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Duke does not like hearing Link playing his ocarina. "What the hell kind of harmonistic garbage am I hearing? What is with this world and it's lack of kick ass music? Hey you goldilocks, stop blowing in that or so help me I'll destroy your toy like the E ratings did your sex life.....-still hears Link playing-...Okay you asked for it."

There are things a stereotypical man can do in a land filled with magical wonders. He can shoot annoying fairies that won't shut up and even see if a certain princess will take her dress off if he hands her a twenty but if he goes as far as to swipe a musical instrument from a warrior elf's hand and steps on it repeatedly, he's asking for trouble.

For the heck of it, they're both composite from all the games they've been in (minus the crossovers) and they have all their weapons. Link is restricted from using any magical gauntlets and Duke is prohibited from using his shrink ray.

Two of these repetitively overrated iconic schmucks will be fighting in the center of Clock Town.

Will Link hail to the King or will the Duke get his just desserts for being a harsh critic to flute players everywhere?

_Xm8zk3A3oE

I was just looking at some reviews on Duke Nukem Forever recently.

But as for who would win?

I don't know.

My money's on Link currently, but I'm hoping to see at least some resistance from the Duke side, lol.

Its a shame Dukes not allowed his shrink ray, the magical gauntlets mean nothing as a loss to Link because I would say hes stronger than Duke without them. So Dukes the only one missing out, why dont you take away some of Links masks or something?

From what little I know of Duke, along with the gauntlets you'll have to take away all of the rings/bracelets/gloves, Nayruu's love/armours/Cane of Byrna/Magic cape, Din's fire, Light/Fire/Ice/bomb arrows, Magic wand, Medallions, Fire/Ice rod, Pegasus boots, Masks, Four Sword and Blade beams..

Just masks will probably do to get things started, from what I know of Link most of those thinks you listed are fairly featless and ungaugable, and the bombs and arrows are going to be surpassed in speed by machineguns and laser weapons.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
I was just looking at some reviews on Duke Nukem Forever recently.

But as for who would win?

I don't know. Yea, a lot of those reviews were just outright spiteful due to the overly high expectations of some and the sensitive manginas and femnazis hanging about.

Interesting thread though, not sure. Duke gets the jetpack and the nuke gun. Actually Duke has a chance, he has the wmd.

Anyways, Duke is never overrated. Hail to the King Baby!!!

He can probably just rail gun link or spread him with Devastator missle fire, especially if he has the Jet pack although I only know the new Duke Nukem game so I dont know what the Nuke gun is.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Just masks will probably do to get things started, from what I know of Link most of those thinks you listed are fairly featless and ungaugable, and the bombs and arrows are going to be surpassed in speed by machineguns and laser weapons.
Except if its composite then its a hundred tonner, third mach speed with supersonic reactions in 4m and getting knocked into a wall a mile away kinda guy.

Wheres the mach speed and supersonic reactions? and the "knocked" into a wall?

Not that being knocked into a wall is the same as being riddled with bullets, missles and bombs. Also Link could probably just end up frozen from Dukes freeze ray, thats not excluded.

Making me think... arse >;

Spin attack covering 10m in 0.1s, 100m/s attack speed. Reactions make it so he can react to supersonic things at 3.4m. For beating the speedy DLink his reactions would be supersonic in a 2m range.

Wall things from Wind Waker. Scene when he was blasted over an ocean right into a castle wall. Freezing nothing new for his foes. When his arrows hits, he wins.

You love it baby, you love it xxx

Just because Links attack is fast does not mean he can react the speed he attacks, never heard of "the hand is quicker than the eye?" . His movement is never mach speed and Dlink (dark link?) has never shown the speed of sound so I dontk now where thats from.

But hes arrow will not hit, because hes going to have to have to choose an arrow, take aim and pull back/fire in the time it takes Duke just to pull a trigger (the guy does not really have to aim if hes using an automatic or a missle). And I have seen the Wind Waker thing, iirc the wall itself did not take any damage, so the actual force was less than damaging stone, doubt any of that is comparable to bullets and missles anyway, least of all rail guns.

What do you mean by "freezing is nothing new", you can say the same about almost any attack in a vs, "a sword or melee attack is nothing new", he still cant avoid or defeat a beam of freezing and if he attempts to block hes going to have his shield or sword frozen and shatterd. I cant imagine link surviving being smothered in whats essentially like a beam of liquid nitro.

sissyfight

Does when DLink attacks as fast or faster then Link's 100m/s attacks. If Link can dodge DLink's 150m/s attacks in a 1m range, he can dodge supersonic things at around 2m. 3.4m if its attack speed is equal.

But if it does, Duke's dead. With his speed and reactions it wont take long to evade and shoot. Meh, they didn't take that into account. The hit/blast still happened.

Well, yeah. I can say that till the thing is above what he's faced. Monsters can freeze him over in LoZ for him to break free, and in the DN verse common enemies if left for a bit can break out of the ice. The stronger, tougher, greener guy would have an easier time.

Originally posted by BloodRain
sissyfight

Does when DLink attacks as fast or faster then Link's 100m/s attacks. If Link can dodge DLink's 150m/s attacks in a 1m range, he can dodge supersonic things at around 2m. 3.4m if its attack speed is equal.

But if it does, Duke's dead. With his speed and reactions it wont take long to evade and shoot. Meh, they didn't take that into account. The hit/blast still happened.

Well, yeah. I can say that till the thing is above what he's faced. Monsters can freeze him over in LoZ for him to break free, and in the DN verse common enemies if left for a bit can break out of the ice. The stronger, tougher, greener guy would have an easier time.

