Originally posted by victreebelvictr
I literally just stated that I don't do that. If anything, the ESV and NIV are very much so less accurate. I included them only because they have a more present day display of the word in that context. "Evil" in the KJV context still means calamity.God created angels. Demons created demons.
Misery and evil are entirely different things. You can make somebody miserable without being evil.
Can you give me an example of Jesus's contradiction please?
https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/2-Timothy-3-16/
Never be sorry for discussing anything on this forum. I enjoy speaking of this topic anyway. 😄
Are you by chance transgender?
That's kind of my point, though. You're taking one translation as 'better' in this context because it fits your worldview. But regardless, if we do take your stance, how could anybody but God create something new? How could demons create themselves, without the approval of God? Why wouldn't God just eliminate evil? Surely he wouldn't want his enemies proliferating their corruption across his children — so why let them do it? Is he unable? In that case, he isn't all-powerful. Does he simply not want to? Then why would that be?
I didn't just say 'misery', I also said adversity, affliction, calamity, and distress. Affliction and calamity in particular seem like asburd things to create and cast upon your own children. No good parent would ever do that.
Again, this comes down to something I see an immutable: God cannot be both 'all-loving' AND 'all-powerful'. If he was both, then he'd either remove evil from the world, or make it not affect humans. As it is, he allows humans to be seduced by evil and then punishes them for it. That isn't loving at all, it's callous and cruel.
Either way, in your past metaphor of parenthood (about the three children, with two of them living bad lives and one living a good life), why is God unable to create them to be perfect? Doesn't seem all-powerful to me. "He gave them free will," some say, and I say: "But he also created free will. So why is it such an inefficient system? He created something flawed, and inflicted this half-baked concept upon his children. Doesn't seem all-powerful OR all-loving to me.
As for Jesus contradicting the Bible, there are larger points to this that I won't get into as it would require too much 'unpacking' as it were, but here are still some good examples.
Here's the best one: the Old Testament says "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" (Deuteronomy 19:21); but Jesus says: "You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also." (Matthew 5:38–39)
If Jesus is God, why would he contradict himself to such an extreme degree? I do not believe Jesus is the Abrahamic God at all, but a manifestation of a higher god than Sabaoth: the truly divine God of Good, for Jesus is a truly noble figure, unlike Sabaoth in all of his petty rage and jealousy. But if he is God, as you say, then he has majorly contradicted a part of the OT; and as you say, according to Timothy, all scripture is truth, so how does that work, exactly? How can both be the same, when Jesus mentioned the passage specifically, and declared it to be untrue?
I found a page with some other times that Jesus contravenes OT scripture: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/keithgiles/2018/02/6_times_jesus_contradicted_ot/
The exemplary difference between Jesus and Sabaoth is that Jesus forgives, whilst Sabaoth punishes. They cannot be the same being for there is nothing that links them philisophically. Sabaoth is the Lord of the Armies of Israel, whilst Jesus is a true pacifist; Sabaoth unleashes wrath, whilst Jesus offers only forgiveness from his humble nature.
At the bottom of the article I posted above, it says:
"*Jesus is the “Word of God” made flesh
*Jesus as the Living Word of God has the authority to correct the written Word as-needed"
So that must mean that God mis-wrote, or mis-spoke, earlier; he made a mistake, which proves that he cannot be All-Knowing, either, for otherwise he would have known to speak correctly the first time. Seems that in your belief, your All-Knowing, All-Powerful God has made quite a number of blunders.
As to respond to your Timothy quotation, I've already used that line of scripture in my above arguments, so no need to go over it again other than to say that personally I entirely dismiss Timothy. Anything written past the lifespan of Jesus is useless to me, other than for theological arguments. I enjoy a lot of Romans and Revelation, but I see the former as Paul's corruptions of the word of Jesus, and the latter as the highly entertaining fever-dream of a lunatic.
Anyway, sorry, this got very long, I think I've made my point for now.
I probably would be considered 'transgender', yes, but it's not particularly descriptive of me. Or maybe it is. I don't know. Either way, I have prayed to Jesus about it many times, and Jesus has always given me support and unconditional love. Religiously I am some kind of Gnostic, with Marcionist influence. I still identify as 'Christian' and I wear two crucifixes around my neck, to symbolise Jesus's sacrifice and the love he gave to the world through his knowledge; however, I am not what most would consider a Christian, certainly no Catholic, and I renounced Sabaoth after musing upon such topics as the ones I've just posted about. I have felt true divine power from my worship of Christ, which converted me from an atheist, so my belief is very much based in a combination of direct ecstatic experience, and logical reasoning of where that experience came from. I believe that flesh is sin, and that both are created by the evil god Sabaoth, but that through the knowledge of Jesus and his love and sacrifice, we can escape this Hell On Earth created by a weak, hateful and stupid god, and ascend to a higher plane of existence. This knowledge was also given in similar form to Buddha as well as Jesus.
Boy, this turned out super long. awehuhs