Kratos vs Sephiroth

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Major Snafu
The pissed-off Ghost of Sparda versus the insane SOLDIER with the long-ass sword. This is the Advent Children version of Sephiroth, but with his FF7 stats.

The showdown is at Nibelheim (right after Sephiroth barbecues it)

IceJaw
Sparta *

Major Snafu
Originally posted by IceJaw
Sparta *

Oops. My bad. Damn typos.

Rewmac
You mean Sephiroth versus the new God Of War, who beat tons of big ass monsters from Mythologies, f'ucked with the Gods and killed Ares??? I'll say Kratos.

Major Snafu
Originally posted by Rewmac
You mean Sephiroth versus the new God Of War, who beat tons of big ass monsters from Mythologies, f'ucked with the Gods and killed Ares??? I'll say Kratos.

In this match, he's not the God of War just yet. He's the pissed-off Ghose of Sparta.

TricksterPriest
Hmm. Still gotta go with Kratos. Not only do I not like Sephiroth, but Kratos is a much better fighter. Kratos earned his victories and abilities, Sephiroth had them handed to him.

ESB -1138
Sephiroth would just use Heartless Angel. End of battle.

SpadeKing
Advent children Sephiroth? with FF7 stats?... you mean attacks?

ESB -1138
That's what I'm guessing. I mean stats would really be the same from Advent Children and FF7.

Major Snafu
Originally posted by ESB -1138
That's what I'm guessing. I mean stats would really be the same from Advent Children and FF7.

I'm just using the Advent Children Sephy for apprarance only. His stats come from the time he is one of the good guys (during Cloud's flashback scene in Kalm).

And they are Riduculously high.

Burning thought
Kratos easily, Grabs sephy by his long hair and ties him down and kicks him in the stomach till he cries like a girl

SpadeKing
ooooohhhhh....

Seph whoops Kratos' ass erm

Kaled
in that state as awesome as kratos is he's no match
sephiroth out does him in nearly every aspect, expect dying

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Kaled
in that state as awesome as kratos is he's no match
sephiroth out does him in nearly every aspect, expect dying

Burning thought
hmm Kratos needs god form then he woops sephiroth

SpadeKing
then sephiroth plays his theme song and kills him in god form no expression

Rewmac
So he is not God Of War?? Then does he have the magics unlocked and the Blade Of Artemis. Coz If Sephiroth got his magics Kratos should do too...In that way he can just call the Hordes Of Hades Magic and hit him woth Poseidon's Rage or single handedly using Meduza's Gaze making him a stone and then with the Blades Of Artemis just smash him into pieces.

Roxas XIII
Come on, this is Sephiroth. Haven't you watched Advent Children or the fight with him on Crisis Core between Angeal and Genesis? Sephiroth is the guy the cuts buildings apart with a swing of a sword, that takes six cuts with six busterswords to kill. No doubt he could slice a mountain apart if he wanted to, something even Kratos couldn't do in a single slash as the God of War. Don't get me wrong, Kratos is definitely bad ass, extremely bad ass, but up against a guy that destroys skyscrapers made of metal like in Advent Children and Crisis Core, Kratos has no chance. It's just an opinion so say what you want

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by Snafu the Great
I'm just using the Advent Children Sephy for apprarance only. His stats come from the time he is one of the good guys (during Cloud's flashback scene in Kalm).

And they are Riduculously high.

Then you may as well have just said Crisis Core Sephiroth, who Kratos obliterates given the fact, among other reasons, that it's Sephiroth's weakest known state. AC Seph with his AC "stats" (otherwise what I'd consider a "full-powered Sephiroth"wink would give a full-powered Kratos a much better run for his money.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Roxas XIII
Prove it.

Kratos crushes CC Seph.

Burning thought
this been done? like in the other thread or w/e

like in that one, Kratos wins

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by Roxas XIII
something even Kratos couldn't do in a single slash as the God of War.

As a God, Kratos could annihilate an entire army with one geture, no doubt it would have the same effect on Crisis Core's Sephiroth. Kratos tossed a living mountain-sized statue to the ground with his bare hands when NOT his God form (his Godly powers were what imbued the statue to life).



Only in this one, Kratos' victory is just short of a curb stomp whereas AC Sephiroth(who has the exact same appearance as CC Sephiroth anyway :/ ) vs. A fully-powered Kratos is a much more fair fight.

CosmicSurfer
Mundus ruled an entire hell dimension. The Greek gods didn't rule the earth, did they? Ares couldn't even destroy a city. Let alone a planet. Not saying that Sephiroth did, but he did have the potential.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
Mundus ruled an entire hell dimension. The Greek gods didn't rule the earth, did they? Ares couldn't even destroy a city. Let alone a planet. Not saying that Sephiroth did, but he did have the potential. Wtf does Mundus have to do with this fight?

CosmicSurfer
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Wtf does Mundus have to do with this fight?

Oh shit, my bad. I posted in the wrong thread. embarrasment embarrasment I was thinking about dante for some reason. Forget what I said before.

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
Mundus ruled an entire hell dimension. The Greek gods didn't rule the earth, did they? Ares couldn't even destroy a city. Let alone a planet. Not saying that Sephiroth did, but he did have the potential.

In Greek Mythology, Zeus was one of three primary rulers of the universe, and that doesn't seem to have changed with God of War, except for the fact that Kratos, Zeus' son, the new leader of the Titans, and the new controller of time and fate, is dead-set on killing Zeus. Ares only destroyed a city out of a grudge towards Zeus for "casting his favor on Athena".

SHM
Originally posted by Burning thought
this been done? like in the other thread or w/e

like in that one, Kratos wins

The other thread where Kratos "won", happened only in your dreams.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by SHM
The other thread where Kratos "won", happened only in your dreams. Kratos can physically bend Sephiroth over his knee and spank him, and Seph would not be able to do a thing.

SHM
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Kratos can physically bend Sephiroth over his knee and spank him, and Seph would not be able to do a thing.

If you ignore all of Sephiroth's abilities... Yeah, sure.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by SHM
If you ignore all of Sephiroth's abilities... Yeah, sure. Like what? The ability to be pwned?

SHM
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Like what? The ability to be pwned?

Nope. The ability to make Kratos his b*tch, with just his theme song.

Blax_Hydralisk
Which isn't even all that good, and is a mystery as to why all the fat phales in my algebra class orgasmed when one of there fat phale friends' cell phone ringtone came on, and it was Sephs' theme.

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by SHM
Nope. The ability to make Kratos his b*tch, with just his theme song.

Just because Kratos doesn't have a theme song doesn't mean his game series doesn't have a soundtrack that blows every heavy metal remix(No offense, Black Mages) in the FFVII Compilation and all of it's 3+ One Winged Angel mixes out of the water. If it took good music, then God of War, Okami, Shadow of the Colossus, etc. would make FFVII crawl into a fetal position while foaming at the mouth.

Dark-Jaxx
Niggaplulz SHM, Perfect Cell's them in DBZ Budokai is better than One Winged Angel.

Well it is.

ESB -1138
There is no piece of music in gaming, anime, or television that can match that of One Winged Angel. Only movies have an equal and that's Battle of the Heroes from Episode III: Revenge of the Sith.

Blax_Hydralisk
hm...

Nah. Overrated theme song from an overrated character.

Dark-Jaxx
Yep. One Winged Angel ain't got shit on God of War music.

But NOTHING else in gaming can compare to Phantasy Star Ep.1-2 music. Shit puts you to sleep while playing the game. haermm

ESB -1138
The best game that has the best music has always been the Sonic games (lately it's been horrible gameplay but the music is still amazing) but there is no track in any God of War game that can be compared to One Winged Angel.

Yes Sephiroth is overrated and I believe he and Cloud hit it off like two gay howler monkeys in a hot summer day because no straight guy would be thinking about Sephiroth when Tifa and Aerith are basically giving themselves to you; but the song is without a doubt a masterpiece that God of War fails to match.

Dark-Jaxx
Never.

And as for anime and shit...Please. There are much better pieces.

A friggin DBZ videogame gave the main villain a better theme than Sephiroth.

And Sonic music is God. That is true. Live and Learn to date is my favorite videogame song.

Blax_Hydralisk
My favorite is Billy Joel's segment in Halo 3.

smile

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
My favorite is Billy Joel's segment in Halo 3.

smile Stfu homo and MSN me. I is lonely. sad

Blax_Hydralisk
Mad World was cool to, though that doesn't really count as game music.

Dark-Jaxx
Which reminds me...The character in my sig could beat up all the ones in you guy's sigs. 131

Blax_Hydralisk
Yeah he'd win in all the contests except for the one that matters: appearance.

He looks like a white gorilla in your avatar.

Dark-Jaxx
No way, he looks like Donny Osmond, who you use as a pic of yourself to pic up chicks, or more specifically you use a pic of a guy who looks like him, loser. haermm

Eman5805
Originally posted by ESB -1138
There is no piece of music in gaming, anime, or television that can match that of One Winged Angel. Only movies have an equal and that's Battle of the Heroes from Episode III: Revenge of the Sith.

Someone hasn't played Streets or Rage or Shadow of the Colossus. I can't even pick one single track out of either, the whole soundtrack is awesome. "Time's Scar' from Chrono Cross is another great one that I put on an even level if not above "One Winged Angel."

Sephy's theme is just the far more famous song.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Never.

And as for anime and shit...Please. There are much better pieces.

A friggin DBZ videogame gave the main villain a better theme than Sephiroth.

And Sonic music is God. That is true. Live and Learn to date is my favorite videogame song.

Well then it would seem we just have different tastes when it comes to music then because frankly I found the music in the DBZ games very boring and genetic. And anime is basically what every FPS is turning in to; the same piece of crap that you just went through only with a different character who looks just like another character from an FPS with a story that is laughable and half the time they're telling you that war is bad but instead of doing something about it you are sent out to kill even more until everyone is dead besides you and thus you cannot possibly have anymore wars until the next uninspired sequel (Gundam anyone?).

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by ESB -1138
The best game that has the best music has always been the Sonic games (lately it's been horrible gameplay but the music is still amazing) but there is no track in any God of War game that can be compared to One Winged Angel.

Yes Sephiroth is overrated and I believe he and Cloud hit it off like two gay howler monkeys in a hot summer day because no straight guy would be thinking about Sephiroth when Tifa and Aerith are basically giving themselves to you; but the song is without a doubt a masterpiece that God of War fails to match.

The Minotaur boss fight alone had a more frighteningly enticing song than One Wiged Angel had ever been for me. The only reasons One-Winged Angel ever has any kind of epicness to it is because of the cicumstances of the scene which is how it became memorable. In that sense, it kind of is overrated. When actually listening to the songs outside of the game, God of War's soundtrack has been considered Triple A film material (not CG fanservice film material), whereas One Winged Angel really is just a typical RPG tune that just so happens to have been remixed like twice, even though only one remix is any good. No offense, but the way you decribe it just proves how overrated One Winged Angel really is.

