Super Thor Team vs DC Cosmic Team

The tree is the birth of spacetime itself?

lol.

The Asguardians , particularly Odin, spin wild legends about their endeavors.

Odin who is Bors son, alongside of his brothers, defeated Ymir and turned his body into Earth then planted the seed which became Yggdrasil and created the universe.
He also says he created all the stars in the universe and all life inside of it.

And that’s just the tip of the iceberg with his tales.

He calls himself the King of all Stories.

I bet if you ask Zeus, he would have different stories.

But we know none of this is true the way he tells it, because the history of the marvel universe completely disagrees with it.

that's just how cosmology works in marvel and dc, there will be different stories with contradictions, it's impossible to have one coherent cosmology

i mean how many creation stories have we heard from dc and marvel so far. so many i lost count

more importantly yggdrasil is the norse intepretation of the multiversal axis. but other religions might view it differently. sorta like in real life different religions have different views of the supreme being but it's actually the same monotheistic God just interpreted differently by people of different background

Originally posted by MrMind
that's just how cosmology works in marvel and dc, there will be different stories with contradictions, it's impossible to have one coherent cosmology

i mean how many creation stories have we heard from dc and marvel so far. so many i lost count

more importantly yggdrasil is the norse intepretation of the multiversal axis. but other religions might view it differently. sorta like in real life different religions have different views of the supreme being but it's actually the same monotheistic God just interpreted differently by people of different background

Originally posted by MrMind
all realities live and die with yggdrasil

regular axe? lol no that was celestial axe of the watchers, it was designed by the watchers to sever cosmic structures, they were doing a cosmic surgery by severing the celestial embryo from earth that was siphoning through the tree

Originally posted by Juntai
the issue is, there is one definitive one. There’s a book called history of the marvel universe. It gets tweaked and redone every so often, but in each telling the Norse gods are not even close to first, and they didn’t create the life or the stars, or the earth.

Originally posted by Juntai
the issue is, there is one definitive one. There’s a book called history of the marvel universe. It gets tweaked and redone every so often, but in each telling the Norse gods are not even close to first, and they didn’t create the life or the stars, or the earth.

i personally am against putting bio over everything especially if there are additional canon evidences. there are only so much contents a bio or handbook can fit in. it's not going to show everything

same thing with dc, i think dc has been releasing books about their history for the last couple years now. from what i've seen not everything in cosmology has been crammed in there. so i take these history books for truth, but additional mythos from other comic books that's not included are also valid.

Originally posted by Diesldude
Did Rage hack Mr. Minds kmc account?

In short: simple projection.

But I dunno, let him battle abhilegend. Change of pace on these forums, as it were. Even if it's disingenuous.

Originally posted by MrMind
i personally am against putting bio over everything especially if there are additional canon evidences. there are only so much contents a bio or handbook can fit in. it's not going to show everything

same thing with dc, i think dc has been releasing books about their history for the last couple years now. from what i've seen not everything in cosmology has been crammed in there. so i take these history books for truth, but additional mythos from other comic books that's not included are also valid.

However History of the Marvel Universe is more than that.
1) Galactus is explaining it to Franklin on panel.
2) For the history of the Norse Gods, it references Thor Annual 10 as the true history for them, and Man is actually older than they are, and created them.

Originally posted by Juntai
You’ve used many bios in this very thread.

However History of the Marvel Universe is more than that.
1) Galactus is explaining it to Franklin on panel.
2) For the history of the Norse Gods, it references Thor Annual 10 as the true history for them, and Man is actually older than they are, and created them.

i think you misunderstood me, bios are credible evidences, so are on panel showings and statements
history of marvel universe was published in 2020, a lot has changed in marvel cosmology since then

yggdrasil got expanded after 2020, then the marvel cosmology got restructured in ewing's defenders series

Then the issue you face is that you’re pulling from multiple eras of cosmology and trying to reverse retroactively apply cherry-picked pieces of all of them into the very places of your own choosing.

