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As Xizor and I discussed on the old board, he wanted to see Ki-Adi-Mundi killed by Force Lightning in Episode 2 or 3, while I wanted Jar Jar to be telekinetically killed by the throat crush method. Will we see these awesome powers in Episode 2 or 3? I confirmed that both Jorus AND Joruus C'boath will not be episode 2 or 3 by doing some research into the back story of the Thrawn Trilogy. It's too bad, because I wanted Joruus C'boath to use Force Lightning on the stupid and annoying Jar Jar.

We'll see, but I'd like to point out that the use of the term 'Dark Side power' is a little fuzzy right now.

From what we can tell, anyone can do any of the powers, it is simply a case of what they chose to do with them. No power is inherently evil; only people themselves get that qualification.

So Lightning isn't an evil power per se; powering it with your hatred and striking down the innocent with it certainly is.

It's always possible that Lightning is hidden Sith knowledge, of course, but the main point would stand.

Yeah, I thought I read that one member of the JC could use force lightning, I think it was Plo Koon. And we saw Luke do the choke thing in ROTJ.

Use of the Dark Side is a danger, because the Jedi could be consumed by it's overwelming power but it is not unheard of for a Jedi to "tap" the dark side and remain good.

Very true, but I see the Dark Side in terms of what you use to fuel your power, not WHICH power you use.

I think that's kinda what I meant too. Somethimes, if you tap the source to much you end up only using that source and that's when you fall.

...and if you use powers whose only obvious use is destruction then this sort of thing is far more likely. Excellent, we all seem agreed.

Bare in mind that the Expnaded universe seemed to generate a jedi that fell between the two pinnacles or extreme of force with Mara Jade and Luke. Luke if you recall in Dark Empire 2 fell to the Dark Side but differed from his father having been fully equipped with both general techniques but choosing to use them in a more productie manner. The same for Mara who operated for the Emperor with some Jedi talent but also turned to the light side but with Dark talents and tendencies and as such could be considered a Grey Jedi? Anyway either way in one of the books I recall Luke dismanteling his hand to get a power supply to open a door and having done so reassembling it to give it power again required a bit of a bolt. Strange given that youd think he wouldnt like it as it had calcified his bones the last time he came across it

True enough...

Mind you, you know what I think of the revolving door policy on the Darkside the EU put in for MJ and Luke at some points... I think the films make it clear that when it comes to the Dark Side you are either in or you are out... Grey Jedi strike me as as wishful thinking. They don't exist.

"A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, NEVER for attack."

- Master Yoda

True. But that was just one point of view, wasn't it?

Purchance to dream, OK I'd like to beleive that it may be possible that in terms of the dark side you are in out, but there have been numerous examples of Jedi gradually being corupted, or else almost being turnded as such if you refuse to believe in the plausibiity or possibility that there are grey jedi then perhaps shadows that haunt the light side, or perhaps impinging awareness and occasional use.

That Yoda quote does come from a different age of the Jedi. Anyone who reads the EU novels can see that the Jedi that exist in the post-ROTJ era appear to be very different from those seen in Ep1 and Obi Wan/Yoda as seen in the OT.

Ah RatCat I do agree to an extent as I do feel that there is no problem with the different image of the Jedi. Knights in medieval period or the Samurai equivilent didn't stay the same forever and why not have some changes and perhaps a grey side. However I didn't either wish to styfle Ush's beliefs and therefore tried to meet a happy medium...couldn't find one so created a possible in between solution...

Force Lightning
This power is a corruption of the Force, harnessing pure hatred and evil from the user and the Dark Side. These lightning bolts tear through the victim causing intense pain. Force Lightning can be deflected by using the Force as a shield or by using a lightsaber.

Telekinetic Kill (AKA: Force Grip)
This power is used to telekinetically injure or kill the target. The exact method used to injure or kill varies: crush the trachea (most poupular), stir the brain, squeeze the heart, freeze the lungs, or any number of other methods.

For sure, two very evil techniques, stong of the dark side.

sure force lightning when on a person is probably dark side but what about on a door lock when held captive is it then no longer dark side use of power?...

It doesn't matter. If you use Force Lightning for ANY reason, you run a chance of falling to the Dark Side. To use Force Lightning, one must focus intensely on anger and hate.

It can be blocked with a sabre?! I wasn't aware of that, even in the EU.