Even Metal Gear Solid has better music than what FFVII ever offered (in termso f being good music, not a memorable theme song). It doesn't take an ominous tune and repetitious latin lyrics to make a theme song epic. Almost any of God of War's songs could've been used as music for a final boss anywhere else.

Not to mention Crisis Core's recent remix of One Winged Angel practically butchered the song.

As for Sonic games, the only song that had consitently pissed me off was Zebrahead's lyrical version of "His World" (the instrumental version's good though, they were smart to have put that one in Brawl).

DantevsKratos
sephiroth would kill kratos i mean if kratos gets 8 ft of range he is dead meat

Dark-Jaxx
It Sephiroth gets within 15 feet of range he is dead meat. C WUT EYE DID THAR!?

Terryc250
Im still waiting on what Kratos can do against NL, or Sephiroth willpower, speed, etc, all people have stated is who Kratos beat, sorry but thats all PIS involved, just like how link beats ganon all the time, and how cloud beat sephiroth.
In a real fight we judge by the powers, strength, etc..

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Terryc250
Im still waiting on what Kratos can do against NL, or Sephiroth willpower, speed, etc, all people have stated is who Kratos beat, sorry but thats all PIS involved, just like how link beats ganon all the time, and how cloud beat sephiroth.
In a real fight we judge by the powers, strength, etc.. NL has NEVER been used in a fight. Willpower............Lol. Speed can be handled by Kratos' many spells. KRatos is stronger and much more skilled.

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by Terryc250
Im still waiting on what Kratos can do against NL, or Sephiroth willpower, speed, etc, all people have stated is who Kratos beat, sorry but thats all PIS involved, just like how link beats ganon all the time, and how cloud beat sephiroth.
In a real fight we judge by the powers, strength, etc..

His fight against Persephone was not PIS, nor were the Sisters of Fate or any of the Greek heroes or mythical beasts he killed (unless you count a bridge or a mast as PIS, but I just see it as taking advantage of the envrionment). Ares was his only real PIS battle.

Terryc250
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
NL has NEVER been used in a fight. Willpower............Lol. Speed can be handled by Kratos' many spells. KRatos is stronger and much more skilled.
But we do know the powers of the lifestream, just because we never seen it in action doesn't mean it doesn't exist, yes willpower. What "spells" can he do against Sephiroths speed? Sephiroth speed is basically instant, as is his teleportation, what is Kratos strength feats anyway?

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Terryc250
But we do know the powers of the lifestream, just because we never seen it in action doesn't mean it doesn't exist, yes willpower. What "spells" can he do against Sephiroths speed? Sephiroth speed is basically instant, as is his teleportation, what is Kratos strength feats anyway? But we don't know how it would function in a fight. Willpower? What would that do? And Kratos is the guy who literally fought his way out of Hades. Easy, Atlas Quake, Zeus' Lightning, Cronos' Rage, AOE spells like that. What are Kratos' strength feats? How about tossing a 200 foot tall moving metal Collossus when it tried to step on him?

Terryc250
In the side story of Denzel, when the lifestream came to destroy meteor, Denzels mom was exposed to the tainted lifestream of Sephiroth, she died instantly, when Sephiroth fell into the lifestream, his body was completely destroyed, the lifestream is not harmless.. also keep in mind that the negative lifestream is tainted with J-cells and can infect beings with geostigma.

What can Sephiroths willpower do? Well it held Holy still for months, Holy is the antithesis of Meteor, and was stated to beable to destroy everything on the planet, not even that could escape it.

Burning thought
yet he held it with his willpower which cannot be registered yet as a feat of strength or as a good one at all, something being powerful as i said does not mean its hard to hold, all Holy is is energy is it not?

Terryc250
So then what do you describe as being hard to hold? Something "not" powerful? Holy is a big mass of destructive energy, if a nuclear bomb were to explode, it would release destructive energy, and yes, it would be hard to hold.. common sense.

Burning thought
power is nothing to do with it, something hard to hold would be something heavy, fast moving etc etc thats something hard to hold, Holy was just seeminly plucked out of the air by willpower, the things made of energy so it has an unkown weight and it wasnt doing anything apart from moving was it not towards it location? so no it would not necessarily be hard to hold, more likely the opposite considering its energy body

what other fiction have you seen that makes you think that something powerful is hard to hold, a non living thing of unkown weght and resistence?

Also a nuclear bombs explosion is completly diffrent to holy, a nuclear bomb is a constant force blastwave once it goes off, we "know" it would be difficult to hold, but Holy isnt giving off a constant blast wave.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Terryc250
In the side story of Denzel, when the lifestream came to destroy meteor, Denzels mom was exposed to the tainted lifestream of Sephiroth, she died instantly, when Sephiroth fell into the lifestream, his body was completely destroyed, the lifestream is not harmless.. also keep in mind that the negative lifestream is tainted with J-cells and can infect beings with geostigma.

What can Sephiroths willpower do? Well it held Holy still for months, Holy is the antithesis of Meteor, and was stated to beable to destroy everything on the planet, not even that could escape it. 1. I know what it can do man. We still have no idea how it would function in battle, if it can at all.

2. Kay. And Willpower, like Holy, is an abstract thing, so we do not know if it can even function physically.

Terryc250
Originally posted by Burning thought
power is nothing to do with it, something hard to hold would be something heavy, fast moving etc etc thats something hard to hold, Holy was just seeminly plucked out of the air by willpower, the things made of energy so it has an unkown weight and it wasnt doing anything apart from moving was it not towards it location? so no it would not necessarily be hard to hold, more likely the opposite considering its energy body

what other fiction have you seen that makes you think that something powerful is hard to hold, a non living thing of unkown weght and resistence?

Also a nuclear bombs explosion is completly diffrent to holy, a nuclear bomb is a constant force blastwave once it goes off, we "know" it would be difficult to hold, but Holy isnt giving off a constant blast wave.

Holy is able to travel continents is seconds (fast) what makes things "heavy" hard to hold is by FORCE, the weight and gravity makes the FORCE powerful, think about it, Holy is a powerful output of energy force that can travel continents in seconds, and it is able to rip through anything in its path.

A nuclear bomb explosion blast is an output of energy travelling outwards, yes the energy would be hard to hold, Holy is an output of energy travelling towards meteor, but the energy was contained by Sephiroth.

SHM
*sigh*

Sephiroth can protect himself with a barrier above city-busting attacks(the one around the Crater in FFVII, that couldn't be destroyed by the normal Junon Cannon, the same Cannon stated to be a city-buster, in Before Crisis). He can phase through all of Kratos attacks(intangibility). He can regenerate his entire body in seconds(he did that in AC, by using the J-cells in that box).
Barrier + intangibility + insane regeneration(IIRC he is described as "nigh immortal" in the Ultimania, just because of that). How the fuc* could Kratos kill, or even hurt him?!

And I'm only talking about his deffense. It's not like Sephiroth will stay there doing nothing, while Kratos attacks him.


Seriously, some people in this forum underrate Sephiroth all the time, just because they think he is overrated. It's ridiculous.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by SHM
*sigh*

Sephiroth can protect himself with a barrier above city-busting attacks(the one around the Crater in FFVII, that couldn't be destroyed by the normal Junon Cannon, the same Cannon stated to be a city-buster, in Before Crisis). He can phase through all of Kratos attacks(intangibility). He can regenerate his entire body in seconds(he did that in AC, by using the J-cells in that box).
Barrier + intangibility + insane regeneration(IIRC he is described as "nigh immortal" in the Ultimania, just because of that). How the fuc* could Kratos kill, or even hurt him?!

And I'm only talking about his deffense. It's not like Sephiroth will stay there doing nothing, while Kratos attacks him.


Seriously, some people in this forum underrate Sephiroth all the time, just because they think he is overrated. It's ridiculous. 1. Has he ever shown to be able to do a smaller more battle worthy form of that barrier? I think not.

Sephiroth has never used intangibility, the Jenova clones did. And he has NEVER used it in battle.

Regeneration? Bullshit, he was CLEARLY shown to take over Kadaj's body, not regen from nothing. Kadaj transformed into Sephiroth.

With a sword, like Cloud.

Terryc250
What "Jenova clones"? You mean the body parts of Jenova he used? Well see, in AC he has the entire body as himself, in AC he became the newest stage evolution of Jenova.


CC Sephiroth (weakest) doing a smaller barrier (0:35)

zez80HCawG4

SHM
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Has he ever shown to be able to do a smaller more battle worthy form of that barrier? I think not.

Yeah, fine, whatever. He doesn't need it to win anyway.



There isn't any "Jenova Clones" in FFVII. Sephiroth turned intangible by using the powers of a body made of 100% Jenova cells. A body exactly like the one he was using in AC.



See? This type of argument is only used by Sephiroth-haters, who are so desparate to underrate him, that they come with this nonsense bullshit, just because they want him to lose.

Who cares if he never used it in a battle? He CAN turn intangible, and that's the point. What Kratos could do to harm him? Nothing.



That's another reason why some people underrate him: lack of knowledge.
Kadaj didn't transform, because he wasn't even a physical being. He was a spirit.
To return to life, Sephiroth needed a physical body, and then he used the Jenova-cells. That's why Kadaj and the others are after the cells in the first place, to bring him back.
The cells were the host for Sephiroth's consciousness, not Kadaj.

How do I know this? Because of the Reunion Files. Go read it.




But not with Omnislash Version 5, like Cloud, or an attack on the same level.


Now please, stop ignoring his abilities just because you don't like him.

Burning thought
Originally posted by Terryc250
Holy is able to travel continents is seconds (fast) what makes things "heavy" hard to hold is by FORCE, the weight and gravity makes the FORCE powerful, think about it, Holy is a powerful output of energy force that can travel continents in seconds, and it is able to rip through anything in its path.

A nuclear bomb explosion blast is an output of energy travelling outwards, yes the energy would be hard to hold, Holy is an output of energy travelling towards meteor, but the energy was contained by Sephiroth.


Yes its fast BUT heres the rub, how can you prove its heavy? and no, weight and gravity depends on the friction of the object, if the object is just energy you cant prove its weight, it has no density.

It has an output of force and energy, its very diffrent and that depends, hard ot hold for whom? no human has TK and no one has ever even tried to hold a nuclear bomb, theres no TK in the real world so how can you compare something like that hm? Sephiroth ever held a nuclear blast? no ofc not.

Terryc250
Originally posted by Burning thought
Yes its fast BUT heres the rub, how can you prove its heavy? and no, weight and gravity depends on the friction of the object, if the object is just energy you cant prove its weight, it has no density.