This gives us an opportunity to wrap this back around to our original points about Seth:

In the Seth story in particular, "plane" is used as a stand in for "realm," as indicated when Seth claims that the destruction of Asgard's Rainbow Bridge cut them off "from the mortal plane." In Thor's cosmology, the Rainbow Bridge connects Asgard to Midgard (Earth's realm/plane). With this context in mind, we can see that Seth's only mention of "infinite planes" was when he boasted that nobody in "infinite planes" had ever assembled an army as large as his ow. This is just the same as saying "Nobody in infinite universes of the multiverse has ever had an army this big!" There's never any indication infinite planes are actually in danger in the story at all. The only time multiple planes are directly affected in this storyline, they specify that they are talking about the planes within that reality. So, knowing that "plane" actually means "realm" in this storyline, when we further reason that "reality" means "universe," then this clears up all inconsistencies. By this, Seth was only threatening every realm within Marvel 616 (i.e. the realms of Yggdrasil), and this also satisfies with how his battle against Odi caused shockwaves which "ripple across every plane of reality.", when those "planes" were meant to be read as "realms" and "reality" was meant to be read as "Marvel 616," then this feat would be dramatically more consistent with all of these characters more usual operating levels.

What you would need is that within the context of a story that actual multiverse was in danger, and not just the local universe we’ve borrowed scans from two dozen comics to reverse engineer that it actually meant something more.

As for RKT. Like above there was nothing that showed him to ascend to anywhere near such a massive scale you’re implying within the Ragnarok story itself. All that we know is that he gained Odin’s power+benefit of humanity and broke 9 universes out of a cyclical loop by cutting a thread.

If you want I can get more into all the logical flaws of the Yggdrasil scans here, but the important part would really boil down to trying to scale anyone who has ever threatened it or threatens it as being as high or greater than the highest cosmics in Marvel Multiverse based on your random scan grabs.

Likewise, by contrast we know a story like Zero Hour was multiverse, despite DC's best effort to not use that term in the 90s. Many realities were wiped, and several of the characters fighting Hal at the end were from different Earths, and Hal was promising to rebuild their "world"/"Earth" when trying to sway them to his side. And it never referred the multiverse as anything other than "universe" in the story.

Originally posted by MrMind
what do you think is happening here abhi

Originally posted by Philosophía
What happened in the page before, Mr Mind?

Trying to scale him up to beyond multiversal from this is just wild.

Originally posted by Juntai
He just broke the thread. That's it.

Trying to scale him up to beyond multiversal from this is just wild.

yet we give superman benefit of the doubt, sundipped superman destroyed world forger's anvil and interrupted the finalization of world forger's multiverse, we just assumed superman one punched a fully fledged multiverse that already existed. even though superman only halted multiverse birth into existence, the new in progress -multiverse wasn't fully formed yet.

double standard

Originally posted by Juntai
Likewise, by contrast we know a story like Zero Hour was multiverse, despite DC's best effort to not use that term in the 90s. Many realities were wiped, and several of the characters fighting Hal at the end were from different Earths, and Hal was promising to rebuild their "world"/"Earth" when trying to sway them to his side. And it never referred the multiverse as anything other than "universe" in the story.

not sure what you are trying to prove here, zero hour parallax was definitely multiversal this was confirmed during that time

and later on in death metal

Originally posted by Juntai
Then the issue you face is that you’re pulling from multiple eras of cosmology and trying to reverse retroactively apply cherry-picked pieces of all of them into the very places of your own choosing.

This gives us an opportunity to wrap this back around to our original points about Seth:

In the Seth story in particular, "plane" is used as a stand in for "realm," as indicated when Seth claims that the destruction of Asgard's Rainbow Bridge cut them off "from the mortal plane." In Thor's cosmology, the Rainbow Bridge connects Asgard to Midgard (Earth's realm/plane). With this context in mind, we can see that Seth's only mention of "infinite planes" was when he boasted that nobody in "infinite planes" had ever assembled an army as large as his ow. This is just the same as saying "Nobody in infinite universes of the multiverse has ever had an army this big!" There's never any indication infinite planes are actually in danger in the story at all. The only time multiple planes are directly affected in this storyline, they specify that they are talking about the planes within that reality. So, knowing that "plane" actually means "realm" in this storyline, when we further reason that "reality" means "universe," then this clears up all inconsistencies. By this, Seth was only threatening every realm within Marvel 616 (i.e. the realms of Yggdrasil), and this also satisfies with how his battle against Odi caused shockwaves which "ripple across every plane of reality.", when those "planes" were meant to be read as "realms" and "reality" was meant to be read as "Marvel 616," then this feat would be dramatically more consistent with all of these characters more usual operating levels.

