Invisible Woman vs Firestorm

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Gaylan, reported.....

Yeah the adamantium showing was tongue in cheek (hence my smileys and colouring). I don't know if the core was actually destroyed - all I know is that he had it in his lab, and she destroyed the lab (Fantastic Four #269).

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But yes, Jason was the more impressive, he could actually create machinery right? Though I honestly thought new materials needed study and practice before he could do so.

One of the other things that set Jason apart was his ability to transmute organic material pretty much right away(Ronnie could never really do that before Doomsday Clock, and even then he was hard-pressed to learn the ability)... And Jason was also able to [rapidly] recover from the same kind of attack that 'killed' Ronnie:

So yeah, Jason > Ronnie overall, imo. 👆

But you're right: FS needs to "know" the material he's creating beforehand, but that shouldn't be a problem if he's merged with Stein. /shrug

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
If encased in Promethium, and the only way out was to break it......mayyyybe? But it would be incredibly doubtful - afaik she hasn't gone up against anything as durable as adamantium in Marvel, sans that scan above. Closest would be something like this, and depends what weight you want to put on 'cut through anything':

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/a/uploads/original/11139/111391579/9497063-1000016432.jpg

The scan has a secondary effect of summoning Stilt.

Oh and what is Sue's defense to having the air inside her shielding transmuted into... Something else? Is Sersi on par with Firestorm in that department?

Originally posted by Galan007
😂 👆

Yep. The wackiness/complexity of Jason's constructs was almost GL-esque at times:

One of the other things that set Jason apart was his ability to transmute organic material pretty much right away(Ronnie could never really do that before Doomsday Clock, and even then he was hard-pressed to learn the ability)... And Jason was also able to [rapidly] recover from the same kind of attack that 'killed' Ronnie:

So yeah, Jason > Ronnie overall, imo. 👆

But you're right: FS needs to "know" the material he's creating beforehand, but that shouldn't be a problem if he's merged with Stein. /shrug

👆

Oh and what is Sue's defense to having the air inside her shielding transmuted into... Something else? Is Sersi on par with Firestorm in that department?

Just quickly scanning the respect thread for Sersi, I'd argue she's on par if not better...

Plus there's the Cosmic Cube scan, where she was protecting Reed even subconsciously, for a whole night.

Since I don't know enough about Sersi to argue either way, I'll just concede that Sue's shields > Sersi-level transmutation ~ FS-level transmutation. 👆

So in that case, I guess this might be something of a quickdraw(ie. whoever acts first, wins)..? If they act at the same time, then Sue might(but I'm still not entirely convinced) still be able to beat FS with secondary attacks... But she'd still be stuck in a cube of solid Promethium for eternity. haw-som

Or Firestorm turns her into salt

That is never a wrong answer. 👆

I don't see him getting through her FF to work his powers on her. Like DS said, if Sersi can't do it, I don't think FS could do it. And this was back in the mid 90s. The bullsh|t surrounding her powers has grown exponentially.

Encasing her in Promethium is his only hope and that's being generous and assuming she can't just expand her FF and shatter it.

Originally posted by Galan007
Since I don't know enough about Sersi to argue either way, I'll just concede that Sue's shields > Sersi-level transmutation ~ FS-level transmutation. 👆

So in that case, I guess this might be something of a quickdraw(ie. whoever acts first, wins)..? If they act at the same time, then Sue might(but I'm still not entirely convinced) still be able to beat FS with secondary attacks... But she'd still be stuck in a cube of solid Promethium for eternity. haw-som

Yeah - I still think (obv) that Sue would win a quickdraw, and would win with an attacking defence that occurs simultaneously (so not a secondary attack...)

And this all assumes Jason creates promethium off the bat, too, or doesn't waste time trying to convert her shield. Whilst Sue's is a much more straighforward bubble attack/shield.

Also assumes he only converts the air into promethium - she can just leisurely dig her way out afterwards, using a giant robot construct:

This is where the 'bullshit' as zop puts it, has increased. She can now form more than just simple shapes, but can basically do GL type constructs like engines:
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/a/uploads/original/11139/111391579/9563190-1000022323.jpg

And another, although I might dump this in the Comic Discussions thread - an insane feat where she aligns and synchronises every single photon as Johnny produces it, whilst creating a construct strong enough to handle his Nova Flame, just after stopping a town-sized asteroid travelling at Mach 50

It's like the Silver Age all over again.

At this rate, it would take a high-level abstract to beat her and no I'm not joking.

😂 yeah. that's what i said. i hate her. and by extension ds who seems to love her. 👆

Originally posted by zopzop
Encasing her in Promethium is his only hope and that's being generous and assuming she can't just expand her FF and shatter it.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It has no molecules, so...Molecule Man couldn't do anything.

https://i.postimg.cc/FHyVdJ71/Molecule.png

Probably the closest we have to a transmuter failing.

Usual disclaimer, this is when she was younger blah blah.

"subatomically frictionless"

Whatever that means

Originally posted by Smurph
👆

"subatomically frictionless"

Whatever that means

Technically there's no way they should be able to walk across a dome made of it because it's slicker than any ice in existence

Sue wins.

Originally posted by Glorificus
Sue wins.

She probably does.
How do you think the fight would play out if he encased her shield in Promethium?

Well, she could turn the promethium invisible, can still attack through it, and just needs to beat Firestorm before she runs out of air, I guess? Seems doable.