It has an output of force and energy, its very diffrent and that depends, hard ot hold for whom? no human has TK and no one has ever even tried to hold a nuclear bomb, theres no TK in the real world so how can you compare something like that hm? Sephiroth ever held a nuclear blast? no ofc not.

See, this is where YOU don't understand all WEIGHT is, is FORCE of the gravitational pull,(in actual physics, half of FORCE is the acceleration speed) now heres the common logic part, a powerful energy force that can travel continents in seconds (speed) destroying everything in its path, in theory; that is similar to a explosion blast. ( going by your logic " if the object is just energy you cant prove its weight, it has no density." then an explosion blast would be easy to contain right? But we all know thats false.)

No, but we can use our imagination, never has any character in fiction ever held a big explosion with ease with TK, you can think of TK as bringing up a wall, the power of the TK depends on how powerful that wall is, normally an explosion would shatter any wall unless that wall is powerful enough.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by SHM
Yeah, fine, whatever. He doesn't need it to win anyway.



There isn't any "Jenova Clones" in FFVII. Sephiroth turned intangible by using the powers of a body made of 100% Jenova cells. A body exactly like the one he was using in AC.



See? This type of argument is only used by Sephiroth-haters, who are so desparate to underrate him, that they come with this nonsense bullshit, just because they want him to lose.

Who cares if he never used it in a battle? He CAN turn intangible, and that's the point. What Kratos could do to harm him? Nothing.



That's another reason why some people underrate him: lack of knowledge.
Kadaj didn't transform, because he wasn't even a physical being. He was a spirit.
To return to life, Sephiroth needed a physical body, and then he used the Jenova-cells. That's why Kadaj and the others are after the cells in the first place, to bring him back.
The cells were the host for Sephiroth's consciousness, not Kadaj.

How do I know this? Because of the Reunion Files. Go read it.




But not with Omnislash Version 5, like Cloud, or an attack on the same level.


Now please, stop ignoring his abilities just because you don't like him. 1. I'll just answer Terry on this subject. He can create a barrier, true, but as he was a SOLDIER at that time, he clearly had materia, and there is materia used to make barriers. Also, there is no proof that barrier was as strong as the one that tanked the canon.

2. Okay. I will rephrase this. A body made from Jenova. O RLY? Then wtf was Kadaj even there for if he can regen from just a friggin head? Also, if he has t3h super regen, why has he NEVER healed from a single wound in battle? What can Kratos do to harm him? Well in a physical fight overpower him and rip in half for one, and let's not forget Kratos' versatility advantage, he can turn Seph to stone in a flash and shatter Seph. Regen from that. Sure, the cells were needed to bring him back, but so was Kadaj, or at least one of the SHM, because if he did not, he should have been able to regen from just the head, but could not. If he did not transform...Then why the hell did we clearly see him do it? We saw Kadaj transform into Sephiroth.

3. Lol, Kratos has no attacks on Omnislash V. 5? The Blade of Olympus pisses on it.

Burning thought
Originally posted by Terryc250
See, this is where YOU don't understand all WEIGHT is, is FORCE of the gravitational pull,(in actual physics, half of FORCE is the acceleration speed) now heres the common logic part, a powerful energy force that can travel continents in seconds (speed) destroying everything in its path, in theory; that is similar to a explosion blast. ( going by your logic " if the object is just energy you cant prove its weight, it has no density." then an explosion blast would be easy to contain right? But we all know thats false.)

No, but we can use our imagination, never has any character in fiction ever held a big explosion with ease with TK, you can think of TK as bringing up a wall, the power of the TK depends on how powerful that wall is, normally an explosion would shatter any wall unless that wall is powerful enough.

No you dont understand, there is zero friction and when the TK hits it, zero force or movement, TK isnt a wall, what are you talking about, this is where YOU go wrong. Its a ball of energy traveling at speeds and suddenly it is stopped moving basically, nothing says here whether its hard to stop, especially since no one else does it, or tries to do it. An explosion blast is unkown to contain, we dont know thats false at all? wtf you talking about, we dont have TK or special fields, we have nothing to even attempt to contain an explosion, we can only use other physical objects of varying density.

Hannibal-Lector
Im not speculating with Kratos' god form but peak Sephiroth feats should allow him to take Kratos

Although Kratos has defeated God's, you gotta put in to perspective how powerful those gods were, yeah strong but nothing obsenely powerful. In additino his slaying of Ares wasnt under his own power, wasnt it Pandora's box?

Dark-Jaxx
His beating of Zeus WAS his own power and skill though.

And the Blade of Olympus pisses on Seph in terms of power.

Hannibal-Lector
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. I'll just answer Terry on this subject. He can create a barrier, true, but as he was a SOLDIER at that time, he clearly had materia, and there is materia used to make barriers. Also, there is no proof that barrier was as strong as the one that tanked the canon.

2. Okay. I will rephrase this. A body made from Jenova. O RLY? Then wtf was Kadaj even there for if he can regen from just a friggin head? Also, if he has t3h super regen, why has he NEVER healed from a single wound in battle? What can Kratos do to harm him? Well in a physical fight overpower him and rip in half for one, and let's not forget Kratos' versatility advantage, he can turn Seph to stone in a flash and shatter Seph. Regen from that. Sure, the cells were needed to bring him back, but so was Kadaj, or at least one of the SHM, because if he did not, he should have been able to regen from just the head, but could not. If he did not transform...Then why the hell did we clearly see him do it? We saw Kadaj transform into Sephiroth.

3. Lol, Kratos has no attacks on Omnislash V. 5? The Blade of Olympus pisses on it.

If you dont address materia as his own power, thats like regarding his sword as a foreign power as well but even so thats ok. He does use materia when he uses Wall in his Seraph/Safer Sephiroth form, which is techniqually the only version of him thats actually his physical person minus CC which you seem to count his powers from materia.

All of the in game feats are actually Jenova taking the appearance of Sephiroth and before you go off on how its not Sephiroth, he has excerted his will over Jenova and she has embraced him as her actual "son" as expressed in the translation of the new One Winged Angel. All of his in game appearance feats are resonable to attribute to himself, even if it was a Jenova replication, those of which would include intangibility (as seen on right before Jenova Birth fight and Ancients temple before Red Dragon), Flight (Through out the game, Crisis Core, Advent Children), Teleportation (Ancients temple), Telekenesis (Advent Children on the buildings, and right before the final fight in the original game on the entire party), mind manipulation/control/invasion/ telepathy (Cloud multiple times in the game), Astral Projection (multiple times in game, mainly Ancients temple to monitor what the party is doing), Immunity to status effects (petrification, slowing, poison, etc.)

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Hannibal-Lector
If you dont address materia as his own power, thats like regarding his sword as a foreign power as well but even so thats ok. He does use materia when he uses Wall in his Seraph/Safer Sephiroth form, which is techniqually the only version of him thats actually his physical person minus CC which you seem to count his powers from materia.

All of the in game feats are actually Jenova taking the appearance of Sephiroth and before you go off on how its not Sephiroth, he has excerted his will over Jenova and she has embraced him as her actual "son" as expressed in the translation of the new One Winged Angel. All of his in game appearance feats are resonable to attribute to himself, even if it was a Jenova replication, those of which would include intangibility (as seen on right before Jenova Birth fight and Ancients temple before Red Dragon), Flight (Through out the game, Crisis Core, Advent Children), Teleportation (Ancients temple), Telekenesis (Advent Children on the buildings, and right before the final fight in the original game on the entire party), mind manipulation/control/invasion/ telepathy (Cloud multiple times in the game), Astral Projection (multiple times in game, mainly Ancients temple to monitor what the party is doing), Immunity to status effects (petrification, slowing, poison, etc.) 1. Well here is the thing, does Sephiroth have said materia in this fight? If this is AC Seph, then no, the only materia he could possibly have is any Kadaj did. Seph in CC was a SOLDIER, who typically use materia.

2. But here is the thing, we have never seen any being who was actually Sephiroth use intangibility(which was also never used in battle btw). Flying, teleportation, TK, and TP he HAS shown to be able to use, as in Seph himself has. Regeneration is just bullshit though, if Seph had any kinda friggin healing factor, he wouldn't have had the shit kicked out of him.

Terryc250
Originally posted by Burning thought
No you dont understand, there is zero friction and when the TK hits it, zero force or movement, TK isnt a wall, what are you talking about, this is where YOU go wrong. Its a ball of energy traveling at speeds and suddenly it is stopped moving basically, nothing says here whether its hard to stop, especially since no one else does it, or tries to do it. An explosion blast is unkown to contain, we dont know thats false at all? wtf you talking about, we dont have TK or special fields, we have nothing to even attempt to contain an explosion, we can only use other physical objects of varying density.
You dont need "friction" you just need a power force pushing against it, TK is breakable depending on how powerful the user is, you're talking like Holy is some harmless thing, no its a powerful energy, that was stated could destroy everything on the planet, so there you have a powerful force that can destroy/disintegrate everything in its path, and we see it travelling continents in seconds, so there we have speed, common logic; poweful force(enough to destroy everything no the planet) + powerful speed (fast enough to travel continents in seconds) = hard to hold.

If we go by your theory, hell, a nuclear explosion should be easily contained with TK, but obviously common logic tells us its not.

Terryc250
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Well here is the thing, does Sephiroth have said materia in this fight? If this is AC Seph, then no, the only materia he could possibly have is any Kadaj did. Seph in CC was a SOLDIER, who typically use materia.

2. But here is the thing, we have never seen any being who was actually Sephiroth use intangibility(which was also never used in battle btw). Flying, teleportation, TK, and TP he HAS shown to be able to use, as in Seph himself has. Regeneration is just bullshit though, if Seph had any kinda friggin healing factor, he wouldn't have had the shit kicked out of him.

You do know the negative lifestream grants him magic right? All materia does is aid the user into tapping magic out of the lifestream, Sephiroth has power over the negative lifestream which grants him magic.

Sephiroth does have access to all these powers and has shown he has the ability to do them, just because he didnt use it in a 10 minute fight with Cloud (in which he purposely didn't use his powers) doesnt mean he's unable to do them.

Burning thought
Originally posted by Terryc250
You dont need "friction" you just need a power force pushing against it, TK is breakable depending on how powerful the user is, you're talking like Holy is some harmless thing, no its a powerful energy, that was stated could destroy everything on the planet, so there you have a powerful force that can destroy/disintegrate everything in its path, and we see it travelling continents in seconds, so there we have speed, common logic; poweful force(enough to destroy everything no the planet) + powerful speed (fast enough to travel continents in seconds) = hard to hold.

If we go by your theory, hell, a nuclear explosion should be easily contained with TK, but obviously common logic tells us its not.

