Darth Malgus runs a New Jedi order gauntlet

That's why he's a tank, tremendous damage soak his TK feats and lightning feats are scary, but Jedi are usually more subtle than Sith when using the force and would obviously (even if they were capable) not employ the force so brutally.

So while I can see him do that to some Jedi here, I don't see him doing it to the Jedi from 4 going down. And even the top 3 names would be cagey enough to make him sweat out a hard victory.

Remember - a true Jedi uses the force for knowledge and defense.

Also many of these Jedi have fought force entities, multiple opponents at a time etc that would conceivably have beat Malgus if he was put in the same scenarios.

So yeah, while he's uberz, some of these guys are uberz too and far more crafty in some instances due to the Jedi's emphasis on defense.

Also Katarn, Jacen and Jaden are noted powerful dark side force users as are Luke (if you count emerald lightning) and Cade. So dark side mastery alone from Malgus doesn't give him an automatic win.

Originally posted by ares834
Then he loses at 1. Hard.

The only Jedi I´m almost sure Malgus would beat are Jaden, Kam and Cade. Corran may lose as well because he probably has no defense against telekinesis. But the rest would beat him. Actually, Jacen, Luke, Katarn and Kyp would beat him pretty easily.

Originally posted by JediMaster97
The only Jedi I´m almost sure Malgus would beat are Jaden, Kam and Cade. Corran may lose as well because he probably has no defense against telekinesis. But the rest would beat him. Actually, Jacen, Luke, Katarn and Kyp would beat him pretty easily.

Observe what kind of opponent Malgus overwhelmed during his early days: http://www.swtor.com/info/media/trailers/return

This opponent is Jedi Master Kao Cen Darach. Darach is evidently not just immensely proficient in Jedi dueling arts but also a formidable Force-user (no shortcomings to boot). And yet?

Satele's personal revelation of this encounter:

"There in the hanger I encountered the most dangerous embodiment of the dark side I have experienced - the man who would be later known as Darth Malgus. Malgus and his master must've sensed our presence. They landed their interceptor in the hanger entrance, blocking our escape, and the two Sith rushed to confront us. I had engaged in hundreds of practice duels with my fellow padawans, but nothing prepared me for the sheer ferocity of the Sith. Darth Malgus would have killed me then and there were it not for Master Kao." (The Journal of Master Gnost Dural)

Satele also pointed out that Darach was very calm and collected throughout this event while she was much less emotionally stable.

Several years later, Malgus encountered Satele once again on Aldeeran. This time, Satele possessed incredible command of the Force and was also a superb duelist: http://www.swtor.com/info/media/trailers/hope-cinematic-trailer

And yet:

"I had dreaded the possibility of another confrontation with Malgus, and my life was nearly forfeit again on this occasion. It was only the determination and strength of Captain Malcom that prevented it from happening. Together though, we managed to defeat Darth Malgus and left him for the dead, beneath a mountain of rubble." (The Journal of Master Gnost Dural)

So even a Force-user of Satele's calibre is below Malgus?

Now even after enduring an incredibly potent blast of power from Satele which shattered a portion of a large cliff, Malgus not just survived but proceeded to fight again on the same damn planet not long afterwards. This time, Malgus encountered two Jedi (one of them evidently matched Vader or Marek in Force abilities) and still won. Keep in mind that Malgus was heavily injured during this encounter and he still had a lot left in him.

Several years later, Malgus wreaked havoc inside the mighty Jedi Temple by contributing to its destruction with his Force abilities and killing many Jedi inside.

----

Malgus is too damn powerful for anyone barring Luke. In-fact, Malgus would hold his own against Luke even if he eventually looses.

Originally posted by Allankles
That's why he's a tank, tremendous damage soak his TK feats and lightning feats are scary, but Jedi are usually more subtle than Sith when using the force and would obviously (even if they were capable) not employ the force so brutally.

Originally posted by Allankles
So while I can see him do that to some Jedi here, I don't see him doing it to the Jedi from 4 going down. And even the top 3 names would be cagey enough to make him sweat out a hard victory.

Remember - a true Jedi uses the force for knowledge and defense.

Apart from Luke, no one in your list holds a candle to Malgus. The latter have history of beating some perfectly competent Force-users.

Originally posted by Allankles
Also many of these Jedi have fought force entities, multiple opponents at a time etc that would conceivably have beat Malgus if he was put in the same scenarios.

---

Force entities you say? Which ones? I recall UnuThul and Abeloth owning anybody barring Luke. The latter would have killed even Luke but lost due to PIS.

Multiple opponents you say? Maybe you are too much unaware of Malgus's capabilities.

Originally posted by Allankles
So yeah, while he's uberz, some of these guys are uberz too and far more crafty in some instances due to the Jedi's emphasis on defense.

