True dynamic strength

Originally posted by carver9
Which means he had enough strength to accomplish a goal. The fight went downhill for both after that. There's no other way around it. Superman even admitted in the older scenes that his legs were feeling wobbly. Are you saying Superman is lying above when he said he was tired and drained?

And keep in mind that Doomsday was getting stronger throughout this fight

Originally posted by Galan007

Logical deduction aside, it was also outright stated that Doomsday's strength continuously increased during the battle -- which obviously means Superman's strength did the same:

...........

*In short, your point/opinion here is the accurate one. 👆

In short, whether Superman is tired out at the end of fight or not isn't the point. The point is Superman's drastic change in power levels(I.E, dynamic strength)

Originally posted by carver9
Who said anything about Doomsday? I said Superman doesn't.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm just going to say this:

Superman has dynamic strength. To say otherwise is either ignorance or lying.

Round and round we go,

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
No. Because he didn't defeat the bigger stronger more powerful Hulk. Hulk was mind controlled there.

Or are you saying it's a valid victory for Ben? Hmmm. Although, if we are to take statements as true, it literally says the fight isn't about Brawn, but Heart.

That's IF we are taking the scans as they are.

With regards to your Superman scan.....

You want to take it at face value, yes? You are saying he had nothing left in the tank, correct?

He couldn't beat this version of Hulk before, mind controlled or not, he was still getting destroyed.

Originally posted by carver9
Who said anything about Doomsday? I said Superman doesn't. Just to dig deeper into this. This scene match Superman vs Doomsday perfectly. Ben during the fight is unable to hurt Hulk. He admits that Hulk is stronger and bigger than him. He even screams out that he gave it all he got and that he was about to black out. The last punch defeated the mind controlled Hulk that was bigger, stronger, and more powerful. Does Ben have dynamic strength?

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
Isn't that sort of in line with Superman and Doomsday's case?
See above, Superman is unable to hurt Doomsday throughout multiple issues.
Yet, at the end of fight, a battered Superman punches Doomsday to death in like 4 pages. While Doomsday was getting stronger before the end of this fight

Lol... yes, that's my point. Ben doesn't have dynamic strength.

Originally posted by carver9
He couldn't beat this version of Hulk before, mind controlled or not, he was still getting destroyed.

Oh. Sounds like PIS, then. Because you're now saying....Ben *didn't* win a clear victory here?

Either he did, or he didn't. And either Hulk is more powerful in this comic, or he isn't.

If he IS more powerful (and I agree with you, Carvy!) then it can't possibly be a clear victory for Ben. Unless....it's PIS. Nice scans, though.

But as I was asking:

With regards to your Superman scan.....

You want to take it at face value, yes? You are saying he had nothing left in the tank, correct?

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... yes, that's my point. Ben doesn't have dynamic strength.

Does that make sense to you, Carver?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Oh. Sounds like PIS, then. Because you're now saying....Ben *didn't* win a clear victory here?

Either he did, or he didn't. And either Hulk is more powerful in this comic, or he isn't.

If he IS more powerful (and I agree with you, Carvy!) then it can't possibly be a clear victory for Ben. Unless....it's PIS. Nice scans, though.

But as I was asking:

That's just ONE of the scenes with a far weaker, near depleted of power character beats a stronger, far more powerful character. Ben admitted during the fight Hulk was more powerful and stronger (even while mind controlled), and he still managed to beat him. Hulk at one point said he couldn't feel Thing punches. That he gave it all he got. That he was on the verge of blacken out. Physical damage and a hole in his face. Lol... the point is, shit like this happens all of the time. That does not mean a character has dynamic power. 🤣🤣

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
So...you're saying it's simultaneously is dynamic strength(increase in power levels) but not dynamic strength?

Does that make sense to you, Carver?

No, what I'm saying is, the heroes win and a hero defeating the enemy while beaten up and bruised is pretty freaking common in all stories.

Originally posted by carver9
That's just ONE of the scenes with a far weaker, near depleted of power character beats a stronger, far more powerful character. Ben admitted during the fight Hulk was more powerful and stronger (even while mind controlled), and he still managed to beat him. Hulk at one point said he couldn't feel Thing punches. That he gave it all he got. That he was on the verge of blacken out. Physical damage and a hole in his face. Lol... the point is, shit like this happens all of the time. That does not mean a character has dynamic power. 🤣🤣

Originally posted by carver9
No, what I'm saying is, the heroes win and a hero defeating the enemy while beaten up and bruised is pretty freaking common in all stories.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... I don't have to say anything, Superman literally said he had NOTHING in the tank...

Any other Marvel character, you would be drooling over this statement.

Basically what I said before, it seems you were just randomly throwing around scans but not had an actual argument

He is tired, depleted, and out of strength as per his own admission. It's literally right there on page for you coming directly from his own mouth.

Originally posted by carver9
He is tired, depleted, and out of strength as per his own admission. It's literally right there on page for you coming directly from his own mouth.

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998

In short, whether Superman is tired out at the end of fight or not isn't the point. The point is Superman's drastic change in power levels(I.E, dynamic strength)

Originally posted by carver9
He is tired, depleted, and out of strength as per his own admission. It's literally right there on page for you coming directly from his own mouth.

