's track record of seeming honest and genuine...

I would most definitely accept anything Nib puts out at face value tho. From what I have seen he is rarely biased and just enjoys the debate so I'm just gonna assume that math is fairly accurate though Earth Godzilla is way past "town" level

Math is shit for this kinda stuff. It's almost always pointless IMO.

Originally posted by ares834
So Godzilla's atomic breath would be significantly more powerful if he blasted out 3 terawatts in a few seconds.

Well yes. It’s about .7 kilotons per second. If he blasts it for 5 seconds, it’ll be around 3.5 kilotons focused in a tight beam. I don’t doubt the beam will pierce right thru Surtur. Fact is, Surtur has had ruler sized holes pierced into him via Hela. It did very little to slow him down.

I think a lot of ppl need to imagine what the scaling here is.

Imagine you are a 6 foot guy (made of magma) carrying a sword that has a tip that can create an explosion able to destroy an area around tens to hundreds of times your size.

Ten feet from you is a 6 inch Godzilla toy made of uber tough material that can shoot lazers that can punch inch sized holes thru you. Thing is, you’ve taken inch sized holes thru u before (phrasing! 😄).

This is how I see the fight. Not saying Surtur wins but just look at it from this angle.