Show me DLink moving at mach speeds please, moving your sword around does not give you mach speeds unless its proven that Link is actually watching/reacting to the blade as it moves mid flight and not just puting his shield up or something, iirc the method of Dlink being defeated is up to the player. Its not a cutscene where its made a point that Link is watching swords in mach speeds.

Yes, I agree since hes not got great durability. What? evade bullets and machinguns? Hes never evaded something so fast in a contnious volley, blocking a few sword blows is not equel to bullet fire. Also how do you know he can concentrate, fire accuratly etc while having rocket explosions or machiengun shrapnel spraying around him? Clearly not much pressure was evident for some reason, probably the same reason he squeeked his way down the wall when he hit it, its a useless feat compared to bullets.

Has link ever been canonically frozen and broken out? Also can you show me these enemies, further being frozen typically would kill a person from cold bite, I could counter and say similiar to your point above "they just did not take colds affect on a biological organism into account" and say in his vs, Link will just die of hyperthermia or w/e.

Also note, Dukes guns are on a large scale, its not just bullet fire were talking about, several of his guns are triple barreled machine guns, duel rapid fire rocket launchers. Even non fictional weapons would be too quick for Link but Dukes guns are on another level.

Quoi? No, they don't have mach speeds. If Link can react to DLink's 150m/s attacks it'd give him RT of 0.00667s, meaning supersonic at a certain distance. The fact that he faced DLink says he had to have the reactions to dodge... or he'd be dead. In reactions, a 150 sword from 1m = 400 bullet from 2.6m.
Maybe because of the cartoon theme of the game? The blast/hit still counts.

Nup, though it is a set animation. I can not :I cba to look through a game. This was in TP and OoT, not the toony WW.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Quoi? No, they don't have mach speeds. If Link can react to DLink's 150m/s attacks it'd give him RT of 0.00667s, meaning supersonic at a certain distance. The fact that he faced DLink says he had to have the reactions to dodge... or he'd be dead. In reactions, a 150 sword from 1m = 400 bullet from 2.6m.
Maybe because of the cartoon theme of the game? The blast/hit still counts.

Nup, though it is a set animation. I can not :I cba to look through a game. This was in TP and OoT, not the toony WW.

"if" he was actually reacting to it as it happened, rather than just puting his shield up. If you dont get the point I am trying to make, an English knight putting up his shield at an archer whos about to fire an arrow at him, did not react to the speeds of the arrow when he blocks it on his shield, but rather than intent/action of the opponent. It counts for what the game shows us, as per the new rule of KMC, little, if pressure is not factored into the game like you suggested, then its useless altogether.

It cannot be proven DLinks sword was in flight at mach speeds over such a short distance and Link watched it in slow mo or something to block it. Its even less likely to a hail of bullets from 3, rapid fire barrels. Everything Nukem does is easier to kill Link, while Link has to try a lot harder to kill Nukem.

Well he aint dead so I guess so :T putting up a shield is still reacting. In melee combat you can only defend after the attack starts. Launching a child like that takes great force.

"No, they don't have mach speeds", DLink's is comfortably faster then Link's 100m/s, ie 150m/s. Dodging his attacks is proof of his reactions. Not hard. Put up shield, throw bomb. If he's not dead then a swift arrow to the head using superior RT and speed. Don't take much.

Yes but not necesserily as the attack takes place, and you cant "only" defend after the attack starts, theres such as a thing as pre-emptive, which most defence comes from, a soldier does not have to dodge bullets from a .50 cal machinegun to get into cover, he can do that beforehand, Links shield can be put up before he actually closes the range to DLink. Whether that force was taken into account, or whether or not pressure was taken into account is the question though, and the wall not being damaged and him squeeking down it is kinda a confirmation those pressures are not.

I have yet to see this. Also iirc most of SPs calcluations were overhyped for that speed, I have yet to see Link slash much faster than a peak human. What if Links shot to piecies at "put up shield"? then the throw bomb part is irrelevent, or if a cluster of missles blows the shield and his arm off into the air. The whole "swift arrow" is going to be hard to accomplish a that point. Duke has pipe bombs as well himself iirc.

Superior RT? maybe, Superior speed? not seen it tbh, Links peak human, so is Duke. Difference is, Duke does not need high RT, he just needs to pull a trigger, the bullets do the speed, and theres 3 high caliber barrels pumping them out at speed.

Originally posted by Burning thought
He can probably just rail gun link or spread him with Devastator missle fire, especially if he has the Jet pack although I only know the new Duke Nukem game so I dont know what the Nuke gun is.

It's called the Plasma Cannon and at full charge it swallows the stadium interior at the very least.

fvX4l-mh4P
At 2:12 he whips it out and fires 2 uncharged shots plus one full charged one, and a 7 energy cell charge at the end.

I cannot see your video, but if thats the case and power of this weapon, then it should be able to obliterate Link without even aiming.

Cept unlike a bullet, a person can decide to strike another area :V The force to launch him doesn't disappear.

I helped Scream get the spin distance, his time seemed legit. Wont be. If he can attack at 100m/s he can throw up a shield at that speed too. Superhuman speed aiming and shooting an arrow is faster then a peak human aiming and shooting.

Just to speed up the thread, Link used the Pegasus which iirc makes him twice as fast. There, faster. Now he can bullet time his way to a slash.

Link takes this.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Cept unlike a bullet, a person can decide to strike another area :V The force to launch him doesn't disappear.

I helped Scream get the spin distance, his time seemed legit. Wont be. If he can attack at 100m/s he can throw up a shield at that speed too. Superhuman speed aiming and shooting an arrow is faster then a peak human aiming and shooting.

Just to speed up the thread, Link used the Pegasus which iirc makes him twice as fast. There, faster. Now he can bullet time his way to a slash.

