5th Dimension vs Celestials

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superman41082
Every entity from both of their prospective universes...

I dunno...... what do you think?????

S.S
the imps from dc?

superman41082
Originally posted by S.S
the imps from dc?

Yeah, mxy and the gang, but also every other entity from that universe vs every entity in the celestial universe........ I'm looking for someone more enlightened than I to enlighten me......

GODSCRIBE
einsteinium physics doesn't apply to the imps does it??

celestials are pretty damn powerful, and are tolerant to manipulation and magic (thor's godblast concentrated with the belt of strength did nothing to a celestial). they can hurtle planets and stars and the imps, so i don't know. seems like it will be close.

S.S
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
einsteinium physics doesn't apply to the imps does it??

celestials are pretty damn powerful, and are tolerant to manipulation and magic (thor's godblast concentrated with the belt of strength did nothing to a celestial). they can hurtle planets and stars and the imps, so i don't know. seems like it will be close.
Actually it wouldn't be close at all the Imps stomp the Celestials.

BlaqChaos
I can tell you anything you want to know about the Celestials, but only fragments about the imps.

GODSCRIBE
Originally posted by S.S
Actually it wouldn't be close at all the Imps stomp the Celestials.

what exactly do they do to stomp the celestials out of curiosity. im not well versed in the imps obviously.

S.S
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
what exactly do they do to stomp the celestials out of curiosity. im not well versed in the imps obviously.
lets just say one imp such as mxy is more then enough to kill Galactus over and over just for fun.Keep in mind that's just one imp.

superman41082
Originally posted by BlaqChaos
I can tell you anything you want to know about the Celestials, but only fragments about the imps.

Well, I do have a few questions.

1) What are they?

2) Why do they care about this universe so much?

3) What is their celestial universe like?

4) Are they still alive, because I heard that Galactus somehow wiped them all out?

5) How do they tie in with the whole Galactus turning into a star and starting the next universe thing?

6) AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, WHERE DID THEY GET THE RIGHTS TO USE THE MONOLITH FROM MY FAVORITE MOVIE(2001 A SPACE ODYSSEY OF COURSE)? I'LL ADD I WAS EXTREMELY UPSET THAT THEY TRIED TO EXPLAIN THAT WHOLE THING. I LIKE TO JUST IGNORE THAT PIECE OF COMIC INFO.......

GODSCRIBE
Originally posted by S.S
lets just say one imp such as mxy is more then enough to kill Galactus over and over just for fun.Keep in mind that's just one imp.

yeah, how though. you havent really explained how.

S.S
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
yeah, how though. you havent really explained how.
They're reality warpers basically they do what ever they want.

GODSCRIBE
okay, that's what i thought. havent they been stopped by DC Earth characters before? arent they gullible too? saying their name backwards and shit like that.

superman41082
Originally posted by S.S
They're reality warpers basically they do what ever they want.

Can't the Celestials do the same, however, if they wished to????? I thought they could, but usually just don't...............

IMPs are cool. hehe

S.S
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
okay, that's what i thought. havent they been stopped by DC Earth characters before? arent they gullible too? saying their name backwards and shit like that.

That's for Mxy and that's just a self imposed rule for Superman can beat him he can make it go away if he wants.

superman41082
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
okay, that's what i thought. havent they been stopped by DC Earth characters before? arent they gullible too? saying their name backwards and shit like that.

Yeah, they're pretty silly........... I think the Celestials have more of a will to fight than the IMPs do, for sure. I thought this one would be about even.......

S.S
Originally posted by superman41082
Can't the Celestials do the same, however, if they wished to????? I thought they could, but usually just don't...............

IMPs are cool. hehe
Well I haven't heard or read anything about Celestials warping reality.....erm

leonidas
hmm, i've never been convinced an imp would beat some of the high level cosmics. the reason? ALL high level cosmics (galactus, celestials, watchers and any on that level or above) can ALL perceive and interact with the universe on levels far above what we can or what they are often creditted with. a battle between 2 watchers was waged simultaneously on many levels of reality. odin himself has shook the multiverse. that would include the 5th dimension were the 5th dimension in marvel

featwise, it would seem the imps would/could prevail, but logically i'm just not sure. i don't doubt their reality manipulating abilities, i just don't know if they would work against beings theoretically capable of seeing the universe the same they do.

imps did well (for a time) against spectre, but in the end he proved to be much more powerful than they were i believe.

i'm not completely convinced the 5th dimension wins this one. erm

BlaqChaos
Originally posted by superman41082
Well, I do have a few questions.

1) What are they?

2) Why do they care about this universe so much?

3) What is their celestial universe like?

4) Are they still alive, because I heard that Galactus somehow wiped them all out?

5) How do they tie in with the whole Galactus turning into a star and starting the next universe thing?

6) AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, WHERE DID THEY GET THE RIGHTS TO USE THE MONOLITH FROM MY FAVORITE MOVIE(2001 A SPACE ODYSSEY OF COURSE)? I'LL ADD I WAS EXTREMELY UPSET THAT THEY TRIED TO EXPLAIN THAT WHOLE THING. I LIKE TO JUST IGNORE THAT PIECE OF COMIC INFO.......

I'll give the answer in two parts. The first one will be the short, short, answer in this post. The second one (which will take me a few mintues to write out) will be the detailed post.

The Celestials are ervants to Eternity, the same way that Apocalypse is a servant to the Celestials (revealed in this months issue of X-Men). As for your questions:

Q: What are they?
A: See my second post.

Q: Why do they care about this universe so much?
A: It's their job. Just like it's the Watcher's job to watch.

Q: What is their celestial universe like?
A: This is their universe.

Q: Are they still alive, because I heard that Galactus somehow wiped them all out?
A: Yes, they are still alive. They were last seen this month in the latest issue of X-Men, when they took Apocalypse so that he could fulfill his part of the bargain they made with him 5000 years ago. The story of them being taken out by Galactus was probably a story of what happened in Earth X. I'll get into that in the next post.

Q: How do they tie in with the whole Galactus turning into a star and starting the next universe thing?
A: See my second post.

Q: AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, WHERE DID THEY GET THE RIGHTS TO USE THE MONOLITH FROM MY FAVORITE MOVIE(2001 A SPACE ODYSSEY OF COURSE)? I'LL ADD I WAS EXTREMELY UPSET THAT THEY TRIED TO EXPLAIN THAT WHOLE THING. I LIKE TO JUST IGNORE THAT PIECE OF COMIC INFO.......
A: See my second post.

Darksaint
The 5th Dimensional Imps are beyond all of creation, even beyond the DC Multiverse; that alone tells you something.

Every single law in physics and nature in the regular planes does not apply to them at all. They can do what they please just like doing whatever we like to a piece of paper.

Joker with 99% of Mxy's power was god-like. There was no concept of life and death, planets were cubes, he imprisoned the Spectre, etc.

When Mr. Mxy and Bat-Mite fought for fun, they destroyed and restarted the entire DC Multiverse.

note: When the Spectre banished all magic, that shuldn't have affected the imps at all, since it's due to their 5th dimension science that allows them to do whatever they please to lower planes of existance.

S.S
Originally posted by leonidas
hmm, i've never been convinced an imp would beat some of the high level cosmics. the reason? ALL high level cosmics (galactus, celestials, watchers and any on that level or above) can ALL perceive and interact with the universe on levels far above what we can or what they are often creditted with. a battle between 2 watchers was waged simultaneously on many levels of reality. odin himself has shook the multiverse. that would include the 5th dimension were the 5th dimension in marvel

featwise, it would seem the imps would/could prevail, but logically i'm just not sure. i don't doubt their reality manipulating abilities, i just don't know if they would work against beings theoretically capable of seeing the universe the same they do.

imps did well (for a time) against spectre, but in the end he proved to be much more powerful than they were i believe.

i'm not completely convinced the 5th dimension wins this one. erm
That's because you think to much old man........stick out tongue

GODSCRIBE
Originally posted by leonidas
hmm, i've never been convinced an imp would beat some of the high level cosmics. the reason? ALL high level cosmics (galactus, celestials, watchers and any on that level or above) can ALL perceive and interact with the universe on levels far above what we can or what they are often creditted with. a battle between 2 watchers was waged simultaneously on many levels of reality. odin himself has shook the multiverse. that would include the 5th dimension were the 5th dimension in marvel

featwise, it would seem the imps would/could prevail, but logically i'm just not sure. i don't doubt their reality manipulating abilities, i just don't know if they would work against beings theoretically capable of seeing the universe the same they do.

imps did well (for a time) against spectre, but in the end he proved to be much more powerful than they were i believe.

i'm not completely convinced the 5th dimension wins this one. erm

interesting big grin

superman41082
Originally posted by BlaqChaos
I'll give the answer in two parts. The first one will be the short, short, answer in this post. The second one (which will take me a few mintues to write out) will be the detailed post.

The Celestials are ervants to Eternity, the same way that Apocalypse is a servant to the Celestials (revealed in this months issue of X-Men). As for your questions:

Q: What are they?
A: See my second post.

Q: Why do they care about this universe so much?
A: It's their job. Just like it's the Watcher's job to watch.

Q: What is their celestial universe like?
A: This is their universe.

Q: Are they still alive, because I heard that Galactus somehow wiped them all out?
A: Yes, they are still alive. They were last seen this month in the latest issue of X-Men, when they took Apocalypse so that he could fulfill his part of the bargain they made with him 5000 years ago. The story of them being taken out by Galactus was probably a story of what happened in Earth X. I'll get into that in the next post.

Q: How do they tie in with the whole Galactus turning into a star and starting the next universe thing?
A: See my second post.

