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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » Star Wars Versus Forum » Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-droma vs Darth Malak and Darth Revan


Who wins?
You do not have permission to vote on this poll.
Kun and Ulic win easily 12 60.00%
Kun and Ulic barely win 1 5.00%
Revan and Malak win easily 2 10.00%
Revan and Malak barely win 5 25.00%
Total: 20 votes 100%
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Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-droma vs Darth Malak and Darth Revan
Started by: w00t2112

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IKC
Antediluvian

Registered: Oct 2005
Location:


 

Yeah, exactly. Question mark.


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Old Post Feb 18th, 2006 07:44 AM
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Deception
Ancient Dark Lord

Registered: Dec 2005
Location: Somewhere unknown


 

lol rofl my bad smile


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Old Post Feb 18th, 2006 08:18 AM
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Fishy
Senior Member

Registered: Mar 2005
Location: The Netherlands


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by IKC ]I'm going to go over the mountain of assumptions you've made to get to your point, Fishy.


You do that.

quote:
1. assumption. The person who did it was a Jedi, not a "Sith" as Revan was when they dueled for the title of Dark Lord. You have no proof that it was Revan.


Revan wasn't called a Sith until after he returned at the head of an invasion fleet, Malak could have lost his jaw already then.

quote:
2 assumptions. That's nonsense. Kavar was the leader of the Jedi Guardians, a Jedi council member, and Malak's superior before he went to fight the Mandalorian Wars. Because the one who cut off Malak's jaw was said to be a Jedi, and Kavar was among the best lightsaber duelists and confronted Malak personally, it is reasonable to believe that Kavar did it.


The only one making an assumption here is you, you have no idea how powerful Kavar is compared to Malak and yet you claim that he was able to stand up to him. This is based on absolutely nothing. And if you want to blame me for using assumptions then you would be wise not to make them yourself.

quote:
...Have you not been paying attention? A Jedi did it, not a Sith.


If you would read the rest of my post you would know why I said this. If Malak was wounded by a Jedi he would need medical aid, no Jedi would give him this, and no Sith would have let him live if he was mortally wounded. Simple as that.

quote:
Again, a Jedi did it.


Again assumption being debated here. However the point I made with that point, was still that Revan was the only sith that was or became higher in rank then Malak, so he was the only one that had a reason to let Malak live, any other Sith would have wanted him dead.

quote:
...for the title of Dark Lord, ergo they were already "Sith."


where they? How would you call somebody that has not left the Jedi and hasn't been made a sith yet? Ah thats right a Jedi. A Jedi did it, doesn't indicate anything. It could have been a million jedi and it could have been jedi that became Sith two hours later.

quote:

The circumstances of their encounter were never described.


Well we know he ran away. If somebody loses his jaw and with that the ability to breath he isn't going to last very long now is he? So why would Kavar run? What could possibly have made Kavar run away after cutting of Malak his jaw, you come up with a logical explanation for it. Because I can not come up with one thats likely.

quote:

Absence of proof is proof of absence?


There is nothing to indicate that Kavar lost the fight because he was unable to continue fighting. If he was able to continue fighting and Malak was wounded like that, then he probably would have continued and he would have killed Malak.

quote:
3 assumptions. Nobody knows the circumstances of their fight! Why in God's name do you, then, assume that Malak had no backup?


Because both he and Kavar survived.

If a Sith was there then they would have either, chased Kavar when he started running to kill the weakened Kavar, and the most powerful of them would very likely have killed Malak.

quote:
Any sign of weakness? What the hell are you talking about? The Sith were not backstabbing each other constantly or else they'd never have put up an actual fight to the Republic.


