Strange Visitor Superman vs TOBA Hulk

Originally posted by Stoic
Sure it does until stated otherwise . I never said stronger. I said the same.

Ok,or even the same. And no, we don't. Because we have no idea on the future versions - this is a consistent forum logic.

Are they the same? No idea. Otherwise, you might as well assume alt. Universe characters are all the same until proven otherwise - Injustice Superman is the same as Earth 1 until proven otherwise, and all his feats (pushing Mogo, the Guardians etc into the Sun etc ) are the same as if canon Superman did theM.

DCeased Superman is exactly the same.

Even Red Son Supeman. He moved ' ten times faster than thought' when going up against a GL (Hal, no less). Up until he crash landed in the USSR, EVERYTHING in the Red Son universe was the same.

We don't give each other their feats, even when not shown explicitly.

TOBA is a 616 version of the Hulk. He isn't from an alternate universe like Injustice Superman. He's shares the very same past as Immortal Hulk who was vomit stricken by the Abomination meat puppet. It only becomes an alternate future because Hulk somehow chooses to walk the path of complete destruction. Tell you what, why don't you jump on over to the TOAA vs TOBA thread and attempt to invalidate it.

Injustice had the exact same past as Earth 1 Supes, up until he killed the Joker.

Marvel Zombies shared it's past with pre-Galactus Marvel. Should I draw feats from there as well, Stoic?

bum superman still wins

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Ok,or even the same. And no, we don't. Because we have no idea on the future versions - this is a consistent forum logic.

Are they the same? No idea. Otherwise, you might as well assume alt. Universe characters are all the same until proven otherwise - Injustice Superman is the same as Earth 1 until proven otherwise, and all his feats (pushing Mogo, the Guardians etc into the Sun etc ) are the same as if canon Superman did theM.

DCeased Superman is exactly the same.

Even Red Son Supeman. He moved ' ten times faster than thought' when going up against a GL (Hal, no less). Up until he crash landed in the USSR, EVERYTHING in the Red Son universe was the same.

We don't give each other their feats, even when not shown explicitly.

Was it you that applied the Mad Celestials' vulnerability to a certain attack to 616 Celestials?

It was me.

Because Reed said it was a weakness of Celestials. Not Mad Celestials specifically 🙂

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It was me.

Because Reed said it was a weakness of Celestials. Not Mad Celestials specifically 🙂

An alternate Reed says this.

Did he say it was specific to the Mad Celestials? Simple question.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Did he say it was specific to the Mad Celestials? Simple question.

No more than he extends it to all Celestials in all realities. 616 Reed is oblivious to this notion. Why would that be?

Originally posted by TheHulkster
No more than he extends it to all Celestials in all realities. 616 Reed is oblivious to this notion. Why would that be?

In another thread, it is being argued that this Surfer is no more that mainstream Surfer. Do you disagree?

He says: 'convenient when Celestials bleed energy'. Not 'these Celestials' or any specifics attached.

So yes, all Celestials in all realities.

In another thread, I am arguing that yes it's an alternate Surfer and thus...... different. Proof can also be seen in Thanos' words, that Young Thanos has NEVER met a guy like this before.

Iow, different.

Sorry Hulkster, you're not nearly as clever as you try to make out.

Edit: you've removed the Surfer reference. Now why would that be?

Apologies, the words were 'damned effective when Celestials bleed energy'.

Could work. Very good chance. But still alt Celestials i guess.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Could work. Very good chance. But still alt Celestials i guess.

But as said, Celestials bleed energy. It is common across all Celestials - no defining specifications were given.

It's like saying humans bleed haemoglobin- then you saying actually, we don't know if Flashpoint Thomas Wayne bleeds like Bruce Wayne. Because alt. human.

Therefore, Thomas Wayne is immune to Magneto's powers.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
He says: 'convenient when Celestials bleed energy'. Not 'these Celestials' or any specifics attached.

So yes, all Celestials in all realities.

In another thread, I am arguing that yes it's an alternate Surfer and thus...... different. Proof can also be seen in Thanos' words, that Young Thanos has NEVER met a guy like this before.

Iow, different.

Sorry Hulkster, you're not nearly as clever as you try to make out.

Edit: you've removed the Surfer reference. Now why would that be?

That reference was meant for another thread.

Of Course, your first answer is milarky.. Nothing quantitative is given one way or the other and his targets are alternate Celestials. His frame of reference is his native universe and the Reed who would most know about 616 Celestials is unfamiliar with any such attack.

You referenced alternate Celestials to low-ball 616 Celestials.

And it's not about bleeding energy. Antimonitor bleeds energy. Every similar type being bleeds energy. It's his reference to effectiveness. That's based on alts.

Except aren't they a part of the Council of Reed's, and thus has encountered more than one Universe's worth of Celestials?

In any case, the sentence still stands. Effective when Celestials bleed energy.

Not a low-ball when it's a defining trait, any more so than saying humans bleed blood is somehow low-ballling.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But as said, Celestials bleed energy. It is common across all Celestials - no defining specifications were given.

It's like saying humans bleed haemoglobin- then you saying actually, we don't know if Flashpoint Thomas Wayne bleeds like Bruce Wayne. Because alt. human.

Therefore, Thomas Wayne is immune to Magneto's powers.

Originally posted by TheHulkster
And it's not about bleeding energy. Antimonitor bleeds energy. Every similar type being bleeds energy. It's his reference to effectiveness. That's based on alts.

Erm....Anti monitor bleeds entropy.

The Entropy gun works against energy, fullstop. It would work against anything that bled energy.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Ure comparing real life humans to Celestials. Bro... For one theyre comicbook characters. Second they are pretty up there in the enigmatic scale as comicbook beings go. Saying this before u go comparing comic humans to Celestials... Im just affording them the same conditions as far as alt characters go. I wouldnt mind if u say they are roughly the same level as 616 Celestials, but i wouldnt give a straight pass when it comes to specific things like this situation.

Agreed.