Originally posted by Allankles
Also Katarn, Jacen and Jaden are noted powerful dark side force users as are Luke (if you count emerald lightning) and Cade. So dark side mastery alone from Malgus doesn't give him an automatic win.

Originally posted by JediMaster97
The only Jedi I´m almost sure Malgus would beat are Jaden, Kam and Cade. Corran may lose as well because he probably has no defense against telekinesis. But the rest would beat him. Actually, Jacen, Luke, Katarn and Kyp would beat him pretty easily.

Yeah, no. The only ones who pose a threat to Malgus are the Skywalkers and Rhysode.

What has Jedi Jacen done that makes you think he could take Malgus? And given how easily Caedus beat Katarn he'd lose too. Kyp is dumb and you should feel dumb.

Originally posted by Allankles
😛

Hmm?

If Rhysode is in his army soloing mode. Malgus doesn't stand a chance.

Rhysode can beat Malgus which is the reason he's here. I wouldn't put Jedi who could be dismissed quick like Kenth Hamner, et al.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Really?

Really?

Apart from Luke, no one in your list holds a candle to Malgus. The latter have history of beating some perfectly competent Force-users.

Everyone of these guys has experience. A lot of these guys were fighting in the first galactic civil war, you know - that brutal campaign that thinned out the Empire to 8 sectors of space.

And Luke isn't the only one who would beat or have a chance of beating Malgus. Jacen Solo is a gifted force user with tons of esoteric knowledge. Katarn - I actually consider him one of the least here - took down 7 dark Jedi by his lonesome on Ruusan. Yeah he got whooped by Caedus but any Jedi not trying to be brutal towards a fellow Jedi would lose similarly. These things are not so black and white.

Who else - Korr is actually more gifted in the force than Katarn and has defeated Tavion (an ascended mortal via Waru) who had the sceptre of Ragnos. Not to mention the Sith spirit of Ragnos as well as force entity who would have crushed Malgus to be honest - s/he almost crushed Korr actually while he was going through some kind of crisis of conscience over his use of dark side powers.

Kyp Durron - is also a force powerhouse and experienced Jedi of several wars - Civil war, 2nd civil war, Vong crisis etc His force power has been demonstrated to be equal to any top tier.

Who else? These guys are all powerhouses do a read up.

Even Luke by the 2nd Civil War could be beat by some guys in his order. Every stable competent generation like Luke's has Jedi that can beat top tiers. Some of the guys these people have taken out could beat Luke outright and vice versa.

Things plateau, younger Jedi catch up to masters and even develop force powers unique to themselves. Malgus would have to be better than we've ever seen him to clear imv.

You know theres an edit button.

And yeah these guys are good. That doesn't mean they can beat Malgus though.

I hear u. 'Good enough' is enough for a Jedi. They tend to do more with less and these guys have more than 'less'. 5 jedi prodigies is nothing to sniff at.

Originally posted by Allankles
Everyone of these guys has experience. A lot of these guys were fighting in the first galactic civil war, you know - that brutal campaign that thinned out the Empire to 8 sectors of space.

Originally posted by Allankles
And Luke isn't the only one who would beat or have a chance of beating Malgus. Jacen Solo is a gifted force user with tons of esoteric knowledge. Katarn - I actually consider him one of the least here - took down 7 dark Jedi by his lonesome on Ruusan. Yeah he got whooped by Caedus but any Jedi not trying to be brutal towards a fellow Jedi would lose similarly. These things are not so black and white.

Malgus cut down a Dooku level (or possibly superior) opponent when he was young; watch SWTOR Return trailer. Later on, he subdued additional powerhouses including Satele, Leenar and a Zabrak (who collapsed two buildings around Malgus's position in an effort to crush him). In the nutshell, Malgus have hugely impressive combat performance in his favor.

Katarn's feat doesn't holds a candle to Malgus's performance inside the Jedi Temple.

Originally posted by Allankles
Who else - Korr is actually more gifted in the force than Katarn and has defeated Tavion (an ascended mortal via Waru) who had the sceptre of Ragnos. Not to mention the Sith spirit of Ragnos as well as force entity who would have crushed Malgus to be honest - s/he almost crushed Korr actually while he was going through some kind of crisis of conscience over his use of dark side powers.

Originally posted by Allankles
Kyp Durron - is also a force powerhouse and experienced Jedi of several wars - Civil war, 2nd civil war, Vong crisis etc His force power has been demonstrated to be equal to any top tier.

Originally posted by Allankles
Who else? These guys are all powerhouses do a read up.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
They don't have any advantage over Malgus in experience department. In-fact, Sidious believes that Malgus's battlefield exploits have never been duplicated. Sidious have extreme standards so I respect his assessment about Malgus and expect you to do the same.

Sidious word is not law, nor does it represent a complete assessment of all force users. That sounds like Malgus is a "dog of war" type, impressive but nothing the universe hasn't seen before or after in terms of terriers of war.