No nothing points to how powerful the user is, if something needs ot move, yet your just stopping it with your mind, then nothings actually pushing against it, its just being stopped, and yes it is a harmless thing when its not hitting anything. Yeh and its travelling towards nothingness yet stops because of it, it cannot have any power against simply nothing can it? no ofcourse not. So no, thats not common logic, powerful speed of a piece of popcorn would not make it harder to top if you could use TK to pluck it out of the air, and the powerful force is not excisting until it hits, otherwise its just energy since it doesnt explode when Sephiroth grabs it. So powerful energy but harmless due to it not hitting anything+an unkown weight factor due ot it being energy anyway=common logic telling us it wasnt hard to hold at all.

No, no logic tells us that, and technically thats wrong, according to my theory a nuclear explosion is not able to be measured against TK because humans dont have it, so you cant say common logic tells us its not since we dont have TK, so you dont know what your talking about here, furthermore ive already explained this, the nuclear missle itself flying towards the target is more like holy when Sephiroth takes it, and that can be stopped since like Holy its power is not expressed yet, the explosion of a nuke itself is nothing like holy when Sephiroth takes it, since Sephiroth would never be able to stop the nuclear explosion, yet we can see him stopping holy.

Originally posted by Terryc250
You do know the negative lifestream grants him magic right? All materia does is aid the user into tapping magic out of the lifestream, Sephiroth has power over the negative lifestream which grants him magic.

Sephiroth does have access to all these powers and has shown he has the ability to do them, just because he didnt use it in a 10 minute fight with Cloud (in which he purposely didn't use his powers) doesnt mean he's unable to do them.

Can you prove this? can you prove that having simply raw lifestream is the same as having Materia, you said to me once that Materia is specially made.

Hannibal-Lector
Originally posted by Burning thought
Can you prove this? can you prove that having simply raw lifestream is the same as having Materia, you said to me once that Materia is specially made.

Well he doesnt have ne materia in his Seraph/Safer Sephiroth form, and he casts magic... although he has had like 5 years exposure to the pure life stream

Hannibal-Lector
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Well here is the thing, does Sephiroth have said materia in this fight? If this is AC Seph, then no, the only materia he could possibly have is any Kadaj did. Seph in CC was a SOLDIER, who typically use materia.

2. But here is the thing, we have never seen any being who was actually Sephiroth use intangibility(which was also never used in battle btw). Flying, teleportation, TK, and TP he HAS shown to be able to use, as in Seph himself has. Regeneration is just bullshit though, if Seph had any kinda friggin healing factor, he wouldn't have had the shit kicked out of him.

If ur going by AC Sephiroth, then it is Jenova in taking the form of Sephiroth because Sephiroth wills jenova to do so. Going by that sinces its techniqually Jenova, all of the Jenova Sephiroth feats apply. If your going by Crisis core, he gets materia. If your going by original game form (minus Seraph/Safer an Bizzaro) then all feats of Jenova apply. Sephiroth himself at the end of the game (his actual physical person, not Jenova in the form of Sephiroth) shows shapeshifting, TK, Flying, magic, Teleportation (or possibly invisibility then turning visible).

Terryc250
Originally posted by Burning thought
No nothing points to how powerful the user is, if something needs ot move, yet your just stopping it with your mind, then nothings actually pushing against it, its just being stopped, and yes it is a harmless thing when its not hitting anything. Yeh and its travelling towards nothingness yet stops because of it, it cannot have any power against simply nothing can it? no ofcourse not. So no, thats not common logic, powerful speed of a piece of popcorn would not make it harder to top if you could use TK to pluck it out of the air, and the powerful force is not excisting until it hits, otherwise its just energy since it doesnt explode when Sephiroth grabs it. So powerful energy but harmless due to it not hitting anything+an unkown weight factor due ot it being energy anyway=common logic telling us it wasnt hard to hold at all.
Actually yeah, if a person has weak TK, it cannot hold something as powerful as an explosion, telekinesis CAN be broken if whatever is pushing against it is powerful enough, just like how wind can push through a wall if the wind is powerful enough, it does not need to have "density" it just needs "force". TK has been broken through by sheer force MANY times in fiction, and has shown people with different levels of power with TK from Kain who is able to only lift up human sized objects, to Jean Grey, to Mewtwo who is able to lift up many giant things.
Btw that is not "comon logic" that is you trying to make things complicated to attempt at downplaying Sephiroths feat, re-read what you're typing and you'll see thats what you are actually doing.

Travelled towards nothingness? It was summoned to stop meteor, however it was STOPPED by Sephiroth as it was stated in the game, and even in the novel, that is why at the end when finally Sephiroth was defeated it freed Holy and Holy shot out to stop meteor but was too late, and thats why it needed the lifestream.


Again, TK can infact be broken through, it has happened MANY times in fiction, all you need is a force powerful enough.

A detonated nuclear bomb explosion that would destroy an entire city would be HARD to contain with TK just as a powerful wind would break through a wall, don't give me the "well its never happened in real life so you cant know" TK has been broken through MANY MANY times in fiction, all you need is a force powerful enough



Ive said it many times before all materia does is, aid the user into tapping into the power of the lifestream, if you have power over the lifestream you don't need materia.

Thats why we see the SHM were able to summon shadow creeps without any materia, they had a little bit of control over the negative lifestream, Sephiroth has full control as he is the creator of it.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Terryc250
You do know the negative lifestream grants him magic right? All materia does is aid the user into tapping magic out of the lifestream, Sephiroth has power over the negative lifestream which grants him magic.

Sephiroth does have access to all these powers and has shown he has the ability to do them, just because he didnt use it in a 10 minute fight with Cloud (in which he purposely didn't use his powers) doesnt mean he's unable to do them. 1. The Negative Lifestream is corrupted Lifestream(obviously), and is different than the real thing. We don't know if it grants the same powers. Although Sephiroth doesn't really need materia compared to his powers he has shown with his blade in all honesty.

2. No, Jenova has shown the power to use them.

Terryc250
Kadaj, Loz, Yazoo (they have some control over the NL) used the lifestream as magic in FF7 AC movie, so there is proof right there.

Silver Haired Men were created by Sephiroth out of his Negative Lifestream, he can make things out of it, just like his sword.


Sephiroth is Jenova, all powers of Jenova and everything it is, is Sephiroth

Here is a direct quote from the UOG

"Sephiroth, the New Evolution of Jenova:

Sephiroth became the newest stage of evolution for Jenova, and anything "Jenova" does in the game's present day is simply Sephiroth invoking his new powers ("the will of Jenova as a human is the result of it channeling Sephiroth's spirit"wink. When Sephiroth came into the picture, the minds of the two joined, and Sephiroth made himself the core of the viral entity that Jenova was, with his ambitions being fueled by its parasitic instincts and his desire to destroy all the humans he despised. Thus, his will manifested through Jenova's extensive psionic powers. "

SHM
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
2. Okay. I will rephrase this. A body made from Jenova. O RLY? Then wtf was Kadaj even there for if he can regen from just a friggin head? Also, if he has t3h super regen, why has he NEVER healed from a single wound in battle? What can Kratos do to harm him? Well in a physical fight overpower him and rip in half for one, and let's not forget Kratos' versatility advantage, he can turn Seph to stone in a flash and shatter Seph. Regen from that. Sure, the cells were needed to bring him back, but so was Kadaj, or at least one of the SHM, because if he did not, he should have been able to regen from just the head, but could not. If he did not transform...Then why the hell did we clearly see him do it? We saw Kadaj transform into Sephiroth.

3. Lol, Kratos has no attacks on Omnislash V. 5? The Blade of Olympus pisses on it.

To regenerate his body, Sephiroth needed to have one.
This is why he created the SHM(who are part of him). To seek Jenova cells, to seek a new physical body for him.
After Kadaj drunk the cells and Sephiroth returned to life, he didn't need the SHM anymore, because they had fulfilled their purpose. After that, the only thing he really needed were the J-cells of his new body, and his Negative Lifestream.

Why he never healed from a single wound in battle? He did more than that dude. Sephiroth regenerated his entire body from a few cells in a box. After that, he didn't need to regenerate anymore, because Cloud wasn't able to harm him during the fight(with exception of Omnislash).
If Sephiroth wanted, he could let Kratos rip him apart just for fun, and then regenerates a second later.

He can turn Seph to stone? I didn't knew status-effect worked on Seph? I could swear they didn't.

And the fact Omnislash Version 5 destroyed a guy who could regenerate his whole body in a few seconds, is proof of how powerful the attack really is.
I want to see Kratos do something like that.

Kazenji
Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Ares was his only real PIS battle.

In that case you might as well call every single boss battle in every game PIS roll eyes (sarcastic) roll eyes (sarcastic)

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by Kazenji
In that case you might as well call every single boss battle in every game PIS roll eyes (sarcastic) roll eyes (sarcastic)

Why, because every character in the history of video games managed to obtain a plot-based weapon described as being the only thing capable of giving a non-God the power to kill a God? Or because this was the only final fight where Kratos was literally given extra power to level the playing field instead of actually fighting without such a power against other bosses obviously more powerful than Ares (Kratos fought Zeus on his own with and without the Blade of Olympus, and defeated the first two Sisters of Fate simultaneously)?

Cosmic Cube
Originally posted by Terryc250
Kadaj, Loz, Yazoo (they have some control over the NL) used the lifestream as magic in FF7 AC movie, so there is proof right there.

Silver Haired Men were created by Sephiroth out of his Negative Lifestream, he can make things out of it, just like his sword.


Sephiroth is Jenova, all powers of Jenova and everything it is, is Sephiroth

Here is a direct quote from the UOG

"Sephiroth, the New Evolution of Jenova:

Sephiroth became the newest stage of evolution for Jenova, and anything "Jenova" does in the game's present day is simply Sephiroth invoking his new powers ("the will of Jenova as a human is the result of it channeling Sephiroth's spirit"wink. When Sephiroth came into the picture, the minds of the two joined, and Sephiroth made himself the core of the viral entity that Jenova was, with his ambitions being fueled by its parasitic instincts and his desire to destroy all the humans he despised. Thus, his will manifested through Jenova's extensive psionic powers. " Is that Sephiroth in your sig?

He looks more and more like a woman in each successive game. I wonder why they make him look so feminine.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by SHM
To regenerate his body, Sephiroth needed to have one.
This is why he created the SHM(who are part of him). To seek Jenova cells, to seek a new physical body for him.
After Kadaj drunk the cells and Sephiroth returned to life, he didn't need the SHM anymore, because they had fulfilled their purpose. After that, the only thing he really needed were the J-cells of his new body, and his Negative Lifestream.