So? Depending on how good the opposition is, you can then defend another area based on their position, I dont suppose you ever took up fencing?, a good fencer does not see their opponents attacks as slow motion, they composate. Seems the pressure at the other end did though, so pretty weak.

So its all about a spin? not simply every strike. Why?, a shield is arguably more cumbersome and whats he holding? his arrows and bombs to launch an attack or is he hiding behind a shield that probably wont protect him? Show me the super human speed aim? all Duke has to do is pull a trigger in the general direction, fireing a bow takes a lot more effort to get right.

That sounds a bit general, I assume your talking about boots? so hes going to go from typical human speed running/walking to what, marathon runner speed, theres no bullet timing there. Your trying to relate the ambigious "defence" of a blow to running speed and movement.

this is spite

Link uses the "Spell" spell. instant cast time AoE. Duke is now a tiny blob. The end.

Or duke empties 3 barrels of ammo into Link then gives a cheesy line before setting his green pjamas alight with a cigar.

Duke also has a rail gun. I would like to see Link dodge EM fired shards that can pass through surfaces.

Also is Duke allowed a holo duke? he could have a little fake Duke to fool Link with.

Cept human combat can only happen if a persons speed can be countered by the others reactions and speed. Took it, aced it, beat the ****ing class. Take if you've never been in a fight :V cos if your reactions are below the opponents speed you wont be dodging or blocking their hits. Nope, not how it works.

Before you try, saying Link is fast for one attack but slower for others is a weak argument. Yeah.. couldn't understand that sentence. Super speed+super reactions=fast aiming. It takes about 0.3s to think, aim and shoot based on human RT and speed. Seeing as Link has 15x peak human reactions and 10x speed, he could aim and fire at least 10x faster. Now it'd only take a sec for a pro archer to. So the arrow could be heading for Duke before he fires~

...fekkin missed word. Contradiction; "Links peak human" "typical human speed" how can he increase from peak human to marathon speed? ;3 With the boots he'll be twice Duke's speed. Cant shoot something moving twice your speed which can react to your shots.

And thats without what the others here said.

And technique. Its all about perception and following someones movements, you can do that easily with sparring, weapons etc, you dont have to watch their blow in slow mo to defend, if you do then your not too good unfortunatly , "the hand is quicker than the eye" is a term in martial arts and so the mind has to compensate.

Not really, since a lot of Links abilities have some magical fuel and some of his attacks do seem visually slower or faster than others and iirc the one you mathed has magical effect to it like a lot of Links special moves, remember what I just tought you about technique for instance? No not really, whats super speed got to do with it? anyone can quickly draw a bow but you have to take aim and effort with a bow, not with a gun like Dukes. Wheres this 0.3s coming from? source? Why should it be? Links drawring an arrow of choice, aiming and then shooting with hopefuly accuracy vs Duke whos just "pulling trigger".

Erm yes you can because hes not twice Dukes bullet speed, being a bit quicker than Duke himself means nothing, humans cant dodge bullet fire from regular guns let alone triple barrel machineguns or plasma guns that can light up huge areas and while hes fleeing in terror hes not fireing unless you can prove he can do all this at once, he is a man afterall and men cant multi task

Indeed, I have been almost ignoring what Darkstorm said about the plasma cannon lighting up whole areas, so theres no "dodging" BS worth mentioning anyway.

Why do you keep bringing up slow-mo? Your reations have to match your opponents speed your you'll get hit. "the hand is quicker than the eye" is a term for the advancer, not the defender.

Nope, requires him to spin around. That's all. You taught me about how magical moves can be faster... what, you were taught by Yoda? O-o. Hence where reaction comes into play. 0.3 = 0.1 reaction time + >0.1 aim movement + <0.1 trigger pull. Actually the aim movement would be more 0.2, so 0.4. Also here. Note that not only are they specialized for this, these are shot from the hip, not actually aiming like Duke would. Yes all that, but will it take 4 seconds to do? If you've ever been with cocky teens while doing archery you'll know that it takes a second for these amateurs to do a quick shot. Sure they barely hit the target.. but they're amateurs unlike Link. With normal human speed these kids can set up, aim and fire in a second. Imagine a pro like Link who can move 10x faster then a person.

Never said out running a bullet dodging. A 2xpeak guy who can bullet time at 2m can advance on the shooter. Prove a character can dodge and shoot?... anyone can move and react, let alone a superhuman.

If you want I can just say Link used Nayru's love to take anything that hits then PBoots over to Duke, freeze him and smash the ice to pieces with a blade beam. NL > his weaps.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Why do you keep bringing up slow-mo? Your reations have to match your opponents speed your you'll get hit. "the hand is quicker than the eye" is a term for the advancer, not the defender.

Nope, requires him to spin around. That's all. You taught me about how magical moves can be faster... what, you were taught by Yoda? O-o. Hence where reaction comes into play. 0.3 = 0.1 reaction time + >0.1 aim movement + <0.1 trigger pull. Actually the aim movement would be more 0.2, so 0.4. Also here. Note that not only are they specialized for this, these are shot from the hip, not actually aiming like Duke would. Yes all that, but will it take 4 seconds to do? If you've ever been with cocky teens while doing archery you'll know that it takes a second for these amateurs to do a quick shot. Sure they barely hit the target.. but they're amateurs unlike Link. With normal human speed these kids can set up, aim and fire in a second. Imagine a pro like Link who can move 10x faster then a person.

Never said out running a bullet dodging. A 2xpeak guy who can bullet time at 2m can advance on the shooter. Prove a character can dodge and shoot?... anyone can move and react, let alone a superhuman.

If you want I can just say Link used Nayru's love to take anything that hits then PBoots over to Duke, freeze him and smash the ice to pieces with a blade beam. NL > his weaps.