Freedon Nadd, Ragnos, Kun, hell even his enemies like Windu (Dantooine) and Yoda would all be worthy of the same praise.

Not to mention his assessment doesn't include the NJO who have arguably faced the most gruelling barbaric stretch of war the sw universe has seen so far.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Jacen have some credibility but not enough to declare him a match for Malgus. Have he subdued any notably powerful opponent (excluding his Caedus incarnation)?

He's untested against Sith but he's fought slayers, Shimra in a gravity platform et al. Enough to show us that he's not a push over which is all a Jedi needs to contend with another Jedi. Not to mention he's still Jacen as Caedus so...

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Malgus cut down a Dooku level (or possibly superior) opponent when he was young; watch SWTOR Return trailer. Later on, he subdued additional powerhouses including Satele, Leenar and a Zabrak (who collapsed two buildings around Malgus's position in an effort to crush him). In the nutshell, Malgus have hugely impressive combat performance in his favor.

A lot of people that have power have been cut down by lesser guys, its how you use your power that counts. So there have been plenty that could be casually Dooku level but few are Dooku poised, Dooku smart. Dooku would be a favorite for me against Malgus, simply because I think he's more cunning.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Katarn's feat doesn't holds a candle to Malgus's performance inside the Jedi Temple.

You're right, none of those guys are a much for Jerec and his zealots.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Translation: Korr's victory is circumstantial. Ragnos was not in his prime condition during this event so I overlook this development.

Translation: Jaden is a Jedi Master, there is no coincidence with the force he followed the living force to victory. That's what makes a master a master, he can use circumstance, situation, opportunity, time and space to defeat any opponent, even opponents far in excess of Malgus in power.

Malgus would not intimidate or awe Korr one bit, when it came down to it and a contest of mastery would ensue. Is Malgus the greater master? He might have great power, but what of his intellect, his knowledge of the subtleties of force. Jaden is fundamentally sound without glaring flaws in his mastery of combat based techniques. He stuck close to the basics allowing him to master core powers instead of spreading himself thin.

He was beating Empire Reborn Jedi and ex proctors (mature, schooled Imperial aligned Jedi imbued with Sceptre power) as a 14 year old for heavens sake, the guy is a prodigy of soughts.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Yes, he is legitimate. However, can you list down his most impressive performances?

I already have, not only is he a quick read, he's also very clinical in the clutch. Facing a Ragnos possessed dark side elite at 14 is nuts. I'm not surprised writers didn't know what to do with him after. Plus he's quick, more mobile, more agile, strong physically (not as Malgus but peak human) and in the force.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Satele, Darach, Leener and another aren't lesser powerhouses in comparison to the any of the Jedi you have mentioned such as Durron, Katarn, Jacen and Korr. In-fact, existing evidence favors the former 4 over the latter 4 in some ways.

I beg to differ, by actual feats of power and combat the NJO are better off. They've been in wars even more vicious and faced dangers more oppressive to be honest than the old school Jedi-Sith guys.

Originally posted by Allankles
Translation: Jaden is a Jedi Master, there is no coincidence with the force he followed the living force to victory. That's what makes a master a master, he can use circumstance, situation, opportunity, time and space to defeat any opponent, even opponents far in excess of Malgus in power.

Don't be stupid. Jaden can't defeat any opponent, certainly not any in excess of Malgus.

Originally posted by Allankles
Malgus would not intimidate or awe Korr one bit, when it came down to it and a contest of mastery would ensue. Is Malgus the greater master? He might have great power, but what of his intellect, his knowledge of the subtleties of force. Jaden is fundamentally without glaring flaws in his mastery of combat based techniques. He was beating Empire Reborn Jedi and ex proctors as a 14 year old for heavens sake, the guy is a prodigy of soughts.

I'm pretty sure Jaden was older than 14.

And yes, Malgus is the greater master. He submitted utterly to the darkside and became almost unstoppable. His understanding of the darkside is astoundingly deep. In terms of his abilities in combat he is by far Jaden's superior.

Where are you getting this info on Korr? He has no flaws in his technique? Wtf? I've rarely seen such wanking of a character.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I've rarely seen such wanking of a character.

You should reacquaint yourself with your own post history, with emphasis on certain keywords: "Bane," "Nihilus," "Vitiate," and anything from TOR.

Or read anything by S_W_LeGenD.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Don't be stupid. Jaden can't defeat any opponent, certainly not any in excess of Malgus.

😕 He already did, a Rakatan force entity.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I'm pretty sure Jaden was older than 14.

The Ragnos Crisis happened in one year, 14 ABY. Making him 14...😱 Talk about a baptism of fire - I know.

The guy would be considered a prodigy in any era.