Q: AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, WHERE DID THEY GET THE RIGHTS TO USE THE MONOLITH FROM MY FAVORITE MOVIE(2001 A SPACE ODYSSEY OF COURSE)? I'LL ADD I WAS EXTREMELY UPSET THAT THEY TRIED TO EXPLAIN THAT WHOLE THING. I LIKE TO JUST IGNORE THAT PIECE OF COMIC INFO.......
A: See my second post.

Didn't Cable, Storm, and another X-man get sent through some worm hole or something and get to see the Celestial universe for a quick second and it was completely different? Also, I've heard that they need their suits to survive in this universe, and if it's theirs, why do they need the suits?

Also, where is this elusive 2nd post????

spetznaz
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
einsteinium physics doesn't apply to the imps does it??

celestials are pretty damn powerful, and are tolerant to manipulation and magic (thor's godblast concentrated with the belt of strength did nothing to a celestial). they can hurtle planets and stars and the imps, so i don't know. seems like it will be close.

Not close.

All the imps together would be bloody murder!

Think of it this way ....2 imps (Mr Myx... and Bat-Mite) wrecked the whole of DC .....they were jumping from universe to universe wrecking everything ....literally everything.
Every single Earth in the DC multiverse was destroyed (as in Earth 1, 2, etc, DC one million earth, Earth X, S etc, Kingdom Come earth) ....they even came into our reality (as in the real world), but decided to go back.

After destroying everything they had a laugh, and then reset (yep) everything back to normal and promised each other to do it all over again 'next Tuesday.'

Let's see a celestial ....or any number of them ....do what Bat-mite and Mr Mxy... could do.

Now, add all the imps into the mix. From Mxy's wife to Johnny Thunder's Thunderbolt Imp Genie, to all the various denizens of Mr Mxys and Bat-mite's dimension.

If 2 imps can play kid games with the entire multiverse (and even cross over to our reality), what about an entire dimension of them.

Curb stomp : 10/10 in favor of the imps. (Actually since it is imps we are talking about, it would be more like infinity/nil)

spetznaz
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
yeah, how though. you havent really explained how.

Check my post.

superman41082
Originally posted by spetznaz
Not close.

All the imps together would be bloody murder!

Think of it this way ....2 imps (Mr Myx... and Bat-Mite) wrecked the whole of DC .....they were jumping from universe to universe wrecking everything ....literally everything.
Every single Earth in the DC multiverse was destroyed (as in Earth 1, 2, etc, DC one million earth, Earth X, S etc, Kingdom Come earth) ....they even came into our reality (as in the real world), but decided to go back.

After destroying everything they had a laugh, and then reset (yep) everything back to normal and promised each other to do it all over again 'next Tuesday.'

Let's see a celestial ....or any number of them ....do what Bat-mite and Mr Mxy... could do.

Now, add all the imps into the mix. From Mxy's wife to Johnny Thunder's Thunderbolt Imp Genie, to all the various denizens of Mr Mxys and Bat-mite's dimension.

If 2 imps can play kid games with the entire multiverse (and even cross over to our reality), what about an entire dimension of them.

Curb stomp : 10/10 in favor of the imps. (Actually since it is imps we are talking about, it would be more like infinity/nil)

Wow..... interesting, but we can't know everything about the Celestials Tech. What if they have something that can zap them and make them 4th demensional little girls?????

leonidas
Originally posted by S.S
That's because you think to much old man........stick out tongue

why you . . . mad

you should hope to be as old -- er, as wise and middle aged as i am!! big grin

GODSCRIBE
Originally posted by spetznaz
Not close.

All the imps together would be bloody murder!

Think of it this way ....2 imps (Mr Myx... and Bat-Mite) wrecked the whole of DC .....they were jumping from universe to universe wrecking everything ....literally everything.
Every single Earth in the DC multiverse was destroyed (as in Earth 1, 2, etc, DC one million earth, Earth X, S etc, Kingdom Come earth) ....they even came into our reality (as in the real world), but decided to go back.

After destroying everything they had a laugh, and then reset (yep) everything back to normal and promised each other to do it all over again 'next Tuesday.'

Let's see a celestial ....or any number of them ....do what Bat-mite and Mr Mxy... could do.


Actually they can. They can destroy universes pretty easily as well. They can also time travel and traverse dimensions and destroy them just as easily. But they aren't a destructive race, so they don't do it. But in the Infinity Gauntlet saga, it was pretty evident how easy they could destroy a universe.

S.S
Originally posted by leonidas
why you . . . mad

you should hope to be as old -- er, as wise and middle aged as i am!! big grin
stick out tongue
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
Actually they can. They can destroy universes pretty easily as well. They can also time travel and traverse dimensions and destroy them just as easily. But they aren't a destructive race, so they don't do it. But in the Infinity Gauntlet saga, it was pretty evident how easy they could destroy a universe.
Read what Spetznaz posted
Originally posted by spetznaz
Not close.