Why he never healed from a single wound in battle? He did more than that dude. Sephiroth regenerated his entire body from a few cells in a box. After that, he didn't need to regenerate anymore, because Cloud wasn't able to harm him during the fight(with exception of Omnislash).
If Sephiroth wanted, he could let Kratos rip him apart just for fun, and then regenerates a second later.

He can turn Seph to stone? I didn't knew status-effect worked on Seph? I could swear they didn't.

And the fact Omnislash Version 5 destroyed a guy who could regenerate his whole body in a few seconds, is proof of how powerful the attack really is.
I want to see Kratos do something like that. 1. Right, so he needed Kadaj to drink the cells and Kadaj became Sephiroth. Like what happened in the movie. smile

2. Nope, Kadaj drank some cells in a box which made Kadaj Sephiroth. Hell, on-board the airship, they were even saying that Kadaj was the chrysalis who would BECOME Sephiroth. Sephiroth has never healed from any wound. smile

3. Gameplay first of all, but I will concede this, he can also just use his many lightning attacks, Seph is not faster than lightning.

4. O RLY? Kadaj transformed into Sephiroth, he didn't regen from some cells in a box, canon supports this. smile

The Blade of Olympus, which has only gotten stronger since Kratos obtained it, in one blow defeated the Titans(whose bodies are supposed to be indestructible) and ended the Great Titan War. Kratos defeated Zeus while he was wielding the Blade of Olympus and stole it.

Oh, and before you freak out and say I'm just a Sephiroth hater who wants him to lose, I actually like Sephiroth. I just don't ride his boloni-pony. smile

Kazenji
Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Or because this was the only final fight where Kratos was literally given extra power to level the playing field instead of actually fighting without such a power against other bosses obviously more powerful than Ares (Kratos fought Zeus on his own with and without the Blade of Olympus, and defeated the first two Sisters of Fate simultaneously)?

Exactly that !!

Seriously kratos was taught to fight brutal since an early age and top it off in GOW1 he finds out he needs pandora's box to beat a god and what has Ares fought......probably just the titans most likey

so all up yes it was possibly for him to beat Ares and it was'nt PIS and if you still call it PIS then him ploughing through all of Ares's army(Minotaurs, undead soldiers, cyclops's) back in athens must also be PIS and not to mention back then he was still a mortal roll eyes (sarcastic) .

First_Tsurugi06
Originally posted by Kazenji
Exactly that !!

Seriously kratos was taught to fight brutal since an early age and top it off in GOW1 he finds out he needs pandora's box to beat a god and what has Ares fought......probably just the titans most likey

so all up yes it was possibly for him to beat Ares and it was'nt PIS and if you still call it PIS then him ploughing through all of Ares's army(Minotaurs, undead soldiers, cyclops's) back in athens must also be PIS and not to mention back then he was still a mortal roll eyes (sarcastic) .

The fact is that he didn't have Pandora's Box when he fought Ares' armies, or the legions of Hades, he wasn't boosting himself with any particular extra power, and they weren't invulnerable to anything besides another Godly power--the only thing that's killed a God of War God is just that. Kratos was given so many advantages in his fight with Ares that he wasn't given aginast the likes of Zeus, that it shows he was either that much more powerful as of God of War II, or was held back by the Gods in God of War I. If his fight with Ares wasn't PIS, nothing was.

k1Lla441
PIS? wut that stand for? anyways, kratos takes this, and even tho he need pandoras box to beat ares, that still puts him at a disadvantage, because ares still has stronger powers thatn kratos does. all pandoras box did was give kratos a small chance to win, as of before he had no chance. and even with a small chance, kratos still won, and still pwned. kratos takes this fight easy.

Dark-Jaxx
PIS means Plot Induced Stupidity.

Wil7
Good fight, but Sephiroth would use Sin Harvest Angel, the end.

Diamond Kisses
Wait.... You think THIS is a good fight, but you think he slaughters Pyron? no expression

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Diamond Kisses
Wait.... You think THIS is a good fight, but you think he slaughters Pyron? no expression I know, the hilarity of his noobishness hurts. haermm

This is no good fight, Kratos takes this fight quite easily.

Wil7
Yeah. He can destroy worldsI will admit that but he is no match for Sephiroth, but maybe Kratos.

Diamond Kisses
no expression He destroys galaxies, you bloody christmas tree ermm He could throw the moon on Earth from far away. That way staying out of Sephiroth's range and still killing them all.

Wil7
Sephiroth can destroy planets as well.

Diamond Kisses
Yeah yeah yeah, I have heard it before. While he uses abilities, Pyron destroy planets by stumbling over them or playing bowling in the galaxy. I do not care how many planets Sephiroth would destroy in the future, he is not in the same league as Pyron.

Dark-Jaxx
Pyron EATS planets. no expression

In his most recent appearance, he had devoured countless galaxies. erm

So Pyron is galaxies strong. no expression

Seph will NEVER be able to fight that.

Wil7
In your dreams Pyron could beat Sephiroth. This is the real world.

C. C. Cowgirl!
Actually, it is the fictional world. And in this fictional world, Sephiroth has nothing against Pyron.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Wil7
In your dreams Pyron could beat Sephiroth. This is the real world. If you think that prove he can in the thread I made.

k1Lla441
srry kratos, but pyron pwns too badly.... i mean he EATS GALAXIES. thats just too much to mess with. anyways kratos takes this in a stomp.

SHM
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. Right, so he needed Kadaj to drink the cells and Kadaj became Sephiroth. Like what happened in the movie. smile

2. Nope, Kadaj drank some cells in a box which made Kadaj Sephiroth. Hell, on-board the airship, they were even saying that Kadaj was the chrysalis who would BECOME Sephiroth. Sephiroth has never healed from any wound. smile

3. Gameplay first of all, but I will concede this, he can also just use his many lightning attacks, Seph is not faster than lightning.

4. O RLY? Kadaj transformed into Sephiroth, he didn't regen from some cells in a box, canon supports this. smile

The Blade of Olympus, which has only gotten stronger since Kratos obtained it, in one blow defeated the Titans(whose bodies are supposed to be indestructible) and ended the Great Titan War. Kratos defeated Zeus while he was wielding the Blade of Olympus and stole it.

Oh, and before you freak out and say I'm just a Sephiroth hater who wants him to lose, I actually like Sephiroth. I just don't ride his boloni-pony. smile

LOL

You are basically ignoring everything I say, and repeating the same thing over and over again.

And what is really funny, is that you are helping my argument.
If Sephiroth possesed Kadaj's body(a body 100% made of Negative Lifestream) as you said, that means his regeneration would be even better than if he was using the cells.
Because his entire body would be made of spirit energy, and under his complete control(he have total control over the NL). He could regenerate in seconds, exactly like Omega Weapon(another being formed 100% of Lifestream) could do, and did, in DoC.

A body composed of J-cells, or a body composed of Negative Lifestream. One way or another, he can regenerate in seconds.

You lost.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by SHM
LOL

You are basically ignoring everything I say, and repeating the same thing over and over again.

And what is really funny, is that you are helping my argument.
If Sephiroth possesed Kadaj's body(a body 100% made of Negative Lifestream) as you said, that means his regeneration would be even better than if he was using the cells.
Because his entire body would be made of spirit energy, and under his complete control(he have total control over the NL). He could regenerate in seconds, exactly like Omega Weapon(another being formed 100% of Lifestream) could do, and did, in DoC.

A body composed of J-cells, or a body composed of Negative Lifestream. One way or another, he can regenerate in seconds.

You lost. You're an idiot.

Kadaj TRANSFORMED into Sephiroth.

Sephiroth needed Kadaj to come back, he can't do it at a whim, if he killed, he wouldn't have been permabanned by the Omnislash V. 5.

Kratos holds most possibly advantages over Sephiroth, let's just say you are right and Sephiroth can regen from anything.

Kratos can still just kill Lucretia in the past ftw.

Beat that.

k1Lla441
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
You're an idiot.

Kadaj TRANSFORMED into Sephiroth.

Sephiroth needed Kadaj to come back, he can't do it at a whim, if he killed, he wouldn't have been permabanned by the Omnislash V. 5.

Kratos holds most possibly advantages over Sephiroth, let's just say you are right and Sephiroth can regen from anything.

Kratos can still just kill Lucretia in the past ftw.

Beat that.
Indeed. Kratos murders sephiroth, and just for the fun of it kills him by decapitating him and keeps his head.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
You're an idiot.

Kadaj TRANSFORMED into Sephiroth.

Sephiroth needed Kadaj to come back, he can't do it at a whim, if he killed, he wouldn't have been permabanned by the Omnislash V. 5.

Kratos holds most possibly advantages over Sephiroth, let's just say you are right and Sephiroth can regen from anything.

Kratos can still just kill Lucretia in the past ftw.

Beat that. ...Was I like, drunk or tired when I wrote that? no expression

Cause my grammar and spelling sucked in that post...

CosmicComet
Bump because you know we all miss Terry.

Come back to us Terry.

GrieverSquall
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Bump because you know we all miss Terry.

Come back to us Terry.

K1ll3r you mean. laughing

BloodRawEngine
Thought their posts seemed similar.

CosmicComet
*shrug* Never noticed too much similarity. Similar arguments sure but that's just the nature of the beast.

BloodRawEngine
lawl.

Anyway for the fight as it is now since the last bump, here's my opinion in the simplest sense;

Cut out every bit of footage until 4:09, and then replace Zeus with Sephiroth. You should have the most basic jist.
uW1E5i1mgB8

CosmicComet
Oh goody. I somehow missed the fact that Kratos tanked Zeus' massive electric explosion death event too.

iChaos
What's so impressive about that explosion?

BloodRawEngine
Compared to disappearing into a bunch of black feathers? A lot.

iChaos
Yeahhhh...

K1ll3r
Originally posted by NemeBro
You're an idiot.

Kadaj TRANSFORMED into Sephiroth.

Sephiroth needed Kadaj to come back, he can't do it at a whim, if he killed, he wouldn't have been permabanned by the Omnislash V. 5.

Kratos holds most possibly advantages over Sephiroth, let's just say you are right and Sephiroth can regen from anything.

Kratos can still just kill Lucretia in the past ftw.

Beat that.

Sephiroth didn't need Kadaj to come back, only what he would look like if he lived. Although I doubt he needs that much as he could easily create a random body and take over it like he did with Jenova.

Also [email protected] Lucretia. How would Kratos know about her\what she looked like or even if Sephiroth was born. rolling on floor laughing

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
lawl.

Anyway for the fight as it is now since the last bump, here's my opinion in the simplest sense;

Cut out every bit of footage until 4:09, and then replace Zeus with Sephiroth. You should have the most basic jist.


Sephiroth can move faster than Kratos' attacks themselves (shown in this clip), and has dodged things as fast as them while not even looking in the direction they came from, while smirking!

