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Originally posted by carver9
Pure strength, I will give it to Hulk any day of the week. Anything outside of this is pretty much even and I'm referring to the average Superman and the average Hulk.

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Originally posted by h1a8
Pure strength is irrelevant since Superman has the greater lifting feats and faster movement speeds which translates to harder punches.
On average Superman will physically decimate characters like Namor or Thing. Yet on average Hulk doesn't. Don't get me wrong, Hulk at peak would decimate those characters too. But we are speaking of averages. So by pure strength or flight Superman is above Hulk on average but both at their best is a different story.

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Originally posted by carver9
On average Hulk would destroy Kalibak Nd beat people like Despero, Konvikt, and the General. This doesn't prove anything when debating for these characters. Pure strength fts that doesn't require anything else outside of lifting, I would give it to Hulk.

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Originally posted by Igniz
Without Flight, Superman would be dangling in space the way the Hulk did at one time.However I would say that Superman's feats of moving objects in space involves more powers than just one.I would say strength,speed,durability and flight.Of all this 4, flight would be the most important.

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Originally posted by h1a8
Superman CAN amp his punches with flight. His flight has been proven to provide forward force (like moving planets) and carrying heavy things. And since he doesn't use flight when lifting things while standing on the ground we can say that flight can only aide and amp Superman when he is carrying or moving things in flight.

But since flight is part of Superman's power set then for all practical purposes he can use it to amp his punches in any fight. So it's irrelevant and moot to the discussion whether flight amps his punches or not. Thor can use Mjolnir when he fights, it amps his strikes. So what?

As far as this thread goes, on average, Superman probably punches a little harder than Hulk. But at their best (no sun amp) WBH probably wins, unless you want to use time-space shit (I don't).

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Originally posted by carver9
Pure strength, I will give it to Hulk any day of the week. Anything outside of this is pretty much even and I'm referring to the average Superman and the average Hulk.

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Originally posted by carver9
On average Hulk would destroy Kalibak Nd beat people like Despero, Konvikt, and the General. This doesn't prove anything when debating for these characters. Pure strength fts that doesn't require anything else outside of lifting, I would give it to Hulk.

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Originally posted by psycho gundam
fool's gold

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Originally posted by -Pr-


He can amp his punches by increasing his speed. Simply hovering alone wouldn't do it.

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Originally posted by h1a8
True, I was referring to punching while flying forward and not while hovering.

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Originally posted by h1a8

On average Superman will physically decimate characters like Namor or Thing.

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Originally posted by -Pr-
That's something anyon can do, though. Just substitute running for flyinng.

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Originally posted by h1a8
I'm not sure. I have to think about it.

For example, let Superman hover next to a tank where he has both his hands on the tank while his arms are bent to push. Superman can easily push a tank forward with flight only while keeping his arms bent (not using his arm muscles at all). Now if Superman pushed the tank again with flight but ALSO pushed with his arms at the same time (straightening them in the push) then it would be clearly with more force than the former.

I think you are referring to building up extra momentum from a head start distance when I'm referring to punching something at a dead start (from up close). Having flight push you forward while punching provides an extra forward force, not just extra momentum. It's like you throwing a punch at someone while I from behind push you forward with my force.

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Originally posted by carver9
Not stupid, you are just going "over" the point.

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Originally posted by h1a8
I'm not sure. I have to think about it.

For example, let Superman hover next to a tank where he has both his hands on the tank while his arms are bent to push. Superman can easily push a tank forward with flight only while keeping his arms bent (not using his arm muscles at all). Now if Superman pushed the tank again with flight but ALSO pushed with his arms at the same time (straightening them in the push) then it would be clearly with more force than the former.

I think you are referring to building up extra momentum from a head start distance when I'm referring to punching something at a dead start (from up close). Having flight push you forward while punching provides an extra forward force, not just extra momentum. It's like you throwing a punch at someone while I from behind push you forward with my force.

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Originally posted by carver9
On average Hulk would destroy Kalibak Nd beat people like Despero, Konvikt, and the General. This doesn't prove anything when debating for these characters. Pure strength fts that doesn't require anything else outside of lifting, I would give it to Hulk.

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Originally posted by PillarofOsiris

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Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Hmmmm.

Can the Flash replicate what Superman does? Say if you had a massive weight...500tons or so....I highly doubt that the Flash could push it along as easily as Superman. Or at least, it has never been depicted to that extent.

And seeing as both their thrusts are near enough equal (as seen by their races), it must be the power of Supes' arms which enable him to do those feats of strength.

Or am I being stupid?

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Originally posted by -Pr-
you would have to prove that Superman's flight gives him any more assistance than say his shoulder, his back or his leg when he throws a punch.

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Originally posted by Igniz
Superman's feats of moving objects in space involves more powers than just one.I would say strength,speed,durability and flight.Of all this 4, flight would be the most important.

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Originally posted by -Pr-
If I didn't have legs I'd have to use my arms to pull me around...