All the imps together would be bloody murder!

Think of it this way ....2 imps (Mr Myx... and Bat-Mite) wrecked the whole of DC .....they were jumping from universe to universe wrecking everything ....literally everything.
Every single Earth in the DC multiverse was destroyed (as in Earth 1, 2, etc, DC one million earth, Earth X, S etc, Kingdom Come earth) ....they even came into our reality (as in the real world), but decided to go back.

After destroying everything they had a laugh, and then reset (yep) everything back to normal and promised each other to do it all over again 'next Tuesday.'

Let's see a celestial ....or any number of them ....do what Bat-mite and Mr Mxy... could do.

Now, add all the imps into the mix. From Mxy's wife to Johnny Thunder's Thunderbolt Imp Genie, to all the various denizens of Mr Mxys and Bat-mite's dimension.

If 2 imps can play kid games with the entire multiverse (and even cross over to our reality), what about an entire dimension of them.

Curb stomp : 10/10 in favor of the imps. (Actually since it is imps we are talking about, it would be more like infinity/nil)

Mordum
I say the imps should win this. The celestials use m-bodys to travel through the universe but i wonder how powerful they are in their true form. Just like eternity gets punkd all the time but in his true form he should curbstomp almost anyone.

GODSCRIBE
I did read what he wrote....actually what I posted was directed at what he wrote.

BlaqChaos

Darksaint
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
Actually they can. They can destroy universes pretty easily as well. They can also time travel and traverse dimensions and destroy them just as easily. But they aren't a destructive race, so they don't do it. But in the Infinity Gauntlet saga, it was pretty evident how easy they could destroy a universe.

There's no evidence that the Celestials are multiversal/affecting the multiverse. Sure they cross between universes and different dimensions, but that's only crossing barriers, not destroying any of them. And it would take them a while to destroy a single universe also, let alone restart all of creation. Emperor Joker was playing around with the universe, restarting it back up with a blink of an eye. The Imps are beyond the DC Multiverse; it is even implied that they exist in Marvel.

GODSCRIBE
Originally posted by Darksaint
There's no evidence that the Celestials are multiversal/affecting the multiverse. Sure they cross between universes and different dimensions, but that's only crossing barriers, not destroying any of them. And it would take them a while to destroy a single universe also, let alone restart all of creation. The Imps are beyond the DC Multiverse; it even implied that they exist in Marvel.

Why would they randomly start destroying universes? I never said they did. I said they could. They were using entire inhabited planets as basketballs for Christ's sake.

But if they were doing all that in the blink of an eye, then it's an entirely different case.

BlaqChaos
Originally posted by Mordum
I say the imps should win this. The celestials use m-bodys to travel through the universe but i wonder how powerful they are in their true form. Just like eternity gets punkd all the time but in his true form he should curbstomp almost anyone. BTW, ALL of Marvel's entities use M-Bodies or Avatars including the Living Tribunal and Phoenix Force.

Abstract beings who have employed M-Bodies include Anomoly, Death, Epoch, Eternity, the In-Betweener, Infinity, Kronos, the LT, Lord Chaos, Master Order, Mistress Love, Oblivion, and Sire Hate.

In some cases, beings who do possesses a physical form have employed a M-body in order to put in an appearance somewhere without actually attending. Physical beings who have employed M-bodies include the Celestials, Galactus, the Gardener, Mephisto, the Stranger, Jack of Hearts, Moondragon, Photon, Quasar, Starfox, Thor and Tigra.

leonidas
there has also been a suggested link between the powers of the imps and the anti-life equation . . . shifty

as for this battle, i'm still not sure. i think it stems from the name -- 5th dimension -- and what it is supposed to be. again, all cosmics can interact with higher levels of reality so there must be more to it. i don't know . . . sad

Darksaint
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE

But if they were doing all that in the blink of an eye, then it's an entirely different case.

It's one thing to destroy a universe, it's another to have the power to simply restart it and set everything back to normal again. That's what the Joker was doing when he had Mr. Mxy's power, literally in a blink of an eye. Also, the Celestials are not beyond the abstracts, and we know the Imp's are at least beyond Death itself; there was no concept of life and death when Joker ruled the universe.

BlaqChaos

leonidas
be a lot faster to just post the link to whatever site you're copying and pasting from . . .

UniOmni
I thought the fight between Batmite and Mxy was elseworlds??

And for the record, Spectre has scared imps off as well. With a mere threat. So i doubt they truly exist outside the Presences jurisdiction.

So many low/weird showings......Mxy was killed by Gog in an elseworlds, and he was created by mere skyfather level beings?!! Celestials hold skyfathers in contempt..... I don't see it as cut and dry either way.

leonidas
it was worlds funnest comic book with mxy and batmite. i wasn't sure it was canon either. is it certain that it is?

interesting that gog killed an imp. i didn't kow that. but they are obviously still under the presence's purview.

i agree -- not completely cut and dry.