If you know martial art basics you know it works for both, any offensive action has to be matched by a defense therefore you still have to take into account something you may not be able to see. Theres also such a thing as stand, if using a sword for sparring, you can take horizontal/vertical stances for better blocking of certain attacks, you dont get into a stance in the middle of an opponents attack. Links got an even easier time of it here, all he has to do is put up his shield, its big enough to cover most of him and with a shield, slight movements can deflect blows and on top of that, Dlink uses some of Links similiar skills so he knows what hes facing, nothing much to do with reaction at all.

Show me, I recall some magical force being relevent. Your source is talking about guns ,not bows and arrows and does not include initial reaction time, e.g. their actions are based on an event, they know the time and when their going to fire, however if your trying to say Duke will take this much time hes not pulling handguns or such from a holster and I assume both charactersin this thread begin with their weapons drawn. Link still has to be able to aim and fire, unless you can prove professionals can do this in less than a second while under machine gun fire. Then add the time it takes for reaction, human reactions on events are not that quick. He can do a sword spin that much faster, based on amibgious assumptions of how he fought Dlink, who he has an advantage against being a similiar opponent to himself, he does not have that agianst Duke.

Well its the same thing, you cant "dodge" a bullet, or three barrels spitting out hundreds of bullets just because you can run several times the speed of a man. move and react? I said dodge and shoot, sprint/flee away from three machineguns opening up WHILE fireing an accurate shot? never seen it from link at all....

Naryus love has what feats? whats it canonically taken? NL has never faced machineguns and energy cannons so I dont know how you can claim NL>them unless its done something damn impressive. Also, looking it up, Link cant do much while its active, he cant use powers or magic.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Indeed, I have been almost ignoring what Darkstorm said about the plasma cannon lighting up whole areas, so theres no "dodging" BS worth mentioning anyway.

Oh gee, thanks a lot BT...

Considering the shockwave alone filed a stadium upto the rafters, and considering the initial blastwave is much much bigger than that, I think my claim is justified.

Well I keep imagining Duke with the triple barreled machinegun because its a gun I used a lot when I played Duke Nukem forever, remembering the plasma cannon is hard because Its not in the new game is it? (did not finish it).

No. The Plasma Cannon was a N64 exclusive weapon for Duke Nukem 64, along with the 6 shot grenade launcher, twin SMGs and the heavy missile launcher. (Along with alternate ammo types for the Shotgun, Pistol and Missile Launcher.... DumDum Pistol Bullets and explosive shotgun shells owned so hard in multiplayer.)

Yeah that line is for the persons move being faster then the others eyes. In this case Link's eyes are able to keep up with DLink's moves.

Its the basic spin attack, youtube's being laem for larger vids so I'm not gonna look through several long vids like this >:. Its talking about guns because I was talking about Duke, not Link Some guy shooting, lucky its a short vid.. Anyway his best shot takes 3.5s. That's 0.2 to think, 1 to bring the arrow to the bow, 2 to notch the arrow, 0.3 to aim and fire. Some site say a pro can bring the arrow to the bow and notch it in 0.5s each. With obvious better reactions and aim, pro would be 0.1 to think, 0.5 for arrow to bow, 0.5 to notch, 0.2 to aim and shoot. With human level speed and RT Duke fires in 0.4s and Link in 1.3. As a superhuman with 10x speed and 15x reactions, Link takes 0.00666 to think, 0.05 for arrow to bow, 0.05 to notch, 0.0133 to aim and fire: Basically 0.12 seconds. And if Duke is 10m away and with a 100m/s arrow it would take a total of 0.22s for Duke to be hit by an arrow. That means Duke will get hit half way through his shot, aka while starting to aim.

Again, reacting to a 150m/s slash at 1m means you can react to a 400m/s bullet shot from 2.6m away. He can equally react at that distance. Moving twice as fast as Duke means he can outpace his movements/targeting. Being faster then the shooters aim and being able to react to the bullets at a certain distance means Link can dodge his fire.

Nayru's Love can take force up to 90% of Ganon's strikes based on damage, takes GJ force to get past its defenses. IIRC machine gun bullets are only 5kJ. NL makes it so you can't use items or spells that require magic. PBoots, an arrow or a stab/blade beam do not use up his magic.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Yeah that line is for the persons move being faster then the others eyes. In this case Link's eyes are able to keep up with DLink's moves.

Its the basic spin attack, youtube's being laem for larger vids so I'm not gonna look through several long vids like this >:. Its talking about guns because I was talking about Duke, not Link Some guy shooting, lucky its a short vid.. Anyway his best shot takes 3.5s. That's 0.2 to think, 1 to bring the arrow to the bow, 2 to notch the arrow, 0.3 to aim and fire. Some site say a pro can bring the arrow to the bow and notch it in 0.5s each. With obvious better reactions and aim, pro would be 0.1 to think, 0.5 for arrow to bow, 0.5 to notch, 0.2 to aim and shoot. With human level speed and RT Duke fires in 0.4s and Link in 1.3. As a superhuman with 10x speed and 15x reactions, Link takes 0.00666 to think, 0.05 for arrow to bow, 0.05 to notch, 0.0133 to aim and fire: Basically 0.12 seconds. And if Duke is 10m away and with a 100m/s arrow it would take a total of 0.22s for Duke to be hit by an arrow. That means Duke will get hit half way through his shot, aka while starting to aim.

Again, reacting to a 150m/s slash at 1m means you can react to a 400m/s bullet shot from 2.6m away. He can equally react at that distance. Moving twice as fast as Duke means he can outpace his movements/targeting. Being faster then the shooters aim and being able to react to the bullets at a certain distance means Link can dodge his fire.