What you would need is that within the context of a story that actual multiverse was in danger, and not just the local universe we’ve borrowed scans from two dozen comics to reverse engineer that it actually meant something more.

As for RKT. Like above there was nothing that showed him to ascend to anywhere near such a massive scale you’re implying within the Ragnarok story itself. All that we know is that he gained Odin’s power+benefit of humanity and broke 9 universes out of a cyclical loop by cutting a thread.

If you want I can get more into all the logical flaws of the Yggdrasil scans here, but the important part would really boil down to trying to scale anyone who has ever threatened it or threatens it as being as high or greater than the highest cosmics in Marvel Multiverse based on your random scan grabs.

bro why are you trying so hard to lowball here, when it stated on panel it's multiversal

comic books use phras like universe/existence/multiverse interchangeably, but when multiverse is mentioned, we take the world of the writer, that it's indeed a multiverse.

in chaos war, there was scans saying chaos king destroyed universe, then there was scans also saying chaos war destroyed multiverse. we acknowledge he actually destroyed the multiverse

in lucifer, there are scans saying lucifer morningstar created a new multiverse, then there are other scans saying he created a new universe. we acknowledge he actuallyed created a multiverse

we always acknowledge the bigger one, because we don't want to lowball

Originally posted by MrMind
yet we give superman benefit of the doubt, sundipped superman destroyed world forger's anvil and interrupted the finalization of world forger's multiverse, we just assumed superman one punched a fully fledged multiverse that already existed. even though superman only halted multiverse birth into existence, the new in progress -multiverse wasn't fully formed yet.

double standard

sorry i meant to say disrupted his anvil not destroyed been a long time since i read that issue. but i didn't remember anvil being destroyed

Originally posted by MrMind
not sure what you are trying to prove here, zero hour parallax was definitely multiversal this was confirmed during that time

and later on in death metal

Originally posted by MrMind
bro why are you trying so hard to lowball here, when it stated on panel it's multiversal

comic books use phras like universe/existence/multiverse interchangeably, but when multiverse is mentioned, we take the world of the writer, that it's indeed a multiverse.

in chaos war, there was scans saying chaos king destroyed universe, then there was scans also saying chaos war destroyed multiverse. we acknowledge he actually destroyed the multiverse

in lucifer, there are scans saying lucifer morningstar created a new multiverse, then there are other scans saying he created a new universe. we acknowledge he actuallyed created a multiverse

we always acknowledge the bigger one, because we don't want to lowball

Marvel refers to the 9 realms and dimensions of a single universe as multiverse constantly, thereby making it harder to decipher. We use the context of the story.

Originally posted by MrMind
huh? rkt destroyed the fate loom and the world tree, ended the death/rebirth cycles of 9 realms, TWASIS was hinted later on to be beyonders multiple times. rkt outright threatened to end their control in their face and TWASIS couldn't do anything about it.

also according to ewing the world tree is everything, multiversal at least

ewing even confirmed that the everything outside of the world tree is ,ginnungagap which is the far shore-the yawning void, outside of the marvel omniverse

TWSAIS have no feats. They aren’t proven to be Beyonders. Loki mentioned it among a few theories and then said he was bullshitting afterwards.

They also were never there at the ending. They only appeared as a vision as he was swinging to destroy the thread. They are still in their realm, visible that they are sitting on their thrones in the vision.

RKT compared himself as a child’s toy compared to them in the previous issue.

He was able to what he did because of his time among humans, he was shielded from the fates and TWSAIS.

The tree scaling doesn’t matter. Thor didn’t destroy the tree. Breaking the thread and ending the cycle did.