Theory: Sith post TPM have amped powers

So I've been musing at this for a while and now I do believe it is confirmed after watching the Mortis trilogy. Dark siders were more powerful during the Rise of the Empire and Empire eras than they would have been otherwise and light siders were weaker. This applies to both canon and legends continuities.

"I think it is time we inform the senate that our ability to use the force has diminished." - Mace Windu (AOTC)

Now, as we know, the ability to use the force is directly tied to combat ability. Its why Jedi like Yoda and Anakin are the most powerful users we see in Star Wars. Originally this was thought to only apply to the shroud of the Dark Side impacting Jedi's vision. But the ROTS Junior novelization pretty much states that it does impact combat.

"Strong, this Sith Lord is, Yoda thought as their lightsabers whirled and clashed and whirled again. It should not have been a surprise. With the strength of the dark side growing, the Sith must, logically, have grown stronger, too." - ROTS Junior Novelization

Then we get to Mortis.

"You are growing stronger my son." - The Father (Altar of Mortis)

This shows that the reason the Father can no longer contain the Son is two-fold. One, yes he is getting weaker but also two the son is simply growing in power. The Daughter confirms that just proximity to conflict, fear, and anger amps his power.
"Their conflict is feeding you isn't it?" The Daughter (Altar of Mortis)

"As the balance of this world crumbles, so shall war escalate in your galaxy, as my son has descended into the Dark Side, so have the Sith gained strength."

The world itself is an anchor point to the Force. So it also makes sense that if the entire cosmic force is tilted to the Dark Side and shrouding the Jedi as Yoda says it does by AOTCs that the Sith Lord's combat power is stronger and potentially that the Jedi's power is weaker.

Basically the entire galaxy was a dark side nexus during the Rise of the Empire and likely Empire eras and that should be part of the evaluation of the feats of force users during that time period.

Suddenly the ancient Sith seem more impressive.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
So I've been musing at this for a while and now I do believe it is confirmed after watching the Mortis trilogy. Dark siders were more powerful during the Rise of the Empire and Empire eras than they would have been otherwise and light siders were weaker. This applies to both canon and legends continuities.

"I think it is time we inform the senate that our ability to use the force has diminished." - Mace Windu (AOTC)

Now, as we know, the ability to use the force is directly tied to combat ability. Its why Jedi like Yoda and Anakin are the most powerful users we see in Star Wars. Originally this was thought to only apply to the shroud of the Dark Side impacting Jedi's vision. But the ROTS Junior novelization pretty much states that it does impact combat.

"Strong, this Sith Lord is, Yoda thought as their lightsabers whirled and clashed and whirled again. It should not have been a surprise. With the strength of the dark side growing, the Sith must, logically, have grown stronger, too." - ROTS Junior Novelization

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Then we get to Mortis.

"You are growing stronger my son." - The Father (Altar of Mortis)

This shows that the reason the Father can no longer contain the Son is two-fold. One, yes he is getting weaker but also two the son is simply growing in power. The Daughter confirms that just proximity to conflict, fear, and anger amps his power.
"Their conflict is feeding you isn't it?" The Daughter (Altar of Mortis)

"As the balance of this world crumbles, so shall war escalate in your galaxy, as my son has descended into the Dark Side, so have the Sith gained strength."

The world itself is an anchor point to the Force. So it also makes sense that if the entire cosmic force is tilted to the Dark Side and shrouding the Jedi as Yoda says it does by AOTCs that the Sith Lord's combat power is stronger and potentially that the Jedi's power is weaker.

Basically the entire galaxy was a dark side nexus during the Rise of the Empire and likely Empire eras and that should be part of the evaluation of the feats of force users during that time period.

Yes, the balance on Mortis shifting towards the dark side would have undoubtedly caused the Sith in the material realm to gain power... IF The Son hadn't been destroyed.

But by the arc's end, The Ones had all been killed, which restored the 'balance' on Mortis. IOW, the Sith were never actually amped(for any substantial length of time) by The Son's descent into the dark side-

The Father's dying words: "You are the Chosen One. You have brought balance to this world..."

Originally posted by Galan007
It's logical, imo. As Palpatine's machinations were realized, and the galactic balance tipped more and more towards the dark side, it makes sense for the Sith to have gained strength as a result.

This part I don't think substantiates much, however.

Yes, the balance on Mortis shifting towards the dark side would have undoubtedly caused the Sith in the material realm to gain power... IF The Son hadn't been destroyed.

But by the arc's end, The Ones had all been killed, which restored the 'balance' on Mortis. IOW, the Sith were never actually amped(for any substantial length of time) by The Son's descent into the dark side-

The Father's dying words: "You are the Chosen One. You have brought balance to this world..."

It could have a slow domino effect on the galaxy. What happened quick on Mortis, it'd happen passively in the galaxy.

The Ones all being destroyed effectively 'balanced' Mortis, so there shouldn't have been a residual trickle effect on the rest of the galaxy(as far as the Jedi or Sith becoming more powerful is concerned.)