Nayru's Love can take force up to 90% of Ganon's strikes based on damage, takes GJ force to get past its defenses. IIRC machine gun bullets are only 5kJ. NL makes it so you can't use items or spells that require magic. PBoots, an arrow or a stab/blade beam do not use up his magic.

But not his weapons of attack, which do not include predictable sword or fist play but erratic weapons fire or large AoE explosives.

I see, i dont know why you brought up holster pistol draw speeds for Nukem who uses large machineguns. Well your vid here shows draw speeds but not reaction times, hes just fireing, not reacitng to anything. Also your using how fast Link can block someone with his shield as a basis for all his moves, thats wrong, he may not be as quick for all activities hes put in and further, swinging a sword is far less active than the concentration and such for an accurate bow shot. Also 0.4 is if he had to pull a gun and draw it. Only, your facts are unrelated to Dukes weapons or his method and your basis on Link is purely how he reacts to a sword blow or pre empts a sword blow.

Concerning your source for shooting, the guy does less than 10 shots a minute, assuming hes not really aiming at anything, reactions are not taken into account and hes not under machinegun fire thats not too great, Icant see Link with the said problems hes up against even achiveing a hit tbh. Maybe if hes standing firm he can but not while running and fireing.

Ive yet to see him actually reacting to the slash, you can hold your shield up (and so can Link) to deflect a slash like that also this is not one bullet, its 3 barrels spraying bullets, this is not "bullet time link" and his shields not proven to block bullets iirc, as Darkstorm pointed out, Duke has access to a very large area affect weapon so all this "dodge bullet" BS is worthless anyway.

He can move faster than duke can run, but Duke has to do far less to shoot link than Link does to avoid being shot assuming he could. Links sprinting for his little life, trying to apprently fire shots from a bow accuratly while Duke just has to slowly pivot his body in Links general direction.

So theres no canon use of it then? your just using the gameplay mechanics of what it does to Ganons damage, as opposed to how many hearts Link loses when hes struck while using it. Also I would not be surprised if deploying NL takes time even if its a second.

Edit- its more like 3+ seconds, so NY love is useless unless Link wants to die fast.

also, I looked up some DLink vids, apprently you dont necesserily have to react to anything. People are either just hitting him repeatadly with a hammer or just holding up the shield.

what are you guys even talking about?

Nayru's love takes 100% of all damage. Not 90%

Link stays invincible for a ridiculous amount of time with it.

Also, as soon as the fight starts Link could just cast "Spell" and the fight will be over. It's an instant cast AoE, no way for Duke to avoid.

And Naryrus love is useless as it takes him 3 seconds+ just to try and use it, and 100% is a no limit fallacy anyway.

Its range is no doubt a few meters as per the confines of the viewing screen of the 2d game it was used in?

I'm not going to waste my time arguing that you need reactions to match your attackers strikes to evade, block or counter them.
To see how fast it takes him to think(0.1), aim(0.2) and then fire(0.1): 0.4s, slower then a quick-draw. The reaction time of a avg human is 0.2, 0.1 for peak. That's how long it takes a person to think of doing an action to actually doing the action. If Link has arm movements 10x faster then a human he can do the same movements 10x faster with his 15x reactions covering concentration and accuracy. You're underestimating how fast it can happen. That normal guy can do it in 3.5s, a pro can do it in 1.3s. 2.6x faster while still in the human limits. Limits Link bypasses. 0.4 is to think, aim and pull the trigger. Its slower then a superhuman with a bow.

Unless DLink is retarded, a preemptive block wont work. Reactions have to equal attack speed to evade, block and counter. These reactions let him dodge, his speed lets out outmaneuver Duke. That's what you need to bullet time. Yeah: Aim and shoot. Two things that are very difficult to do against a creature with 20m/s movements and 0.006 reactions. Who said Link will be running away? 20m/s agains Duke's 0.1RT means that Link can lunge a meter before he can react, and this meter means Duke's arm movement wont get a lock.

Excluding flashy movements it only takes a split second between the light entering his body to forming the shield. The only game'mech is the exact figure. Ganon being the only entity to damage Link with NL is a fact meaning it takes his amount of force to harm him. A little doubtful that Duke has weapons nearing GJ levels of force.


@Cyner: Well that's be a no-limits fallacy. Though being able to stop Ganon still makes it an extremely powerful defense.

Note: The range of spell's 'screen length' is 10x Link's height. Fairly large area.

Originally posted by BloodRain
I'm not going to waste my time arguing that you need reactions to match your attackers strikes to evade, block or counter them.
To see how fast it takes him to think(0.1), aim(0.2) and then fire(0.1): 0.4s, slower then a quick-draw. The reaction time of a avg human is 0.2, 0.1 for peak. That's how long it takes a person to think of doing an action to actually doing the action. If Link has arm movements 10x faster then a human he can do the same movements 10x faster with his 15x reactions covering concentration and accuracy. You're underestimating how fast it can happen. That normal guy can do it in 3.5s, a pro can do it in 1.3s. 2.6x faster while still in the human limits. Limits Link bypasses. 0.4 is to think, aim and pull the trigger. Its slower then a superhuman with a bow.

Unless DLink is retarded, a preemptive block wont work. Reactions have to equal attack speed to evade, block and counter. These reactions let him dodge, his speed lets out outmaneuver Duke. That's what you need to bullet time. Yeah: Aim and shoot. Two things that are very difficult to do against a creature with 20m/s movements and 0.006 reactions. Who said Link will be running away? 20m/s agains Duke's 0.1RT means that Link can lunge a meter before he can react, and this meter means Duke's arm movement wont get a lock.

Excluding flashy movements it only takes a split second between the light entering his body to forming the shield. The only game'mech is the exact figure. Ganon being the only entity to damage Link with NL is a fact meaning it takes his amount of force to harm him. A little doubtful that Duke has weapons nearing GJ levels of force.