Mider
just one imp Myx when he gave 99 percent of his power to the joker the joker totally rearanged the universe, messed up the concept of death by messing with it and traped the spectre somewhere where he could escape but would have devistating consequences for the universe if he did escape.

BlaqChaos
Originally posted by UniOmni
I thought the fight between Batmite and Mxy was elseworlds??

And for the record, Spectre has scared imps off as well. With a mere threat. So i doubt they truly exist outside the Presences jurisdiction.

So many low/weird showings......Mxy was killed by Gog in an elseworlds, and he was created by mere skyfather level beings?!! Celestials hold skyfathers in contempt..... I don't see it as cut and dry either way. It's not on-line, it's from the OHOTMU A-Z: Benny Beckley to Crazy Eight. (And no, I don't have a scanner either.)

Mider
you call elseworlds non canon yet you say gog killed him and that story was an else worlds?

BlaqChaos
While on Earth, the Celestials were forced to turn on one of their own, a golden Celestial named Tiamut. Unable to slay Tiamut, they used a cosmic weapon that drove the energy from its form, turning it's armor black. The Celestials struck all records of Tiamut's name from history, so that it is now known only as either "the Black Celestial" or "the Dreaming Celestial." The Eternal Valkin witnessed this event, and the Celestial's placed their weapon into his hands for safekeeping, along with contianied energy taken from the Celestial. The Dreaming Celestial's crime remains unrevealed, although the Deviants came to believe that it was their creator, and had been punished for making them. An entire preisthood which worshipped the Dreaming Celestial came into existance over the millinnia that followed.

When tthe third Host came one thousand years ago, humanity had become the dominant species on Earth, and some of the cultures who observed the Celestials worshipped them as "Space Gods," buliding temples and statues in their honor. The Incas' City of the Space Gods, built high in the Andes, served as their main base on Earth during this host. Other beings worshiped by humanity were distressed by the Celestials' interference, and the gods Zues, Odin and Vishnu confronted the Celestials. The Eternal Ajak was sent to communicate on the Celestials' behalf, and he warned that if the gods attempted to interfere with their mission, the Celestials would sever the Earth's connections to their godly realms, denying them any contact with their worshippers.

The three gods agreed not to interfere with the Celestials for a thousand years, but Odin immediately began to prepare for an all-out war with them, fashioning the mystical armor of the Destroyer to combat them one day. The goddess and Earth mother Gaea sought a peaceful solution to the threat of the Celestials judgement and, allied with goddesses of all the Earthly religions, she began to gather what they regarded as the best specimens of humanity. Tantalus of Armechadon came to Earth during this time, but the Celestials exiled him there, leaving him unable to tend to his star-spanning empire. The Eternals Ajak and Zuras assisted the Celestials in their departure from Earth, and Ajak and Zuras assisted the Celestials in their departure from Earth, and Ajak placed himself within suspended animation at the City of the Space Gods to await the fourth Host. Zuras ordered the Eternal Ikaris to hone his powers to sense the approach of the fianl Host, so that he could revive Ajak in time. The Celestials left behind one of their vessels, which was later claimed by the mutant En Sabah Nur, eventually known as Apocalypse, who transformed himself using the Celestials' technology. (When Apocalypse entered the ship, one of the Celestials' contacted him telepathically. It gave him a choice. They would give him full access to the ship, but at some undetermined point in the future they would call on him to fulfill their wishes for something. If he refused, the ship would disappear and be lost to him forever. He accepted their terms, thus the ship became his.)

In modern times, Ikaris awakened Ajak and, alongside the humans Margo and Dr. Daniel Damian and the Deviant warlord Kro, they witnessed the arrival of the fourth Host. The Deviants, still humbled by the effects of the second Host, feared what judgement might bring, and attempted to manipulate humanity into assaulting the Host, but the Eternals were able to cooperate with humanity and convince them to let the Celestials do their work. As Eson inspected the new incarnation of Deviant Lemuria, it wound up unintentionally destroying the city, forcing the Deviants to relocate yet again. When the Deviants attempted to assault the Celestial mothership, the Eternal called the Forgotten One came to their rescue, dismantling the Deviant's bomb. The One Above All was so impressed that the Forgotten One was brought aboard the mothership and rechristened "Hero." As Hero, he was sent to warn the Eternals from interfering with the Celestials, but the Eternals' ally Thor bested him in combat.