Also, Supernova.

CosmicComet
Kratos has reacted to things faster than Sephiroth.

Also Supernova is completely featless and thus useless. I assume we aren't using Safer Sephiroth anyway.

NemeBro
Originally posted by K1ll3r
Sephiroth didn't need Kadaj to come back, only what he would look like if he lived. Although I doubt he needs that much as he could easily create a random body and take over it like he did with Jenova.

Also [email protected] Lucretia. How would Kratos know about her\what she looked like or even if Sephiroth was born. rolling on floor laughing Oh then I guess coming back again will be only so easy huh? And I guess he could have just came back any time huh? To come back he needed a pre-existing body, the SHM due to their relationship with Jenova, and he needed Jenova's super awesome cells to be exposed to one of them?

Why are you responding to such an out of date post by the way? I mean you ever consider that I either no longer think these or that God of War 3 changed things?

Gtfo.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by K1ll3r
Sephiroth didn't need Kadaj to come back, only what he would look like if he lived. Although I doubt he needs that much as he could easily create a random body and take over it like he did with Jenova.

Also [email protected] Lucretia. How would Kratos know about her\what she looked like or even if Sephiroth was born. rolling on floor laughing



Sephiroth can move faster than Kratos' attacks themselves (shown in this clip), and has dodged things as fast as them while not even looking in the direction they came from, while smirking!

Also, Supernova.

Lulz. Firstly, if Kratos had access to the Loom of Fate, and Sephiroth had his own string, his life is literally in Kratos' hands.

Kratos' basic attacks take roughly 30 microseconds (no, not gameplay time, 'canon' time - but this concept might be completely beyond someone of your level). They're roughly as fast as a single lightning stroke takes to appear and disappear, which is on average, 30 microseconds.

Supernova's nothing more than an over-hyped standard explosion. It won't work on Kratos.

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by K1ll3r
Sephiroth didn't need Kadaj to come back, only what he would look like if he lived. Although I doubt he needs that much as he could easily create a random body and take over it like he did with Jenova.

Also [email protected] Lucretia. How would Kratos know about her\what she looked like or even if Sephiroth was born. rolling on floor laughing

If Sephiroth could've come back from any source, it wouldn't have taken Kadaj to absorb the remains of Jenova in the first place. Kadaj was never anything more than just a premature form of Sephiroth who's entire PURPOSE was to complete himself into Sephiroth's new body. Last I checked, that's the whole freakin' concept of the Reunion process; Sephiroth simply became the center of it because the process had ultimately made him the newest stage in Jenova's evolution.

The same way the Sisters of Fate did, controlling the thread of his life, or just cutting it, thus ending his life like that. The only counter argument against that is that it may seem like a no-limits fallacy, but so is saying that Sephiroth can come back from any source with just a trace of Jenova's DNA.

Originally posted by K1ll3r
Sephiroth can move faster than Kratos' attacks themselves (shown in this clip), and has dodged things as fast as them while not even looking in the direction they came from, while smirking!

Also, Supernova.

So could 80% of the Gods Kratos fought and killed through means that sent them from smirking to being lucky to still have their faces. Poseidon in the first ten minutes of GoWIII alone has already out-sped Sephiroth and a fair majority of FFVII's fighters, and he isn't even the strongest nor fastest of the Gods. Secondly, what clip are you speaking of, unless you're referring to the attacks in the one I posted? Because it's moot given that Kratos is virtually invulnerable in that scene. Like I said, that was merely the most basic jist of what could happen. That video isn't the only showing of that amp technically speaking.

Has no concrete use. Hell, Kratos brought the sun back into the sky at one point.

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by iChaos
Yeahhhh...

I don't assume you see where I'm getting at?

menokokoro
seph wins this, he is much faster, can fly, and can cut through anything...from a distance (ok, not ANYTHING, clouds sword for one, but you know what i mean), nothing kratos could do would hit sephiroth, then fwap...there rolls his head....then he escapes from hades, then dies again, and escapes from hades...ya know im getting sick of him escaping from the underworld.

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by menokokoro seph wins this,

He never had the win even prior to GoWIII



So were half the Gods Kratos fought, and even then Seph's still not faster than them. Zeus and Poseidon could do virtually everything Sephiroth had ever shown in terms of mobility, and thensome.



If flying were an advantage against Kratos, it'd only ever be so as a means of escape from him.



If Sephiroth can't cut through Cloud's sword, he gonna cut through anything Kratos wields, and possibly not even Kratos himself. And anything from a distance is just gonna be sent right back at him two fold.



And not kill the latter afterward.



Square into Sephiroth's face. Refer to a Kratos vs Hercules video to see the likely end result.

TheAuraAngel
Just throwing it out there because I don't think it's been brought up but, Pale Horse anyone?

menokokoro
Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
So were half the Gods Kratos fought, and even then Seph's still not faster than them. Zeus and Poseidon could do virtually everything Sephiroth had ever shown in terms of mobility, and thensome.



If flying were an advantage against Kratos, it'd only ever be so as a means of escape from him.



If Sephiroth can't cut through Cloud's sword, he gonna cut through anything Kratos wields, and possibly not even Kratos himself. And anything from a distance is just gonna be sent right back at him two fold.



And not kill the latter afterward.



Square into Sephiroth's face. Refer to a Kratos vs Hercules video to see the likely end result. 1. Zeus can not do what sephiroth can, at least he has never shown to be able to. and even if they were faster than seph, them being beaten does not prove that his speed wouldn't help in his fight, that only proves that it didn't help them

2. yeah...getting out of range from an attack, that is an advantage...even if you make fun of it.

3. no, probably wont cut through his swords, but that wasn't the point i was making. and of course he could cut kratos' skin, he is not superman. how would he send it back? this is the ghost of sparta, pre gow 2 and 3, he doesn't have the golden fleas...at least thats what i got out of it.

4. im sorry...what? that makes no sense.

5. herc would die easily against seph, so that argument is moot.


ok, so im going to get a little further into seph's abilities. he has what i already stated. He is a perfect fighter, he learns extremely fast. cloud used omnislash on him once, the move that killed him, then when he was reborn, he countered it perfectly.

his speed is simply increadible, not just travel speed, but combat speed, he was able to keep cloud at bay while toying around with him, not even breathing heavily, while cloud was using 2 swords at once swinging as hard and as fast as he could. he has demonstrated cutting several pieces of estremely thick steel almost instantaneously on sister ray, and multiple times in ac he has cut multiple cuts in rapid succession.

OH! I don't remember where i read this, but you know those beams that came off his sword that cut sister ray? those are not his energy or anything like that, its his sword swing causing the air to move so quickly it heats up and becomes sharp...or something like that.

using only his mind, he killed a giant snake and stuck him on a spike, almost killed tsaang, along with a bunch of other soldiers (they were killed, not almost), manipulated cloud to bring him the black materia, and almost kill airith, brought cloud into an illusion to continue brain washing him, and actually killed airith with an astro projection. all of this was done with his mind while sleeping in the northern crater.

he has also shown tk, once where he held all of the group, and they felt like they were going to be torn apart, and once where he pulled the top of a sky scraper down.

so, it is obvious (to me anyway) that he is much faster, and much more skilled than kratos, and is at least close to kratos's strength. so, after throwing out the strength argument (because there is no way to prove that, it is just a theory), how could kratos fight against someone who is a better fighter than him, and is faster than him, let alone his psychic abilities.

CosmicComet
^Not going to respond to all that as you know little about Kratos.

Kratos wins via having every single advantage other than pure linear speed and rangey spells. Sephiroth has no means of hurting Kratos.

menokokoro
....really? please, enlighten me. I have played 1 and 2, and watched 3 played. what am i missing about kratos? I don't see these advantages you are talking about. the ONLY advantage I can think of is that he fights dirty.

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by menokokoro
1. Zeus can not do what sephiroth can, at least he has never shown to be able to. and even if they were faster than seph, them being beaten does not prove that his speed wouldn't help in his fight, that only proves that it didn't help them

2. yeah...getting out of range from an attack, that is an advantage...even if you make fun of it.

3. no, probably wont cut through his swords, but that wasn't the point i was making. and of course he could cut kratos' skin, he is not superman. how would he send it back? this is the ghost of sparta, pre gow 2 and 3, he doesn't have the golden fleas...at least thats what i got out of it.

4. im sorry...what? that makes no sense.

5. herc would die easily against seph, so that argument is moot.

1. He's already done better within 30 minutes of GoWIII. Ares already did better all the way back in GoWI.

2. My point is that it's not an advatage over Kratos when he had already defeated people with that ability, and at times in spite of it. Kratos' agility is more that capable of doing the normal stuff an FFVII character does.

3. If Zeus with the BoO (a character who >>> Seph with a weapon that >>> FFVII verse, and isn't even the strongest force in the GoW series) couldn't cut clean through a fighting Kratos, no one in FFVII will; Seph's the only one that could so much as come close. And also, people only go by specifications like that for as long as it takes for the OP's to lose interest in the particular settings. Even pre-GoWI Kratos still just so happened to have abilities virtually identical to the Golden Fleece. And FYI, the original specifications of this thread were that Kratos was in his GoWII incarnation. Comparing them in their composite primes is utter spite in Kratos' favor even if we barred his God form. An amped up thunderbolt from Zeus couldn't kill Kratos-or even faze him for very long-when it hit him dead-on, whereas Gaia's hand was nearly blown off, and that was Zeus in his human size.

4. roll eyes (sarcastic)

5. If the feats of his twelve labors in Greek Myth hold at least some of the relevence as they do in GoWIII (which is possibly based on dialogue), then chances are no.



Learn your story telling first of all. The entire thing with Omnislash at the end of FFVII was just a mental battle of wills showing how Cloud can no longer be manipulated by Sephiroth. A perfect fighter by the standards of FFVII and a perfect fighter by GoW's standards are two totally different things, and most cases for what classifies as just a perfect fighter are Gods and those trained by them. If you're actually convinced by such typical JRPG traits as flashy-looking movements and spiffy effects (which makes up the majority of FFVII's characters' abilities), then that's something people like to call ignorance.



First and foremost, his speed isn't anything anyone in GoW hasn't dealt with or displayed to high enough caliber to be considered equal or greater to. It's not so incredible that it puts him in a league of his own amongst anyone beyond the FFVII cast. Keeping a pissant like Cloud busy with little effort speaks just as much for how weak Cloud is beyond the typical skills expected of these characters. Any big-time Olympian in GoW is a bigger threat to FFVII than all the WEAPONs together. If you ever paid upwards of two minutes to God of War, Kratos has little to no problem attacking at high speeds with his weapons, and anything he can't cut, he's usually torn with his bare hands. Then there's the fact that the entire scene involving the Sister Ray cutting was a hologram to begin with. The last time Kratos was seen breathing heavily is when he stabbed himself through the chest with a sword that makes the Buster Sword and/or First Tsurugi look a cheap kitchen knife set.