@Cyner: Well that's be a no-limits fallacy. Though being able to stop Ganon still makes it an extremely powerful defense.

Note: The range of spell's 'screen length' is 10x Link's height. Fairly large area.

Jolly good, maybe ill see more counters worth reading in that case. Can you show me the source for your reaction times? iirc, when we were doing it before, a wiki article pointed out it took 0.3 for visual reaction and slightly less for sound before making an action. Hang on, wheres the pro numbers again? I have yet to see a pro, and we dont know this guys background, he could be a pro for all we know? Your pulling 0.4 from thin air, a lot of these numbers seem to be from nowhere, how fast it takes for someone to draw a gun and fire is slower than just pulling a trigger. Your deductions are based on ambigious assumptions on how Link fought Dlink and then overhyping the numbers used in one move to everything Link does. I can move my hands fairly quick, does not mean I can move my feet, legs etc at the same speed, its the same with people who have reflexes enough to do martial arts, does not mean they will beat marathon runners in a race, or fire accurate bow shots alongside the masters of archery.

He may well be, not sure what he is tbh, just some sort of spirit by the looks of it, point being he only knows Links attacks, so a preemtive block is fine and no, preemtive can cover all of those things. He does not have that movement speed, he can do an attack in a meter or so at high speed, thats not a case for him being able to run at those speeds.

Hes got to get activate the light first, it takes seconds for him to activate it all, therefore useless. Fact or no, your the one assuming it works on a % basis, we know Ganons is superior, we dont know how high power can get before the shield is useless and your only gauge is how much health Link loses by comparison. Its doubtful duke will take 3 seconds to blast link into bits unless he enjoys the lightshow.

Do me a favour, stop being annoying, kay? Its 0.2 to 0.1. Judging from his page and status, he isnt a pro. Thin air if you didn't read the post. Confirmed peak reactions is 0.1, confirmed arm movement speed is 0.2 and 0.1 is to pull a trigger. How does your 'hands and feet' point relate in any way to 'hands and hands'? Arm movement is arm movement. His dexterity will match his speed and reactions.

He thinks and acts like Link. Is Link retarded? No. 2xpeak human running is 20m/s movement speed. PBoots.

Besides the flashy movements its still instantaneous. Forming the orb, 0.2s. Taking it in to form the shield, 0.1. Its only if you count the flashy things will it be longer. The gameplay is the only way to say by how much, if not it can still take Ganon's strength so it doesn't really matter. So the shields up and he's impervious to Duke.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Do me a favour, stop being annoying, kay? Its 0.2 to 0.1. Judging from his page and status, he isnt a pro. Thin air if you didn't read the post. Confirmed peak reactions is 0.1, confirmed arm movement speed is 0.2 and 0.1 is to pull a trigger. How does your 'hands and feet' point relate in any way to 'hands and hands'? Arm movement is arm movement. His dexterity will match his speed and reactions.

He thinks and acts like Link. Is Link retarded? No. 2xpeak human running is 20m/s movement speed. PBoots.

Besides the flashy movements its still instantaneous. Forming the orb, 0.2s. Taking it in to form the shield, 0.1. Its only if you count the flashy things will it be longer. The gameplay is the only way to say by how much, if not it can still take Ganon's strength so it doesn't really matter. So the shields up and he's impervious to Duke.

Says the guy who seems to "try" and be annoying. Your source covers what I said, that its simply stimulation, its not an actual movement or action, so it takes 0.2 just for Link to stimulate the reaction, you can then add how long it takes for him to do the action, so another second or so to fire.

Can you prove this? Clearly he does not think and act like Link since Link would not try to kill himself.

"flashy thingd"? you cant just cut out part of what Link does in hopes of covering his sloth darling. Thought so, so its pretty useless, mechanics are the only thing to gauge it. As I said, if Duke sits there, waiting, 0.2+ seconds for Link to stimulate a response, then he makes a decision, then the activation of the spell so all in all about 3.5s before Narys love is actiaved, its not going to take that long for Duke to "pull trigger".

So this has just boiled down to being another one-sided BT thread? Did the rest of the Duke supporters I saw in the Duke vs Chris and Wesker threads like Kazenji just cower out or somethin'? I'm disappoint.

Darkstorm added some insight.

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
So this has just boiled down to being another one-sided BT thread? Did the rest of the Duke supporters I saw in the Duke vs Chris and Wesker threads like Kazenji just cower out or somethin'? I'm disappoint.

What the frig are you on about??

i've just seen this thread right now 7.10 PM

sorry if i don't live in the America.

Dukes ultimate weapon:

The holoduke.

Aggro's all enemies, letting Duke pick his shots.

Link Cocklashes Duke's balls of with sword of highrule and screws Zelda afters with a cigar stolen form the former king.

He can't.

Duke has balls of steel.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Darkstorm added some insight.
Yeah, that's true.

Originally posted by Kazenji
What the frig are you on about??

i've just seen this thread right now 7.10 PM

sorry if i don't live in the America.
Well I noticed you were much quicker to post in the Duke vs Chris and Wesker threads, whereas here you just posted a couple days after this thread was made, so I don't think where you live necessarily played a factor in that. Also, I was mainly just being an ass there to encourage more activity in the thread , so no hard feelings or anything personal. lol

Originally posted by cdtm
Dukes ultimate weapon:

The holoduke.

Aggro's all enemies, letting Duke pick his shots.
BUTBUT- THE TRIFORCE OF COURAGE IS THE MOST ULTIMATE WEAPON OF ALL! Capable of owning even the pre-retcon Beyonder!

Duke is more than pre-retcon Beyonder.

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime

so I don't think where you live necessarily played a factor in that.

