Originally posted by Total Warrior
Wasn't there any SW expert in Ryan's stuff that told him to stop when he came up with his shitty idea?"I'd like to have an emotionaly conflicted Luke--"
"No Ryan no **** you, it's not how Luke works"
Mark Hamill kinda did tell him that. But was probably too late by the time Hamill saw the script.
Rian's whole style is about "subverting expectations".
Looking at both R1 and Solo (not to mention the recent and upcoming work by Filoni and Favreau), I think it's safe to say that Sequel Trilogy could have easily been handled hundreds of times better.
You guys better hope Rian will not return:
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Even that wouldnt justify it.In ANH Lukes adopted parents were murdered by the Empire. Then Ben by Vader. Did Luke give up, become a loner and go into depression?
Then think how that was an untrained Luke, and the sequels were supposed to give as Luke as a true Jedi Master. Perhaps the best ever.
That's the other thing. You can't even blame his cynicism in TLJ on the fallout from tragic events, and have Luke grow as a character in the interim. Because we're shown in TLJ that even at the height of his accomplishment, he fails at all of the same trials that he'd already overcome in the OT. In some ways, he continues to come short of himself even after TLJ. If any media has post-RotJ Luke evolve into anything other than a disappointment, then it's pretty much contradicting the film.
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Even that wouldnt justify it.In ANH Lukes adopted parents were murdered by the Empire. Then Ben by Vader. Did Luke give up, become a loner and go into depression?
Then think how that was an untrained Luke, and the sequels were supposed to give as Luke as a true Jedi Master. Perhaps the best ever.
Originally posted by xPRIMEx
Yeah true. I think it’d be an improvement though. Your wife and child being murdered by your nephew would certainly have a larger impact than losing your aunt and uncle. Especially if it’s your fault that your nephew fell to the dark side in the first place.
Remember though Kylo hadnt murdered anyone yet.
Still, even say that were true, how does that justify giving up, and letting Snoke/Palpatine take over the Galaxy?
If anything his lesson from that scenario would be the Jedi were onto something with that No Attachment rule.
Originally posted by NewGuy01
The ST would have been bad with or without Rian.
Yeah it was clearly trying to repeat the OT from the start which was a terrible idea.
First one made bank of course. But the whole nostalgia thing is a one time trick. But then youre stuck for the rest of the trilogy.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
There is bad and there is awful.Rian's humour in the first scene was worse than any Scary Movie, which was considered to be an impossible feat.
Then he exposed us to this:
Yuk
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah it was clearly trying to repeat the OT from the start which was a terrible idea.
TLJ was a sour turning point, but in retrospect, I think J.J. did more harm than Rian between how he started the trilogy with an ANH copy paste, and how he decided to follow up TLJ by trying to undermine Rian's direction.
Originally posted by NewGuy01Yeah, I've gone back and fourth with that myself.
TLJ was a sour turning point, but in retrospect, I think J.J. did more harm than Rian between how he started the trilogy with an ANH copy paste, and how he decided to follow up TLJ by trying to undermine Rian's direction.
It essentially became "Rian's vision v.s JJ's vision"... Which just didn't work. Would have likely been better in the scheme of things(from a cohesive POV) if one director had been in charge of the ST from start to finish.
They cannot do much with him now.
Sequel Trilogy should have been a new story set about 150 years later than the Original Trilogy. A young Jedi discovers ancient artifacts and awakens an ancient evil and disaster follows (or something on these lines). This could be a fresh take on Star Wars on the big screen. This route would have left much space for writers to expand on Luke Skywalker and his exploits without ruining the character.
The Nostalgia Pandering route adopted by Disney ruined Sequel Trilogy. The Directors hired for the job were lacking in vision as well. They attempted to recreate a Galactic environment similar to that of the Original Trilogy but made it infinitely worse by introducing villians who were merely puppets of Palpatine and turned Luke Skywalker into a failure only to job for Rey who herself was related to Palpatine. There is no depth and sense of accomplishment in this story.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDSequel Trilogy should have been a new story set about 150 years later than the Original Trilogy. A young Jedi discovers ancient artifacts and awakens an ancient evil and disaster follows (or something on these lines). This could be a fresh take on Star Wars on the big screen. This route would have left much space for writers to expand on Luke Skywalker and his exploits without ruining the character.
Nah Should have focused around Luke's Jedi Academy.
That way it's also fresh (not done before), can also include the OT characters, and whatever other Galactic shenanigans are going on it would show the OT wasn't all for nothing.
I agree, 30-40 years after the civil war with an older Luke would have still been the best setting. Would be a waste not to have Mark Hamill appear again. As far as I’m concerned they could have copy-pasted the Yuzhang-Vong threat, if they didn’t have original ideas. It would have been something new for canon. And they could have kept the imperial remnants as a third party, not aligned with the republic or the Vong, led by this new ambitious leader who wants to revive the old empire. Luke could have still died in a more heroic way in the second movie, ensuring the survival of the galaxy and the finally victory in the third movie
I would have kept Rey. Well, maybe her character written a bit better, but I like the idea of a descendant of Palpatine serving as a Jedi. I would have made her a biological descendant of the emperor himself honestly, not just a clone. I think exploring how she deals with her past and her present as a Jedi would be cool. So her and Ben Solo could have been those who end the war in the final movie and will continue the work of Luke
Originally posted by Galan007
Make no mistake, the ST would have still failed... Both JJ and Rian just wanted to copy/paste the OT, which is ridiculous.Just saying that the ST would've probably made more sense overall, if one guy had been in charge from start to finish.
Yeah. As we already talked in a gazillion different threads and came to the same conclusion.
Disney wanted to replicate that unique magic responsible for the OT success.
Even if we see Marquand as a puppet director and exclude him, Kershner was a god and Lucas was Lucas.
Originally posted by Total Warrior
I would have kept Rey. Well, maybe her character written a bit better, but I like the idea of a descendant of Palpatine serving as a Jedi. I would have made her a biological descendant of the emperor himself honestly, not just a clone. I think exploring how she deals with her past and her present as a Jedi would be cool. So her and Ben Solo could have been those who end the war in the final movie and will continue the work of Luke
Rey and Finn were both good ideas on paper.
Rey could be the strong force sensitive being discovered and joining the Academy by the end of the first film. Essentially the Harry Potter.
Have 3 years between films, and by the 3rd one both Rey and Finn would be Jedi Knights.
Kylo was fine on paper as well. Just dont kill him after his redemption. Much more interesting to have him live with his sins. Dont just copy Vaders OT story to the letter FFS.