Uh, big friggin whoop? Kratos causes explosive shockwaves and flaming fissures just by driving his weapons into the ground.



First, there was no word on him ever using his mind to kill that Midgar Zolom serpent, and even then, Kratos had done the exact same thing to the Hydra, whom makes the Midgar Zolom look like a garden snake. These "astro" (Megaman's dog? The word your looking for is ASTRAL, for future reference) projections were also nothing more than people with Jenova's cells being manipulated by him from the northern crater. The only reason he ever managed to manipulte anyone is if they had Jenova's DNA in their bodies like himself; in other words, none of that jazz would help against Kratos. Olympians in God of War held order to the entire universe just by living. Guess what happened when they were killed off one-by-one...

he has also shown tk, once where he held all of the group, and they felt like they were going to be torn apart, and once where he pulled the top of a sky scraper down.



It's only 'obvious' to you because your knowledge is so clearly one-sided, and still misinformed within that side. Kratos fought and killed the very divine emboidiment of armed combat that he himself was trained by in battle, taking his place, and eventually laying waste to the rest of the Gods out of spite and vengeance towards them. This very God hhad psychic abilities that reduced an army of thousands into a field of mutilated corpses, and could create pocket dimensions on a whim, and this isn't even the strongest God I'm talking about. Don't even try to argue that anyone short of Sephiroth begins to compare to GoW's top-tiers, as Sephiroth only does by virtue of being the most powerful character in the FFVII universe. None of his abilites are anywhere beyond what Kratos is unaccustomed to dealing with, and until Sephiroth handles himself phyically anywhere close to the level of what Kratos did agaisnt Cronos, then I'm not about to say his strength's at least "close" to Kratos.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by CosmicComet
^Not going to respond to all that as you know little about Kratos.

Kratos wins via having every single advantage other than pure linear speed and rangey spells. Sephiroth has no means of hurting Kratos.

Just how good is Sephiroth in long range? I know he has TK...

Light of Dawn, Zeus' Fury, Typhon's Bane, Firebow & Army of Hades.
I think he's got long range pretty well covered. Given his godly accuracy, I doubt he'd miss hitting Sephiroth with the first four abilities. Army of Hades is auto-tracking, so it should have no problems as far as accuracy is concerned.

EDIT: Never mind, Kratos only has Typhon's Bane for LR. Should still be able to hit Sephiroth though, TB has an auto-tracking projectile, not to mention, Kratos' accuracy.

Originally posted by menokokoro
....really? please, enlighten me. I have played 1 and 2, and watched 3 played. what am i missing about kratos? I don't see these advantages you are talking about. the ONLY advantage I can think of is that he fights dirty.

Fights dirty? You do realize that in a fight for your life, there are no holds barred.

Also, Sephiroth is nowhere near as strong or durable as Kratos. no expression

Movement speed, yes, Sephiroth is probably faster, but Kratos is likely at least faster than Mach 1 with the Boots of Hermes. In combat, movement speed does not matter as much as combat speed, of which, Kratos is extremely fast.

CosmicComet
^For ranged abilities, I was just speaking cautiously. But yeah Kratos does have high speed magical bow with never ending arrows now in the form of the Bow of Apollo.

Still Sephiroth can control the weather it seems, at least its hinted at in Advent Children.

Demonic Phoenix
According to BloodRawEngine, this is supposed to be GoWII Kratos as per the OP. Or is it composite Kratos now?




(@ BloodRawEngine: Dude, what handle would you prefer? BRE? FT? Would be kind of simpler than typing out your whole username stick out tongue)

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
According to BloodRawEngine, this is supposed to be GoWII Kratos as per the OP. Or is it composite Kratos now?




(@ BloodRawEngine: Dude, what handle would you prefer? BRE? FT? Would be kind of simpler than typing out your whole username stick out tongue)

Well, that's what I think the OP said. But of course, that was almost four years ago; I don't think it really matters anymore. That, and I generally always compare characters to eachother in a composite sense, as per to avoid any particular bias.

(And BloodRaw will do just fine. If that's not short enough, then I'd prefer BRE between those two abbreviations--I no longer want to have even a remotely notable association with Cloud Strife, as his weapon in AC has long since shown to be the only thing about him that I find to be all that cool.)

EDIT: According to the OP, it's "Ghost of Sparta" Kratos referring to his status, not the game's timeframe (I was thinking of another thread way back that involved GoWII Kratos). Although being that this thread also uses Sephiroth with his "FFVII stats", I personally ain't bothering atm, being that throughout FFVII, Seph was in a stasis of sorts, except for flashbacks and Crisis Core (the latter of which makes this spite in the favor of Kratos within any timeframe in which he was a servant to the Gods).

TheAuraAngel
I just noticed.

Originally posted by Major Snafu
I'm just using the Advent Children Sephy for apprarance only. His stats come from the time he is one of the good guys (during Cloud's flashback scene in Kalm).

And they are Riduculously high.

Poor Sephy lost it at here. Safer Sephiroth would win but since FF stats only refers to Seph as a good guy, and Advent Children Sephy doesn't do magic because he's too cool for it. Kratos rips him limb from limb, easily at that.

Edit: Supernova? awesome

K1ll3r
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Kratos has reacted to things faster than Sephiroth.

Also Supernova is completely featless and thus useless. I assume we aren't using Safer Sephiroth anyway.

Really? Show me them. Keeping in mind that Sephiroth can move at 2 km\s.

It doesn't need a feat, it has been stated by the creators to have the power of an expanding star! I don't see why people don't understand this, can someone enlighten me?

The weakest version of Sephiroth created Supernova, so it makes no difference if it was Safer or not.

Originally posted by NemeBro
To come back he needed a pre-existing body,

Which he can make easily. As you can see with SHM (He made them btw).

Originally posted by NemeBro
the SHM due to their relationship with Jenova, and he needed Jenova's super awesome cells to be exposed to one of them?

Technically Sephiroth could have taken over them completely. The only thing that injestion of jenova did was allow Kadaj passive mind read, getting the image of Sephiroth from Cloud. Allowing Sephiroth to bring himself (So he looked like who he was) into being!

Originally posted by NemeBro
Why are you responding to such an out of date post by the way? I mean you ever consider that I either no longer think these or that God of War 3 changed things?

It was there, it was stupid, so I responded. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Originally posted by NemeBro
Gtfo.

If everyone did as you said you would be the only person on this board.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Lulz. Firstly, if Kratos had access to the Loom of Fate, and Sephiroth had his own string, his life is literally in Kratos' hands.

This takes place in Nibelheim...Not to mention it would take Kratos a lot of time to find Sephiroths thread and in that time...well Kratos would have no head.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Kratos' basic attacks take roughly 30 microseconds (no, not gameplay time, 'canon' time - but this concept might be completely beyond someone of your level).

Also, before I take this at face value, like so many of you don't take Supernova at face value even though I have statements from the creators, where is this stated?

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
They're roughly as fast as a single lightning stroke takes to appear and disappear, which is on average, 30 microseconds.

Where did you get this information? (average time of lightning strike)

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Supernova's nothing more than an over-hyped standard explosion. It won't work on Kratos.

I ain't over-hyping anything.

Creators have stated it to be as powerful as an expanding star. Kratos cannot tank that.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
If Sephiroth could've come back from any source, it wouldn't have taken Kadaj to absorb the remains of Jenova in the first place.

Sephiroth wasn't coming back until he had an image of himself to create.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
Kadaj was never anything more than just a premature form of Sephiroth

True, and at any time Sephiroth could have completely taken over him. Or any of the things he created from NL.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
who's entire PURPOSE was to complete himself into Sephiroth's new body.

No, his whole purpose was to get Jenova and keep it safe.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
Last I checked, that's the whole freakin' concept of the Reunion process; Sephiroth simply became the center of it because the process had ultimately made him the newest stage in Jenova's evolution.

The reunion is Jenova cells coming back together. Sephiroth was at the center of it because he was the one orchestrating it, Sephiroth was controlling the SHM. If Sephiroth rememebered what he looked like he could have just created his own image instead of three he found in the lifestream.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
The same way the Sisters of Fate did, controlling the thread of his life, or just cutting it, thus ending his life like that. The only counter argument against that is that it may seem like a no-limits fallacy, but so is saying that Sephiroth can come back from any source with just a trace of Jenova's DNA.

Yeah totally, Kratos can get Sephiroths thread and sever it before anything happens, get real. No, there is proof of Sephiroth coming back from a cell, but no proof Sephiroth is even included in some other universes timeline.

More to come.

K1ll3r
Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
So could 80% of the Gods Kratos fought and killed through means that sent them from smirking to being lucky to still have their faces. Poseidon in the first ten minutes of GoWIII alone has already out-sped Sephiroth and a fair majority of FFVII's fighters,

The gods Kratos has killed is much much bigger than him, to hit one you could blindly throw a stone. Whereas Kratos would actually need to aim to hit Sephiroth.

Why? What speed was Poseidon moving at?

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
and he isn't even the strongest nor fastest of the Gods. Secondly, what clip are you speaking of, unless you're referring to the attacks in the one I posted?

The killing Zeus one. Those were the attacks I was referring to.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
Because it's moot given that Kratos is virtually invulnerable in that scene. Like I said, that was merely the most basic jist of what could happen. That video isn't the only showing of that amp technically speaking.

Mmm, well that is one cinematic of Kratos attacking and it was very slow.

Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
Has no concrete use. Hell, Kratos brought the sun back into the sky at one point.

By standing in it? Show me a feat of durability that shows he would survive a magical explosion with the power of an expanding star. Or something canon that at least hints to it.

Just to clarify, the Sephiroth op is referring to is Pre-Nib, not the reviving Sephiroth.

Nemesis X
Originally posted by K1ll3r
What speed was Poseidon moving at?

He descended down so fast, not only did he break the sound barrier but he also went through a Titan (made of stone I might add) like a bullet through a person.

CosmicComet
Ugh. I'm really too damn lazy to respond to all this, but I feel like I need to anyway. I'll do it later.

I'll just say that there is no damn 'developer statement' that supernova has the power of an expanding sun. This fool gave a link that gave a small description of the visuals of the move itself. That's not canon. Its obvious through your eyes alone as it destroys the same damn planets everytime he casts it. It's a featless illusionary move in a single battle.

You won't find a statement from Nomura
talking about how powerful the move actually is.

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by K1ll3r
This takes place in Nibelheim...Not to mention it would take Kratos a lot of time to find Sephiroths thread and in that time...well Kratos would have no head.