You are so hung up on this, you don't realise the stupidity of focussing on the hyperbole of it all.
Do you literally think that Superman had NOTHING (emphasis) left? Don't try to be a coward, stand up for your beliefs here. You read those words and think yes, Superman had NOTHING left?

This is obviously false, as he could literally still swing his arms around. He could obviously still kill Doomsday. Their last punch could still send shockwaves around the planet or whatever.

Or are you saying Superman, at 0% power, is capable of doing all that? Pretty powerful, indeed.

The point here is that at that moment, he WAS at 0% power, then suddenly ramped up to 100%/X%and killed Doomsday.

Because YOUR logic, is that Superman at 0% power, can kill Doomsday. If you want to argue that Doomsday was weakened by then, sure - could Aunt May, at that instant, also oneshot Doomsday? Remember, Doomsday also has dynamic strength- or are you quibbling that too now?

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998

Or reserves. Couldn't be anything dynamic since he died right after that last punch. Another scene of a character down, out, and bruised taking out a more powerful opponent...

Originally posted by carver9
Or reserves. Couldn't be anything dynamic since he died right after that last punch. Another scene of a character down, out, and bruised taking out a more powerful opponent...

But your scan literally says NOTHING left in the tank. It can't be reserves.

So what is it?

(I will address the Thor scan later).

Originally posted by carver9
Or reserves. Couldn't be anything dynamic since he died right after that last punch. Another scene of a character down, out, and bruised taking out a more powerful opponent...

So by this logic, a 100% Superman can't hurt a 100% Doomsday. But later, a 1% Superman kills a 1000% Doomsday in like a few punches?

Does this make sense to you?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
OK, you want to take it at face value - he had NOTHING in the tank.
So can we substitute The Penguin in there? Riddler? Alfred? Dead Alfred?

You are so hung up on this, you don't realise the stupidity of focussing on the hyperbole of it all.
Do you literally think that Superman had NOTHING (emphasis) left? Don't try to be a coward, stand up for your beliefs here. You read those words and think yes, Superman had NOTHING left?

This is obviously false, as he could literally still swing his arms around. He could obviously still kill Doomsday. Their last punch could still send shockwaves around the planet or whatever.

Or are you saying Superman, at 0% power, is capable of doing all that? Pretty powerful, indeed.

The point here is that at that moment, he WAS at 0% power, then suddenly ramped up to 100%/X%and killed Doomsday.

Because YOUR logic, is that Superman at 0% power, can kill Doomsday. If you want to argue that Doomsday was weakened by then, sure - could Aunt May, at that instant, also oneshot Doomsday? Remember, Doomsday also has dynamic strength- or are you quibbling that too now?

Superman definition of Nothing is obviously different than a human definition of Nothing. I don't know why you keep comparing him to a human when that is obviously not the case. Going from 100 to 0 instantly doesn't even make sense. Especially considering the last punch killing both and Doomsday going all out the entire time. He compared his tiredness to a human. Exhausted, etc... and even while tired, we are still never at zero. I'm seeing it as him saying he has nothing left to continue fighting, but he is tired, drained, and exhausted and gave everything he had left in that final blow that killed both of them.

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
Yet, Superman, while at his full power(at the beginning of their fight), can't hurt/weaken Doomsday. While Doomsday is getting stronger
But Superman kills it by his reserves in 4 pages?

So by this logic, a 100% Superman can't hurt a 100% Doomsday. But later, a 1% Superman kills a 1000% Doomsday in like a few punches?

Does this make sense to you?

Or Superman was holding back and became serious when he knew what was at stake (and him being the only hero standing). Just like the Ben scans I posted. When he was fresh and at 100%, he couldn't hurt Hulk, but when he knew what the cost was, while hurt, exhausted, near passing out, he was able to knock out Hulk. The scene is literally identical to the Superman and Doomsday fight.

Originally posted by carver9
Or Superman was holding back and became serious when he knew what was at stake (and him being the only hero standing). Just like the Ben scans I posted. When he was fresh and at 100%, he couldn't hurt Hulk, but when he knew what the cost was, while hurt, exhausted, near passing out, he was able to knock out Hulk. The scene is literally identical to the Superman and Doomsday fight.

Edit:
Plus, it kind of moot point, no? Since like posted before, Superman's power depends on his mental state
I.E, if he is in a situation that he feels he needs to give everything he has to stop a dangerous opponent(and in this case, Doomsday), his stress would increase, and thus, his solar power absorbing level/his power levels

Originally posted by Galan007
Lol, so now you just ignore the scans presented which explicitly TELL US that Superman's powers are dynamic? Nope, not going to let you off that easy:

(It's from AoS #636 if you care to look for yourself, since you read so many comics.) 🙂

You're trolling harder than normal lately. Just stop. 👆

Originally posted by carver9
Or Superman was holding back and became serious when he knew what was at stake (and him being the only hero standing). Just like the Ben scans I posted. When he was fresh and at 100%, he couldn't hurt Hulk, but when he knew what the cost was, while hurt, exhausted, near passing out, he was able to knock out Hulk. The scene is literally identical to the Superman and Doomsday fight.

So an all out Ben is able to oneshot the Hulk? Good to know.