As regards to tele-kill, remember there is no such singke power as telekinetic kill. The Force simply gives you telekinesis, and this canm feasinly used to crush a trachea much as it can be used to lift a rock.

Telekinesis is not inherently good or eveil, obviously. And Jedi CAN kill, ans is also clear. What is evil is using your telekinesis to cause needless suffering or in a selfish way. It is also eveil to power it with your darker emotions. But the power itself is neutral.

Unless Lightning is a special case (Sith lore, or as DN says ONLY powerable by darker emotions), it should be the same.

Bare in mind that even the good jedi realise occasionally the need to kill, therefore what if you are in an OB1 position hanging in a peril situation with no lightsaber to hand and it being a non force trained enemy as much a threat though, Is it so evil to use telekinesis in a manner that will kill. Bare in mind this also in law there is difference between murder and manslaughter in one way, and that is malice of after thought. THerefore may be the same applies to usage of the force its the light force if towards a greater end but dark force if used with malice...

I'm not sure if the Force is quite into rule of law, But i get the point...

But to use a method to kill that is obviously protracted and more painful must surely be of the dark side.

A quick, easy death must be more of the lightside than having someone slowly choke to death. Also, the motive of the death must have a great influence on Dark V's Light

AGain, no power is inherently evil, just what you do with it. Telekinesis is just that, using it to hurt someone in a slow protracted way IS evil, of course, but it isn't the fault of the power.

EU's not my bag, so I won't come near this board again, but dark and light force powers are a very interesting subject.
Thinking about it, a lightsabre could cause just as much pain as force lightning or telekinetic killing, but Jedi still carry them as they are a useful defence measure if the need arises to end someone's life in defence of an innocent being's. Likewise, if an unarmed Jedi was forced to kill someone in defence by using the Force to put a tremendous voltage across their heart, or send a wave of telekinetic energy through their brain, even the most honourable and good Jedi would not think twice about doing it.
It strikes me that the only reasons Jedi do not use these powers are that firstly, they are not well practiced in their effective use, and secondly, lightsabres tend to be effective enough in a combat situation.

Good points all.

I think what I'm trying to say is it isn't the power, it's the intent with which it is used that makes it good or evil..

Me too. Some people are effectively saying, however, that Force Lightning cannot be used WITHOUT Dark intent.

certain powers are evil like drain or kill


but lightning hell you might just want to recharge a baterry

telekinesis is definetly nuetral

You revived a 7 year old thread, why, just why?

Originally posted by Elite Hunter
You revived a 7 year old thread, why, just why? ima godamn necromancer that why



and i used the search thingy before i made a new thread

and its interesting to see the mods before they were mods

and here are some dancing bananas

Wow I didn't even know KMC was around in 2001.

If you want to see a mod before he is a mod read my posts. Hahaha.

Yuck, thread necromancy...

And I believe Ush was a moderator then, too.

Powers like Drain (which are kind of vague and only appeared in video games as a 'gain health back from others!' method) would have to be considered inherently evil.

Is there a Force Kill? If so, lame.

I, for one, believe that lightning should also be treated as inherently evil. I remember certain descriptions of it being powered by hatred. Something destructive like lightning shouldn't be a willy-nilly 'I must zap him so that he drops his gun, using my good intentions!' power.

It should take anger and hatred to fuel Lightning. Those emotions to support good intentions.

Originally posted by Captain REX
Yuck, thread necromancy...

And I believe Ush was a moderator then, too.

Powers like Drain (which are kind of vague and only appeared in video games as a 'gain health back from others!' method) would have to be considered inherently evil.

Is there a Force Kill? If so, lame.

I, for one, believe that lightning should also be treated as inherently evil. I remember certain descriptions of it being powered by hatred. Something destructive like lightning shouldn't be a willy-nilly 'I must zap him so that he drops his gun, using my good intentions!' power. Force kil is basically choke...
anyhow as far as lightning goes i guess what your ultimate goal would be like say zapping krayt to death good for galaxy but well

Originally posted by Tangible God
It should take anger and hatred to fuel Lightning. Those emotions to support good intentions. such as hatred and anger for the nazi or something but im betting righteous righteous anger inst as potent as sheer bloodlust

It's one to thing to have good intentions, but your means don't always justify the end. And if it takes anger and hatred to stop evil, you run the risking of becoming that evil, especially when dealing with the Force.

very true..
reminds me of Manifest Destiny *shudders in nationally shared shame*

oh and the utter failure that was the Crusades*Beams in delight at epic slaughter*