Odin finnly convinced the Eternals to side with him against the Celestials, and Odin absorbed the souls of all the Asgardians (except Thor) into the magical Destroyer construct, expanding its size to match the Celestials and armed with the mystical Odinsword. Aided by the Eternals joined together as the psychic entity the Uni-mind, they were nevertheless destroyed by the Host. Although Thor later recovered all of the slain Asgardians with the aid of the other Earthly gods, Zurras was slain by psychic feedback from the uin-mind's destruction. Gaea finally faced the Celestials herself, and presented to them twelve young men and women she and her allies had gathered, and this offering to judge in Earth's favor swayed Arishem. The Host departed Earth with the twelve "Young Gods," whom they placed in the care of Juniper and Katos, two aliens serving aboard their mothership.

(That' it for today, I'll put the last few paragraphs in tomorrow.)

GODSCRIBE
Originally posted by Mider
just one imp Myx when he gave 99 percent of his power to the joker the joker totally rearanged the universe, messed up the concept of death by messing with it and traped the spectre somewhere where he could escape but would have devistating consequences for the universe if he did escape.

Yeah this has been explained at length already. It's nice to see you contributing though wink

dman2008
ugh I can't beleive this is still being Debated
Joker with Mxys powers destroyed the universe and then rebuilt it effortlessly in the Emeperor Joker storyline as seen here
http://img107.imageshack.us/my.php?image=adventuresofsuperman583p208em.jpg
http://img530.imageshack.us/my.php?image=adventuresofsuperman583p214tl.jpg
http://img530.imageshack.us/my.php?image=adventuresofsuperman583p221tc.jpg

which is Cannon .

dman2008
Joker with Mxy's powers also took over the mind sof high power cosimics like Phantom Stranger, Ganthet, Zeus, Shazam, and Darkseid

http://img52.imageshack.us/my.php?image=emperorjokerpage317mi.jpg
http://img205.imageshack.us/my.php?image=emperorjokerpage327lr.jpg


he also took control over the spectre with mxy's powers
http://img389.imageshack.us/my.php?image=manofsteel105p172oa.jpg

dman2008
and thats just one imp doing all that

BlaqChaos
Still goes to Thanos.

dman2008
Originally posted by BlaqChaos
Still goes to Thanos.

no roll eyes (sarcastic)

Lord Urizen
Guys I am ignorant of DC's Imps. What is the Fifth Dimension ? Would someone mind summarising that for me ?

Avalonofthewind
The celestials are powerful, but I can't see them winning this.
They would have enough problems with a single imp. All of them together is simply overkill.

BlaqChaos
Originally posted by dman2008
no roll eyes (sarcastic) Let me clarify. The Celestials would get stomped, but Thanos with the HOTU would wipe the floor with them.

dman2008
Originally posted by BlaqChaos
Let me clarify. The Celestials would get stomped, but Thanos with the HOTU would wipe the floor with them.

oh I thouigh you meant Thanos by himself laughing

leonidas
the celestials could always just call in the 10th dimensional imps to wipe out the 5d imps. wink

dman2008
Originally posted by leonidas
the celestials could always just call in the 10th dimensional imps to wipe out the 5d imps. wink


mad

spetznaz
Originally posted by dman2008
Joker with Mxy's powers also took over the mind sof high power cosimics like Phantom Stranger, Ganthet, Zeus, Shazam, and Darkseid

http://img52.imageshack.us/my.php?image=emperorjokerpage317mi.jpg
http://img205.imageshack.us/my.php?image=emperorjokerpage327lr.jpg


he also took control over the spectre with mxy's powers
http://img389.imageshack.us/my.php?image=manofsteel105p172oa.jpg

Interesting allusion in the first 2 scans to the Anti-Life Equation.

Reminds me of the time when Darkseid floats through space holding a piece of paper that states something along the lines of: 'Anti-life equation = Mr Mxy.... + Batmite'

Kind of gives credence to that in a convoluted manner.
DC needs to explore into the 5th dimension some more. Could be, and I'm just musing, that just as in the Marvel Universe Cosmic Cubes can develop sentience and take on a life, and a will, of their own, that maybe the 5th Dimension (and the denizen imps) might be infact manifestations of the ALE.
In which case we are talking about some major potence here.
And it is easy to see from what Batmite and Mr Mxy were doing, or for that matter the way the Joker, with 99% of Mxy's power, was fiddling with the universe as if it was no joke (and even taking over folks like Ganthet, SkyFather etc, as well as the Spectre).
The whole imp/5th dimension thing is definitely more than just some silly-looking magical guy. This is not some male pixie thinking it is Zatanna or Zatarra. Shifting reality like it is nothing, and pwning truly uber characters like they were naught, brings into question just what the nature of the imps and the 5th dimension truly is.
And the allusions to the anti-life equation muddy the water a bit more.
Suffice it to say that the imps are definitely more than meets the eye, and the whole shebang might be some manifestation of some of the more seminal foundation powers in the DCU.

In the beginning .....