Of course they wouldn't have done so constantly, but its made very clear on Korriban that if you have the chance to kill your superior and take over from him that you do so, kill him take over and become the new whatever he was. Of course you don't do this for every rank sometimes its easier to earn it, but special ranks. (head of the accademy, apprentice of the Dark Lord, Dark Lord)... Just look at how Malak took Revan his title, he wasn't more powerful. He bombarded Revan his ship and took his title. That shows they backstab when they have the chance.

quote:
4 assumptions. You have no idea what the circumstances of the fight were but you inject ridiculous extrapolations from wildly different scenarios to predict someone's behavior, and ergo assume that they must not have been there? Nonsense.


I'm just stating a few possibility's, I tried to make that clear by putting it all in a list. However that obviously escaped you. And again how is this ridiculious, I have already proved that the Sith would have killed him if they were there, they would have killed Kavar as well. Unless a Sith that would want Malak to live was there, and that could only have been Revan, but if Revan was there when Kavar cut of Malak his jaw, would Kavar really have survived?

quote:
What?

5 assumptions, now? How the hell would you know if Revan was watching the fight? Nothing is known about the confrontation, Fishy, save this: Kavar confronted Malak, and was forced to retreat. The circumstances other than that very vague guideline are unknown.


I'm trying to find out what happened there, and like I already said. There is no way Sith would have let him live, there is no way the Sith would have let Kavar retreat. Malak needed medical help and he would have needed it fast.

quote:
If "one could argue that there were Jedi there" then one can argue that some faux Sith were there, too. If Malak can stand up to the best of them, what makes you think they would have killed him?


What makes me think they would have killed Malak? He was mortally wounded... Malak would never have been able to fight his best if he was able to fight at all, it would be far easier and every self respecting Sith would have tried to take Malak out there and then but they didn't. Every Jedi that could have been there would have tried to take out Malak as well after Kavar cut of his jaw. Logical conclusion there were no other Jedi and Sith present when Malak lost his jaw if he lost his jaw in a fight against Kavar.

quote:
Actually, this part of your post is nearly incoherent at second glance. What the hell are you talking about?


Posting drunk sucks, anyways the point is. If Malak lost his jaw against Kavar then there wouldn't have been any other Jedi and Sith there. Kavar would have ran away when he could have killed Malak, which makes no sense. So the most logical conclusion is that Malak didn't lose his jaw in a fight against Kavar.

quote:
Actually he was said to have been forced to retreat. 6 assumptions, now. The circumstances are unknown!


Yet you assume Kavar cut of his jaw, with no evidence supporting it at all. Except for one quote which can be seen in a lot of different ways.

quote:
It is known that a Jedi did it. If it wasn't Kavar, that knocks Malak down a few notches.


Unless of course it was Revan. Who is as far as we know the only one that ever bested Malak, the only we are sure of is powerful enough, the only one with a reason and the power to let Malak live, and we know the two fought before.

With Kavar all we have is. A Jedi cut of Malak his jaw, Kavar fought Malak, Kavar is the best lightsaber user of the Jedi.

Far less evidence supporting Kavar, logical conclusion it was Revan. Unless you can come up with a good reason why it was Kavar.


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Old Post Feb 18th, 2006 10:28 AM
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Brotz
Te Darasuum Mand'alor

Registered: Dec 2005
Location: United States


 

Kavar is the best lightsaber user of the Jedi? Have we all forgotten about Vrook? I hate to say this, he might be annoying, but his temper makes his Juyo technique quite effective.

Old Post Feb 19th, 2006 11:42 PM
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Fishy
Senior Member

Registered: Mar 2005
Location: The Netherlands


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Brotz
Kavar is the best lightsaber user of the Jedi? Have we all forgotten about Vrook? I hate to say this, he might be annoying, but his temper makes his Juyo technique quite effective.


We don't know if he used Juyo... Seeing as it depends on the game you play.

We don't know if he was stronger then Kavar, but everybody constantly says Kavar is the best lightsaber user of the Jedi, so he probably is the best lightsaber fighter in the Jedi Order. No evidence to support Vrook except for gameplay stuff which isn't canon.


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Old Post Feb 19th, 2006 11:45 PM
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