Personally it does


besides i was'nt near a computer on Wednesday and top of that i rarely checked this part of the forums.....just gets same old, same old with the vs's


as for this fight the Duke takes the win

lol at killermover as expected the same kind of posts from him.

Killermover is a bigger Duke Nukem fan than all of us, what did you expect?

Somebody who spends that much time focused on a character has to be in love with him.

Originally posted by Nemesis X
Duke does not like hearing Link playing his ocarina. "What the hell kind of harmonistic garbage am I hearing? What is with this world and it's lack of kick ass music? Hey you goldilocks, stop blowing in that or so help me I'll destroy your toy like the E ratings did your sex life.....-still hears Link playing-...Okay you asked for it."

There are things a stereotypical man can do in a land filled with magical wonders. He can shoot annoying fairies that won't shut up and even see if a certain princess will take her dress off if he hands her a twenty but if he goes as far as to swipe a musical instrument from a warrior elf's hand and steps on it repeatedly, he's asking for trouble.

For the heck of it, they're both composite from all the games they've been in (minus the crossovers) and they have all their weapons. Link is restricted from using any magical gauntlets and Duke is prohibited from using his shrink ray.

Two of these repetitively overrated iconic schmucks will be fighting in the center of Clock Town.

Will Link hail to the King or will the Duke get his just desserts for being a harsh critic to flute players everywhere?

Judging by the opening post, Duke begins the fight having stolen Link's Ocarina and stomped on it repeatedly, while boasting.

This puts him within sword range immediately.

Mortal Draw, guys.

~ Duke's aura of badassery smites Link.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Duke is more than pre-retcon Beyonder.

Pre-retcon Beyonder? U SHUR?

Beyond the Presence is where I'd put him vin

Originally posted by The Scenario
Judging by the opening post, Duke begins the fight having stolen Link's Ocarina and stomped on it repeatedly, while boasting.

This puts him within sword range immediately.

Mortal Draw, guys.
You've put Duke within arm's reach of composite Link, an apparently angry composite Link whose just had a very valuable possession of his destroyed.

Duke's life expectancy isn't very high.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Somebody who spends that much time focused on a character has to be in love with him.
True that. mmm

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
You've put Duke within arm's reach of composite Link, an apparently angry composite Link whose just had a very valuable possession of his destroyed.

Duke's life expectancy isn't very high.
Was thinking that too, but I hope the Duke side can try and disprove that so this can be dragged out a little longer like Nidoking vs Tyranitar. dur

Originally posted by Burning thought
Says the guy who seems to "try" and be annoying. Your source covers what I said, that its simply stimulation, its not an actual movement or action, so it takes 0.2 just for Link to stimulate the reaction, you can then add how long it takes for him to do the action, so another second or so to fire.

Can you prove this? Clearly he does not think and act like Link since Link would not try to kill himself.

"flashy thingd"? you cant just cut out part of what Link does in hopes of covering his sloth darling. Thought so, so its pretty useless, mechanics are the only thing to gauge it. As I said, if Duke sits there, waiting, 0.2+ seconds for Link to stimulate a response, then he makes a decision, then the activation of the spell so all in all about 3.5s before Narys love is actiaved, its not going to take that long for Duke to "pull trigger".

3secondmemoryftw.

Yeah, 0.2/0.1 is the time it takes from -visible action- to -ready to act-. A peak human can do this all in 0.1 second, get the arrow, notch it then aim and release. Link's reactions make the reaction and aim stages 15x faster, his speed makes the arrow grabbing and notching 10x faster. It takes a total of 0.2 seconds from thinking about using the bow to the arrow hitting Duke. Twice as fast as a peak humans 0.4 second gun speed. Duke's peak human speed can't compete with Link's superhuman speed, any speed or reaction he has Link can do in a tenth of the time.

There's no reason to suggest he doesn't think as Link does. Further note, preemptive blocks will never work. Sole exception being if you're curled in a ball doing a constant block to you head and someone kicks at it. In a fight? No. You only block when you know the opponent is about to strike.

I can when these movements have nothing to do with activating. Its the same deal with time looking like it stops when using it. Excessive movements that aren't to do with the actual ability.

If it can block anything with the exception of Ganon its legit telling us how much strength is needed to break it, GJ. Now we just need Duke to have a gigajoule level weapon on hand.. Seriously, where are you getting 0.2+ for him to react from? Thats for people with bad reactions. You do know that 0.2 is 'average human' reactions, right? Peak human is 0.1. Link has superhuman reactions, so dont be giving him a slow mans mind. On the other hand Duke's a mere peak human at best. Dodge, shield, NL, kill him before he shoots. Many an option.

Originally posted by BloodRain
3secondmemoryftw.

Yeah, 0.2/0.1 is the time it takes from -visible action- to -ready to act-. A peak human can do this all in 0.1 second, get the arrow, notch it then aim and release. Link's reactions make the reaction and aim stages 15x faster, his speed makes the arrow grabbing and notching 10x faster. It takes a total of 0.2 seconds from thinking about using the bow to the arrow hitting Duke. Twice as fast as a peak humans 0.4 second gun speed. Duke's peak human speed can't compete with Link's superhuman speed, any speed or reaction he has Link can do in a tenth of the time.

There's no reason to suggest he doesn't think as Link does. Further note, preemptive blocks will never work. Sole exception being if you're curled in a ball doing a constant block to you head and someone kicks at it. In a fight? No. You only block when you know the opponent is about to strike.

I can when these movements have nothing to do with activating. Its the same deal with time looking like it stops when using it. Excessive movements that aren't to do with the actual ability.