Anyways, the Imps take the Celestials.
While the Celestials are (basically, or at least arguably) omnipotent, imps are above 'mere' omnipotence (.....and no, I comprehend that omnipotence signifies being allpowerful, and thus it is illogical to have anything above that! However in the case of the imps logic doesn't suffice, and thus it is possible to give them an 11 out of a scale that maxes out at 10 )

leonidas
though i remain not wholly convinced (though as i said featwise imps have it all over celestials) i hope you're right about the imp importance. they have always been silly little things that seem to serve no purpose. merely being 5th dimensional should NOT be enough to grant the power (and it IS debatable if mxy even HAS powers or whether he just uses 5d science ala ironman or batman to make it LOOK like he has powers). dc also made them look silly and less than by having 10d beings come in and kick their arses. how many dimensions are there? is each higher more powerful than the lower ones? where does it stop?

imps are silly and emerpor joker should never have happened . . .

Avalonofthewind
Well, Celestials are bound by logic and the rules of the universe somewhat, while imps aren't.

In the 5th dimension eyes, even Celestials would appear as paper to them.

leonidas
but the question is why? why can't a cosmic entity percieve things in higher dimensional levels. i mentioned the watchers battling across all levels of reality. odin has done something similar.

and again, the 5d imps are nothing to the 10d ones. where does it stop?

Avalonofthewind
Originally posted by leonidas
but the question is why? why can't a cosmic entity percieve things in higher dimensional levels. i mentioned the watchers battling across all levels of reality. odin has done something similar.

and again, the 5d imps are nothing to the 10d ones. where does it stop?

Perceiving is one thing, having the power to do something about it is another. For example, when CM went ot the 5th dimension, he perceived it just fine, but he was still nothing to them.

When Thanos had both the IG and the HOTU which are not multiversal, all the abstracts were screwed.

The problem here is that Imp > Celestial by far, and then we have countless imps from a dimension vs a handful of celestials from the standard 616.

I've seen Mxy's power alone, and he's done Infinity gauntlet things under his own power. A full dimension of beings like this is overkill IMO.

spetznaz
Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Perceiving is one thing, having the power to do something about it is another. For example, when CM went ot the 5th dimension, he perceived it just fine, but he was still nothing to them.

When Thanos had both the IG and the HOTU which are not multiversal, all the abstracts were screwed.

The problem here is that Imp > Celestial by far, and then we have countless imps from a dimension vs a handful of celestials from the standard 616.

I've seen Mxy's power alone, and he's done Infinity gauntlet things under his own power. A full dimension of beings like this is overkill IMO.

True.

Mr Mxy, by himself, has done things that are directly analogous to what Thanos was doing when he had the Infinity Gauntlet, and for that matter has even surpassed such levels.
Moreover the Joker, with 99% of Mxy's power, was also doing feats that were at a level of the IG, and with ease ......and which even went to remaking the universe in his own image and other Parallax level feats.

Consequently, a whole dimension of imps would be the epitome of overkill.

Anyways, more thoughts on the 5th dimension and its imps.
I dredged this up from Wikipedia:

(Im)possible alias?

Marvel Comics' Impossible Man seems to have been modelled after Mxyzptlk, and writers at DC have suggested that the two characters are one and the same: in Superman (volume 2) #50, Mxyzptlk mentions that he's been "having fun with my new fantastic friends" and later mentions getting "back to my four new friends", referring presumably to the Fantastic Four; he also uses the expression "it's blubbering time" (a play on the Thing's standard battle-cry "it's clobbering time"wink, and says that he's been having "a backlog of mayhem in another dimension", probably referring to the Marvel Universe. Mxyzptlk keeps altering his form constantly in this issue, and also changes into a form similar to that of the Impossible Man, and says "Sometimes it's just impossible to remember what I look like from world to world"; the emphasis on "impossible", like with the other keywords "fantastic" and "four", are all written in italic type.

Later on, in 1996, the Impossible Man and Mxyzptlk teamed up in the DC/Marvel crossover story Silver Surfer vs. Superman, in which the two imps combined their powers to swap universes for the Silver Surfer and Superman. Here the power of Impossible Man was more like Mxyzptlk's own reality warping powers, rather than just shapeshifting. In this comic, Mxyzptlk and Impossible Man have a fight where they keep changing into various characters from their respective universe, for instance The Incredible Hulk and Doomsday.

It is interesting to note the allusion that Mxy's in the Marvel universe as well, and once you add this to how he was popping up in all the various DC earths and universes (as well as coming into our reality ...i.e the 'real world') then it opens up interesting questions.

Anyways, I'd say that the imps are close to what the Q-collective/dimension was like in Star Trek.
Remember Q .....the guy who could play footsie with reality and the universe and do anything he wanted, and was a prankster like Mr Mxy was (and probably was based on Mxy since the only thing different about them is looks ....everything else, from the uber powers to the pranks and 'tests,' to the fact that they both really never 'hurt' anyone, to the fact that they stem from some extraneous dimension which is populated with uber-powerful beings like them, to how they plague certain characters ....Mxy with Superman, and Q with Captain Piccard ....the two characters are basically the exact same character in everything BUT appearance, and since both can change appearance then it could be argued that they might be the same exact character).
Who knows .....if DC ever participated in a comic that had Star Trek in it (there were some Star Trek comics I bumped into in the early 90s, but not from DC) then there would be an opportunity to haver a link between Q (the various Qs) and Mr Mxy (and the various imps).
This would be another potential for another interesting allusion.