Originally posted by Galan007
The Ones all being destroyed effectively 'balanced' Mortis, so there shouldn't have been a residual trickle effect on the rest of the galaxy(as far as the Jedi or Sith becoming more powerful is concerned.)

The entire Mortis arc is a reflection or representation of the Prequels and the Original Trilogy. And time actually flows differently on Mortis. So you cannot tell that what happened on Mortis did not have a slow domino effect.

Originally posted by Galan007

This part I don't think substantiates much, however.

Yes, the balance on Mortis shifting towards the dark side would have undoubtedly caused the Sith in the material realm to gain power... IF The Son hadn't been destroyed.

But by the arc's end, The Ones had all been killed, which restored the 'balance' on Mortis. IOW, the Sith were never actually amped(for any substantial length of time) by The Son's descent into the dark side-

The Father's dying words: "You are the Chosen One. You have brought balance to this world..."

So what I mean here is that as the conflict on Mortis between Anakin, Obi-Wan and Ahsoka strengthened the Dark Side and the Son, it's likely that the Clone Wars the conflict in the galaxy amplified the Dark Side's power in the material world. Its likely that it increased the power of the Dark Side in the galaxy and amped the Sith. I didn't mean to imply there that the Son's temporary triumph amped the Sith.

Ah okay. Gotcha. 👆

Originally posted by Lord Stark
So what I mean here is that as the conflict on Mortis between Anakin, Obi-Wan and Ahsoka strengthened the Dark Side and the Son, it's likely that the Clone Wars the conflict in the galaxy amplified the Dark Side's power in the material world. Its likely that it increased the power of the Dark Side in the galaxy and amped the Sith. I didn't mean to imply there that the Son's temporary triumph amped the Sith.

Matthew Stover's Revenge of the Sith novel points at that in the fragment of text where Yoda faces Sidious inside the speech chambers.

The dark side was stronger because the sith, who had been controlling the dark side, became stronger. The dark side didn't just one day decide to be stronger.

So I'm not sure how it's an "amp."

Originally posted by Dominis
The dark side was stronger because the sith, who had been controlling the dark side, became stronger. The dark side didn't just one day decide to be stronger.

So I'm not sure how it's an "amp."

Not really. It is because of the Clone Wars and other galactic conflicts. Stover's ROTS novel states that much.

Originally posted by Freedon Nadd
Suddenly the ancient Sith seem more impressive.

Originally posted by Freedon Nadd
Not really. It is because of the Clone Wars and other galactic conflicts. Stover's ROTS novel states that much.

The dark side grew in strength before the clone wars, and that's because the sith grew in strength. So in a way, Plagueis and Sidious "amped" the dark side in way no other sith before has, because they were that strong with the force.

The stronger the force user, the greater the influence they have over the force, so if they are aligned with the dark side, they make the dark side stronger. That's basically what the Son was alluding to in the mortis trilogy when he said he could see his full potential in Anakin.

So it stands to reason that the dark side was never stronger than it was with Sidious, because there was no other dark side user as powerful as Sidious.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Not really. Prior to Sidious and Plagueis shifting the scales, the dark side was weaker than it had been in ancient times. This was noted in the Darth Plagueis novel. If the prominence of the dark side in the galaxy is something Sith tangibly benefit from, then most Sith Lords we know of should benefit to some degree.

All because the ancient Sith were not "troubled" with meditation like Sidious and Plagueis. I mean the old Sith were all about direct conflict and barely about making fights with The Force's midi-chlorians to tip them to the Dark Side. And the truth is that the Jedi were getting weakened because of the wars taking place in the galaxy(their ability to use The Force diminished). Sure, Plagueis and Sidious had their contribution to that too. But to say it was completely because of them(Force-wise); it is wrong.

Originally posted by Dominis
The dark side grew in strength before the clone wars, and that's because the sith grew in strength. So in a way, Plagueis and Sidious "amped" the dark side in way no other sith before has, because they were that strong with the force.

The stronger the force user, the greater the influence they have over the force, so if they are aligned with the dark side, they make the dark side stronger. That's basically what the Son was alluding to in the mortis trilogy when he said he could see his full potential in Anakin.

So it stands to reason that the dark side was never stronger than it was with Sidious, because there was no other dark side user as powerful as Sidious.

False! The Dark Side did not completely grow stronger because of Palpatine or other Sith Lords. It's quite the other way around. Their machinations and schemes(instigating wars, etc) is what led to the solidified potency of the Dark Side.

"He'd never had it. He had LOST BEFORE HE STARTED.

He had lost BEFORE HE WAS BORN.

The Sith HAD CHANGED. The Sith had GROWN, had ADAPTED, had invested a thousand years' INTENSIVE STUDY into every aspect of not only the Force but Jedi lore itself, in preparation for exactly this day. The Sith had remade themselves.

They had become new.

While the Jedi-The Jedi had spent that same millennium training to refight the last war.

The new Sith could not be destroyed with a lightsaber; they could not be burned away by any torch of the Force. The brighter his light, the darker their shadow. How could one win a war against the dark, when WAR itself had become the DARK'S OWN WEAPON?"

In conclusion, the new Sith won because they kept a low profile and used more indirect approaches to eliminate their opposition.