Originally posted by Nephthys
And yes, Malgus is the greater master. He submitted utterly to the darkside and became almost unstoppable. His understanding of the darkside is astoundingly deep. In terms of his abilities in combat he is by far Jaden's superior.

Where are you getting this info on Korr? He has no flaws in his technique? Wtf? I've rarely seen such wanking of a character.

Devoting yourself to the dark side is flawed and makes you weak kneed in time, and the greater the devotion the harder the fall. The dark side is the path to oblivion. As Yoda said - war not make one great. The Sith hybrids were superior to these other wanabes since their sith bloodlines were genetically adapted to the dark side and sith magic, human just get weak kneed over time.

The Jedi are older than the Sith and also wiser.

I said he had no glaring flaws seen by his handling or the Rakatan entities abnormal force strength, protecting himself with TK to the point where for all its power it couldn't quite crush him.

I didn't say he was flawless. And wanking a character once in a while isn't a crime, especially when its deserved. SW has few level headed Jedi as gifted as this guy, many go dark side or are overbearing Gary stus. At least Korr isn't among them, so yeah he's also likeable.

Originally posted by Allankles
😕 He already did, a Rakatan force entity.

And why exactly is this Rakatan entity so powerful that you'd think that its better than Malgus? From what I'm reading on Wookieepedia Jaden was helpless against it and needed his friends to distract it to wound it. And even then he ran because he knew he couldn't beat it.

Originally posted by Allankles
The Ragnos Crisis happened in one year, 14 ABY. Making him 14...😱 Talk about a baptism of fire - I know.

The guy would be considered a prodigy in any era.

Thats stupid.

Originally posted by Allankles
Devoting yourself to the dark side is flawed and makes you weak kneed in time, and the greater the devotion the harder the fall. The dark side is the path to oblivion. As Yoda said - war not make one great. The Sith hybrids were superior to these other wanabes since their sith bloodlines were genetically adapted to the dark side and sith magic, human just get weak kneed over time.

Riiiight, except that didn't happen. When Malgus embraced the darkside in Deception his power vastly increased and he went from evenly duelling Aryn Leneer to comfortably stomping her.

That genetics things is also dumb and not true.

Originally posted by Allankles
I said he had no glaring flaws seen by his handling or the Rakatan entities abnormal force strength, protecting himself with TK to the point where for all its power it couldn't quite crush him.

That doesn't mean that he has no flaws in his combat technique. And even then that doesn't mean that Malgus can't still defeat him by simply being more powerful than he is or dominating him in lightsaber combat.

Originally posted by Nephthys
And why exactly is this Rakatan entity so powerful that you'd think that its better than Malgus? From what I'm reading on Wookieepedia Jaden was helpless against it and needed his friends to distract it to wound it. And even then he ran because he knew he couldn't beat it.

It was something of a force god, or celestial or whatever. It couldn't be killed by his lightsaber, he even got a good swing at it and it dismissed the huge gash across its chest. No lightsaber or force technique could affect it, it would simply heal and proceed to one man army rape any force sensitve.

So Malgus being a flesh and blood type would have been pinned and dropped if he came at this thing. Retreat was the only course. Considering another flesh and blood type could subdue him with TK, I wouldn't count Malgus as the best guy to take this thing. It could use the force on a galactic scale, it just needed to escape with its host, but Faal blew up the station.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Thats stupid.

Eeh! Just cause you don't like it... He wasn't just some normal Jedi, for pete's sake. Even the opening scrawl tells u that.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Riiiight, except that didn't happen. When Malgus embraced the darkside in Deception his power vastly increased and he went from evenly duelling Aryn Leneer to comfortably stomping her.

My argument isn't that Malgus can't beat Korr, it's that I don't see him doing it for the majority, given the intangibles here. Which are that Korr is faster, more agile and is stronger in the force than the likes of Leneer. He is also pretty proficient in some dark side combat techniques unlike Leneer or most every Jedi Malgus dueled.

Originally posted by Nephthys
That genetics things is also dumb and not true.

It's proven true for every potent dark side adept who's not a member of the Sith species. While I don't believe the DS is inherently evil, it is chaotic and destructive. Therefore anyone who makes the huge error of putting their faith in it, is basically doomed to fail. Vader understood this in the end and got out of the mess, saving his identity in the force.

Originally posted by Nephthys
That doesn't mean that he has no flaws in his combat technique. And even then that doesn't mean that Malgus can't still defeat him by simply being more powerful than he is or dominating him in lightsaber combat.

I didn't say he had no flaws, I said 3 decades of training and fighting have ironed out any glaring flaws in his technique. He's never even lost a fight, despite nearly dying in Riptide. The worst he ever got was losing focus and getting his fingers severed, apart from that - he could have ended the fight with force lightning too, but chose to continue the lightsaber duel and avoid relying on the dark side.

He's basically like a better version of Revan imv, with less baggage and less ego.