Avalonofthewind
Originally posted by spetznaz
True.

Mr Mxy, by himself, has done things that are directly analogous to what Thanos was doing when he had the Infinity Gauntlet, and for that matter has even surpassed such levels.
Moreover the Joker, with 99% of Mxy's power, was also doing feats that were at a level of the IG, and with ease ......and which even went to remaking the universe in his own image and other Parallax level feats.

Consequently, a whole dimension of imps would be the epitome of overkill.

Anyways, more thoughts on the 5th dimension and its imps.
I dredged this up from Wikipedia:

(Im)possible alias?

Marvel Comics' Impossible Man seems to have been modelled after Mxyzptlk, and writers at DC have suggested that the two characters are one and the same: in Superman (volume 2) #50, Mxyzptlk mentions that he's been "having fun with my new fantastic friends" and later mentions getting "back to my four new friends", referring presumably to the Fantastic Four; he also uses the expression "it's blubbering time" (a play on the Thing's standard battle-cry "it's clobbering time"wink, and says that he's been having "a backlog of mayhem in another dimension", probably referring to the Marvel Universe. Mxyzptlk keeps altering his form constantly in this issue, and also changes into a form similar to that of the Impossible Man, and says "Sometimes it's just impossible to remember what I look like from world to world"; the emphasis on "impossible", like with the other keywords "fantastic" and "four", are all written in italic type.

Later on, in 1996, the Impossible Man and Mxyzptlk teamed up in the DC/Marvel crossover story Silver Surfer vs. Superman, in which the two imps combined their powers to swap universes for the Silver Surfer and Superman. Here the power of Impossible Man was more like Mxyzptlk's own reality warping powers, rather than just shapeshifting. In this comic, Mxyzptlk and Impossible Man have a fight where they keep changing into various characters from their respective universe, for instance The Incredible Hulk and Doomsday.

It is interesting to note the allusion that Mxy's in the Marvel universe as well, and once you add this to how he was popping up in all the various DC earths and universes (as well as coming into our reality ...i.e the 'real world') then it opens up interesting questions.

Anyways, I'd say that the imps are close to what the Q-collective/dimension was like in Star Trek.
Remember Q .....the guy who could play footsie with reality and the universe and do anything he wanted, and was a prankster like Mr Mxy was (and probably was based on Mxy since the only thing different about them is looks ....everything else, from the uber powers to the pranks and 'tests,' to the fact that they both really never 'hurt' anyone, to the fact that they stem from some extraneous dimension which is populated with uber-powerful beings like them, to how they plague certain characters ....Mxy with Superman, and Q with Captain Piccard ....the two characters are basically the exact same character in everything BUT appearance, and since both can change appearance then it could be argued that they might be the same exact character).
Who knows .....if DC ever participated in a comic that had Star Trek in it (there were some Star Trek comics I bumped into in the early 90s, but not from DC) then there would be an opportunity to haver a link between Q (the various Qs) and Mr Mxy (and the various imps).
This would be another potential for another interesting allusion.

Agreed. I think the Joker saga was modelled after the gauntlet in some ways, such as when he effortlessly modelled the stars to draw Harley Quinns face, and how he manhandled the skyfathers.

leonidas
given what they've done, i suppose it only stands to reason they could take the celestials. just doesn't make sense. why on earth wouldn't a cosmic being be able to perceive things in 5 dimensions? bah, 'fraid i just don't like the imps (due to the inexplicable nature of their powers) and would love to see them go the way of the classic beyonder. their power should at best be at a universal level as there is a 5th dimension in each universe.

bean_machine
Originally posted by leonidas
given what they've done, i suppose it only stands to reason they could take the celestials. just doesn't make sense. why on earth wouldn't a cosmic being be able to perceive things in 5 dimensions? bah, 'fraid i just don't like the imps (due to the inexplicable nature of their powers) and would love to see them go the way of the classic beyonder. their power should at best be at a universal level as there is a 5th dimension in each universe.

Noooooo poor classic beyonder. sad The imps are pimps they should not go the way of classic beyonder. sad

leonidas
then they should have their powers more properly explained. sad

Templares
Imps and Looney Toons >>>>> Celestials. You just cant argue against them.

spetznaz
Originally posted by leonidas
then they should have their powers more properly explained. sad

Agreed.
I'd just hope that a competent writer handled it.

leonidas
of course everyone would agree that lt trumps all imps, right . . . shifty

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