If it can block anything with the exception of Ganon its legit telling us how much strength is needed to break it, GJ. Now we just need Duke to have a gigajoule level weapon on hand.. Seriously, where are you getting 0.2+ for him to react from? Thats for people with bad reactions. You do know that 0.2 is 'average human' reactions, right? Peak human is 0.1. Link has superhuman reactions, so dont be giving him a slow mans mind. On the other hand Duke's a mere peak human at best. Dodge, shield, NL, kill him before he shoots. Many an option.

Stimulation for an action, the actual action as shown by the archery vid can take even decent archers to fire slowly. What the hell, show me a peak human reacting, loading an arrow and fireing it in 0.1 seconds....you wont find any. Wrong, Links speed? links not even fast, if your trying to use the boots then you have to prove his hands and reactions are also increased in speed. The 0.4 is from holster shooting, duke has no holster and his guns are in his hands, all he has to do is pull a trigger, less than a second. Only links got a lot more actions and far more to think about than duke.

Some sort of circular logic your trying here? "no reason to suggest he doesnt", why? technically hes not link and if he does think, then both of them know eachothers moves, a major advantage to both. Erm, yes they will, if you hold up your shield (tactic used by players in the game) you can block his strikes.

They clearly are otherwise why would he do it? your not making any sense, he takes out som sort of bottle/glowing object, does a gesture and the spell is slowly cast, completly useless.

Not reall,y your just using gameplay mechanics. Thats good reaction actually, 0.2+ is stimulation (which should take 0.2 by itself) AND an action which is damn incredible, your misunderstanding how reaction and stimulation to a reaction works, humans percieve the world constantly, knowing something is going to happen, or watching something happening like in this example of Link vs Dark Link is completly different to reacting on the fly to something you canont expect, like a spray of bullets from Duke.

Ok, dodge fails since his not a bullet timer, dies in a hail of rounds OR a missle which disintegrates him. Shield gets shot into shrapnel and kills link, NL is useless as its too slow, him reaching for the spell alone will kill him.....

You seem to have a fan fiction of Link doing all this in less than a fraction of a second when even one of these actions would take a second or so at least.

Well, again, in the opening post Duke is close enough to have taken Link's ocarina and step on it. He's most likely either not holding a gun yet or is holding it one handed. Link can pull a mortal draw in the time it would take Duke to either pull a gun or get far enough away that he won't be included in any blast radii.

If Duke really is that close then Nemesis has set Duke up to lose....

Not unless Duke has a close range weapon like a shotgun.

I dont see Duke winning if he starts off within range of a strike which Link can do quite quickly. If anything, this thread is based purely on luck, "maybe" as Link strikes Duke his finger, as often happens will pull the trigger and blow Links head away....before i would argue Dukes range gave him some advantage in this thread but since its confirmed not, his fate is in the hand of Zeus!

Originally posted by Burning thought
Average archer does it all in 3.5s from 0.2s RT, 1s draw, 2s notch and 0.3s aim/fire demonstrated in that vid. Peak can do it in 1.3s from 0.1s peak reactions, a few people say a pro can draw and notch in 1s, and aim/fire slightly faster then avrg at 0.2. Missed the point, when did I ever say a human can do it in 0.1s? Even better, dude can shoot 3 arrows in 1.5s with arrows in hand, thats 0.5s to react, notch and aim/fire. I assume it's 0.1, 0.2 and 0.2 respectively. Add another 0.2 for drawing and this guy can do the action in 0.7s. Probability and Logic Q: If a guy with peak human speed can fire an arrow in 0.7 seconds and another peak can fire a gun in 0.4 seconds, will a guy with superhuman speed with an arrow be faster? Note; this superhuman speed would only have to be 1.75x peak to equal his gun speed. Even without calcs the answers clear. For future references; stop missing my points. Never once claimed the PBoots increase his arm speed. Link is above peak human. I don't even need to claim 10x as even 2x is enough to make him fire faster then Duke. So very wrong: Duke has to react, move his arm to aim then pull the trigger. All three at peak are 0.1, 0.2 and 0.1 = 0.4s. FYI this is the holster shooting I linked to.. and it was 0.2s. <-cuts out the 0.2s arm movement. Avrg arrow = 3.5s. Peak arrow = 0.7s. Peak gun = 0.4. Superhuman arrow = easily faster than 0.4.

Not circular logic, just posing the same query you did. He's a copy of Link, has the same skills, techniques and battle style and shows no reason to suggest he thinks different to Link. If there is solid evidence I can't seem to find it, so show me if you will. Yay for using gameplay mechanics...

So time stops when he used it too as 'they wouldn't do it otherwise'? Good to know. Even after setting up Farore's Wind Link can use it instantly as they're not going to show the flashy moves over and over again... The only part in question is forming the orb and implanting it into himself. The other movements dont form, charge or do anything besides being flashy movements for special moves.

Explain how "It can block any and all attacks besides Ganon's strength" is a mechanic. Obvious indication is obvious. Over 0.2 is great reactions if youre a bit tired.. Peak RT is 0.1, average is 0.2, slower is 0.3. Prove that 0.2+ is average/good RT then suggest a reason why youre not even using peak RT.. 0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 0.2. "Reaction time is the elapsed time between the presentation of a sensory stimulus and the subsequent behavioral response" aka RT = time from event to react. Go find proof for everything you just said if youre so sure otherwise.

OBD summed it up nicely in which I agree; if you can dodge a 100m/s melee attack you can dodge a bullet at 3.4m. A 1cm thick vest-plate can block bullets, his thick shield will hold up fine as well. Slow in your eyes, and once up Duke is out of options for harming him.

How dare you.. my fan fictions only contain the female LoZ cast .....*ahem* Don't see how it will take Link a second or longer to do these actions when A) NL's form and insert is fast without arm waving, and B) how a human could do the other things in a second, let alone Link.