Oh, so Sephiroth, too can travel to the Loom Chamber at will upon taking it over? Get real. It takes Kratos less than a few minutes to find his thread when he's in it.



Did they mention the scale? Time it takes? Or at the very least, when he himself was capable of actually using it beyond Safer Sephiroth? I think that's where the whole overhyping thing comes from.



Which, combined with the remaining Jenova Cells, is what he needed in the first place.



Yeah, what he created, not anything from anywhere like what someone seemed to imply.



Says even less about his use, frankly




Aside from the things I already said being reiterated, not much else spoken here makes a difference due to exactly what I had already said.



Yes he could, technically speaking. Until Sephiroth also takes full control of the Loom Chamber and shows implication that he can return to it at will, then well, NO U. And a box of extract mixed with a larval form is not "coming back from a cell".

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by K1ll3r
The gods Kratos has killed is much much bigger than him, to hit one you could blindly throw a stone. Whereas Kratos would actually need to aim to hit Sephiroth.

Get your facts straight first off. Less than half the Gods Kratos fought were in a significantly larger form than Kratos. That includes Zeus who fought him at normal humanly size.



Above Mach 1 at the very least, very clearly breaking the sound barrier, and subsequently knocking a Titan off the mountain by flying straight through it, and very quickly rising from the sea in his watery construct.



Speaks more for what it took to kill Zeus while wielding that power, where that which killed everyone before him could not. As in, not much. And like I said, that very scene has Kratos virtually invulnerable; let Zeus attack and he bounces right off. If I haven't said it yet, I'll say now that it isn't the only time he ever used that power. It's the exact same power that made him powerful enough to go toe-to-toe with Ares and kill him.



Presumably, upon riding the Sun Chariot with it. And this very power was stated at least on occasion to be powerful enough to destroy the world if misused, and it's not even the greatest power in the series (that's the very power that Kratos killed Ares and eventually Zeus with, which also brought forth the beginnings of rebuilding the decimated world).



I'm using the latter for Seph's own sake. This is spite otherwise by the OP's specifications.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Still Sephiroth can control the weather it seems, at least its hinted at in Advent Children.

Technically, he just brought the NL over the sky around Edge city and Midgar's remains. Not bad, but not exactly all-out weather control.

Heythere,Honey
PC Sephiroth can apparently use Supernova according to the in-game Crisis Core Sephiroth fangirl. Never shown it though, but it was known even during that time.

wakkawakkawakka
I really want to know how Sephiroth can hurt Kratos. To me that's still a mystery.

Supernova is still just a game mechanic in my eyes. Otherwise it'd be in the same category as Sin's Giga Gravition or Kuja's Ultima.

Kratos wins, unless Sephiroth has Meteor.

iChaos
Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
I don't assume you see where I'm getting at?

Didn't see your post. Anyway, I get what you're saying, but yeah. But yeah, I don't feel like arguing over this matter so okay.

And, wakkawakkawakka, Sephiroth can hurt Kratos just like anyone else can laughing

CosmicComet
Sephiroth with his mere spiderman level strength harming Kratos who can tank slashes from the BoO wielded by Zeus?(among other ridiculous durability feats) A guy as strong as Kratos, who alone can manipulate hundreds of thousands, if not millions of tons? Nah.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by K1ll3r
Really? Show me them. Keeping in mind that Sephiroth can move at 2 km\s.

2 km/s? Wow, that's (relatively speaking of course) a sloth's level of speed compared to what Kratos has reacted to.

The build-up Leader for a Lightning Bolt moves at 60km/s.
The Return Stroke (what we perceive as the Lightning Bolt) travels at close to Light Speed.

To put it into perspective:


1. Sephiroth's speed is 2km/s, which is 0.0000067 C.

2. The Build-up Leader in a Lightning Strike has a speed of 60km/s, which is 0.0002 C. That's 30 times faster than Sephiroth.

3. (i)http://amsglossary.allenpress.com/glossary/search?id=return-stroke1.
According to that link, the return stroke has a speed of about 1x10^8 m/s, which is ~0.34 C. That's ~51000 times faster than Sephiroth.

(ii)http://books.google.ca/books?id=TuMa5lAa3RAC&pg=PA414&lpg=PA414&dq=Speed+of+a+return+stroke&source=bl&ots=qu0ycD9bnB&sig=d2TJ6ypiif-FHWi4rNySiVHy6pM&hl=en&ei=Ks2BTPrEM8TcnAfFt_zgAQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CC0Q6AEwBg#v=onepage&q&f=false (first paragraph of the page)
According to that link, the return stroke has a speed of close to 2x10^8 m/s, which is ~0.67 C. That's ~105000 times faster than Sephiroth.



I'll give you three guesses as to what Zeus tosses at his enemies, Kratos included.

Originally posted by K1ll3r
This takes place in Nibelheim...Not to mention it would take Kratos a lot of time to find Sephiroths thread and in that time...well Kratos would have no head.

Everything after "Nibelheim..." is incorrect.

a) The method that Kratos typically uses to enter the Loom Chamber is not bound by Space or Time, given by how Kratos was able to enter the Loom Chamber while on the Summit of Sacrifice after the fight with Zeus. Kratos has access to it from any place at any time.
Sephiroth however, would not have access to the Loom Chamber. If he wants to access it, he'd have to make his way through the entire Temple of the Fates, by which time, Kratos would have found Sephiroth's thread. As this fight obviously does not take place anywhere near the Temple of the Fates, it's fairly obvious that Sephiroth is not gaining entrance to the Loom Chamber.

b) Seeing as Kratos is the master of the Loom Chamber and has as much time as he wants, he would have little to no trouble finding Sephiroth's thread. Any part of Sephiroth's life would be accessible to Kratos, given that he literally has control over Time...well, Time as far as an entity's time is concerned.

c) This is in response to your ridiculous implication that Sephiroth could somehow cut off Kratos' head at any time, let alone in the Loom Chamber.
Kratos can slow down time in the Loom Chamber. Assuming Sephiroth can even gain access to the Loom Chamber (which is impossible in this fight), Sephiroth moves at a meager Mach 5, which is a level of speed far below what Kratos has reacted to and dodged/reflected/parried. With the time slowdown in effect, Sephiroth will be no faster than a snail in Kratos' eyes. Kratos will in fact be moving faster than Sephiroth.

Originally posted by K1ll3r
Where did you get this information? (average time of lightning strike)

GHCC (affiliated with NASA) - http://thunder.msfc.nasa.gov/primer/primer2.htmlIt is in the second paragraph of the page. Alternatively, just do a page-text search (Ctrl+F) and search for the term 'microseconds'.

I cross-referenced one of Kratos' basic strikes with a lightning bolt that occurs in the background of one of Kratos' fights in GoWIII (it has only one flash). They match-up. In fact, I think the basic strike might be a tad faster. I'll have to recheck.

Originally posted by K1ll3r
Also, before I take this at face value, like so many of you don't take Supernova at face value even though I have statements from the creators, where is this stated?Originally posted by K1ll3r I ain't over-hyping anything.

Creators have stated it to be as powerful as an expanding star. Kratos cannot tank that.

Link to statements plox.

Originally posted by K1ll3r
The gods Kratos has killed is much much bigger than him, to hit one you could blindly throw a stone. Whereas Kratos would actually need to aim to hit Sephiroth.

Why? What speed was Poseidon moving at?

Accelerates from 0 to Above Mach 1 in an instant.
He then likely slows down, and breaks the Sound Barrier again with more acceleration.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by iChaos
Didn't see your post. Anyway, I get what you're saying, but yeah. But yeah, I don't feel like arguing over this matter so okay.

And, wakkawakkawakka, Sephiroth can hurt Kratos just like anyone else can laughing

That's right, you'd get your forum butt handed to you if you argued with BloodRaw about anything GoW related. uhuh stick out tongue
___________
Anyone else? You mean to say anyone can hurt a guy who has tanked/stopped attacks from the likes of:

a) Hercules with the Cestus (who possibly lifted the entire World, as a part of his labour to get the Apple of Hesperides + a weapon that amplifies striking strength)

b) Zeus with the BoO (a being roughly as strong as Kratos + A sword capable of cutting through Cronos as if he were butter)

c) Giant Poseidon and his Giant Trident* (a god who is second only to Zeus; who is in his Giant form wielding a Giant Trident).
* Yes, Kratos does apparently stop Giant Poseidon's physical Trident attack with his bare hands. I can post up the vid if you want.


Yeah, anyone else can hurt Kratos...almost as ridiculous as Sephiroth hurting Kratos with his sword.

iChaos
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Sephiroth with his mere spiderman level strength harming Kratos who can tank slashes from the BoO wielded by Zeus?(among other ridiculous durability feats) A guy as strong as Kratos, who alone can manipulate hundreds of thousands, if not millions of tons? Nah.

Lolwut?

That's right, you'd get your forum butt handed to you if you argued with BloodRaw about anything GoW related.

Right *rolls eyes*

a) Hercules with the Cestus (who possibly lifted the entire World, as a part of his labour to get the Apple of Hesperides + a weapon that amplifies striking strength)

b) Zeus with the BoO (a being roughly as strong as Kratos + A sword capable of cutting through Cronos as if he were butter)

c) Giant Poseidon and his Giant Trident* (a god who is second only to Zeus; who is in his Giant form wielding a Giant Trident).
* Yes, Kratos does apparently stop Giant Poseidon's physical Trident attack with his bare hands. I can post up the vid if you want.

Lol yeah, okay, man.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by iChaos
Lolwut?

Lol yeah, okay, man.

Ironically, that is the exact same thing I thought of your post.
Though I reasoned I should at least give an intelligent response.

BloodRawEngine
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
That's right, you'd get your forum butt handed to you if you argued with BloodRaw about anything GoW related. uhuh stick out tongue

no expression

I'll take that as a compliment.

CosmicComet
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Link to statements plox.


http://thelifestream.net/final-fantasy-vii/284/crisis-core-complete-guide-keyword-collection/

This is his statement...LOL. A little word bank that just describes what the moved showed. Scroll down to Super Nova.laughing out loud

Basically, its a desperate reach on his part. Sephy is no threat to Kratos.

Demonic Phoenix
Originally posted by BloodRawEngine
no expression

I'll take that as a compliment.

Looking back, I cannot fathom why I typed such a statement like that. It was late at night and I was exhausted. >__>

Originally posted by CosmicComet
http://thelifestream.net/final-fantasy-vii/284/crisis-core-complete-guide-keyword-collection/

This is his statement...LOL. A little word bank that just describes what the moved showed. Scroll down to Super Nova.laughing out loud

Basically, its a desperate reach on his part. Sephy is no threat to Kratos.

That's what he's using as a Creator's statement? no expression

laughing

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