The one-off use of the word "omega" in 1986, "Class Omega Contact" about Rachel. Nimrod is not referring to the later defined Alpha, Beta, Epsilon system used by Apocalypse, nor is he alluding to the same meaning as was written in 2001. [img=http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/9538/11yd0.th.jpg]
Nimrod identified non-mutants as "Contacts." Which means the classification used, applied not only to mutants but to non-mutants as well. And therefore the use of the phrase "Class Omega Contact" does not hold the same meaning as the use of the word "omega" in the context of mutants exclusively 15 years subsequently.
Myth: Apocalypse under normal conditions has substantive telepathy, equal to or surpassing Charles Xavier
Firstly I'll repost verbatim some of the incidents used to justify this myth:
- The first thing to note is that incidents 1, 2 and 5, do not entail any telepathy whatsoever (1 being techno/telekinesis, 2 and 5 being telekinesis) are therefore irrelevant and will not be discussed any further.
- Secondly, incident 7 never occurred at all and therefore will not be discussed any further.
- Therefore let's examine the cases that may have telepathic basis: #3, 4, 6, 8 and 9.
- We'll begin with this one as it's the simplest. Apocalypse did not telepathically mind control the Inhumans. They were suborned via brainwashing. The brainwashing is a technological process rather than a telepathic one as depicted here - as baby Cable is resisting the technological suborning process.
- First thing to note is to refer to her as Phoenix is somewhat disingenuous. Jean Grey did not have access to the Phoenix Force at all between X-Factor v1 #65 until New X-Men #120.
- Secondly this is not a feat of any actual active telepathy. Jean Grey is not telepathically attacked, she has her own telepathic attack reflected back at her. It is rather a feat of mental defense.
- Thirdly the on-panel dialogue alludes to Apocalypse lacking telepathy whatsoever as he reacts to it as something he has yet to encounter. "So you have the power to see into men's minds, to influence them... to control them. Surely, there is no power greater than that. This is something I shall prepare for!" This apparent lack of telepathy will be discussed further below.
- Lastly, these mental defenses have been depicted in a less favourable light against Jean Grey.
- This is Apocalypse only possible feat of offensive telepathy and the first thing to note is this isn't conclusively telepathy. I can't recall ever seeing telepathy accompanied by a sound effect such as the "Zrak." in this scan. The energy of the attack surrounds Xavier's upper body not just his head and it could simply be an energy blast.
- Secondly this is not Apocalypse under normal conditions, this is Apocalypse amplified by a Celestial device drawing upon the power of the Twelve and Nate Grey.
- Thirdly, Xavier was not as far as depicted rendered unconscious - as he was active when next seen on panel.
- Fourthly, if indeed this is telepathy it doesn't give any gauge as to telepathic ability - telepaths are not passively any more resistant to telepathy than anyone else. Telepaths do not constantly defend either.
A telepathic sucker punch knocking someone down briefly is really no different than a physical sucker punch doing the same thing, with regard to the fact that a weaker person is capable of doing it to a stronger person.
To illustrate this point here is Emma Frost psiblasting Nate Grey: http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/...05003yp8rc0.jpg
- And finally, I'll reiterate this for emphasis - this is a one-off occurrence of offensive telepathy, never seen before and never seen again.
- There isn't much to say about this, mind reading is a relatively rudimentary telepathic feat when compared to most other telepaths. Xavier has been doing this since he was a teenager, and on an aside Xavier has been shown psiblasting in utero.
- Ozymandias has kept secrets from Apocalypse so this is relatively incomplete mind-reading.
- Those are speech bubbles indicating someone off-panel is speaking aloud not telepathic communication bubbles. The Scarab Beast emerges from the ground revealing it to be the one speaking.
- There's nothing to suggest anyone is talking through the Scarab Beast creature telepathically. If anything the creature can speak independently referring to itself as "me".
- Even if there was any evidence to support the claim made, it most certainly wouldn't support a notion of superiority to Xavier. Typhoid Mary can control weak-willed beasts too.
So what can we conclude thus far from the above?
- Out of all the "telepathic" feats ascribed to Apocalypse most are not actually telepathic, never occurred or have no evidence for their occurrence (1-7, 9).
- Only one shows something that is definitively telepathic, incident 8. And this is relatively weak telepathy.
- The only other incident is the psiblast, which may not actually be a psiblast at all - and a psiblast sucker punch gives no indication of the level of telepathic power or skill. If it was indeed a psiblast, the same effect would have likely been observed whether it had been a random Morlock or Saturn Girl.
So let's move onto a related question: Does Apocalypse have telepathy at all?
Well the first strike against him having telepathy is his reaction in incident 3 above where he speaks of telepathy as something he has yet to encounter.
The second is his apparent inability to travel to the Astral Plane on his own accord. http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/3945/58182587fr3.jpg
- It's been stated by some without evidence that this was due to the need to be physically transported to the Astral Plane - there is no evidence of IW nor Cable nor Apocalypse being physically on the Astral Plane. As the name dictates you cannot be physically on the Astral Plane afaik.
- The three travel in astral form via the Astral Plane, to sneak into Onslaught's Citadel which is outside of the Astral Plane made of solidified telepathic energy can be accessed via the Astral or Physical Planes. Upon entering the Citadel outside of the Astral Plane they are instantly detected and, like the Citadel is telepathic energy made physical, they are physical beings there too. IW is revealed having been kept concealed telepathically as they traversed the Astral Plane into the Citadel.
And finally there is this: http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/9914/93421844ou4.jpg
The last of these five telepaths is Emma Frost. From which one can conclude that if Marvel ever did or still does consider Apocalypse a telepath at all, he at the very least isn't of the level of any of those five.
It is questionable whether Apocalypse has any telepathic ability at all and there's nothing to suggest he is equal to or superior to Xavier under normal conditions.
Busted? I think so, but you be the judge.
Gender: Male Location: Welfare Kingdom of California
We can't really bust some of these myths base on feats. The writers can make changes or upgrades to the characters which can out perform their previous skills. So we can't really go with the judgements of "Busted" or "Confirmed" like Jamie and Adam do when they test a myth. Here we can come to conclusions like "Plausible"
However, there are some facts which do hold in arguments.
Case in point.
Batman can beat Superman.
False! Batman can only SLOW Superman with the Kryptonian ring. He can't beat him. Period!
No ring...No Batman beats Superman.
Can Batman outsmart Superman?
Yes! He can predict Superman's attacks. He can estimate Superman's moves...can he beat him? No..at least physically...he cannot. Is Batman smarter than Superman? yeah.
(Too lazy to post scans)
Last edited by WanderingDroid on Jan 14th, 2008 at 07:41 PM
Crystal was captured in the issue prior. Presumably she was brainwashed as Medusa was brainwashed as they were trying to brainwash baby Cable.
I have no idea why Apocalypse for some reason is entirely colored pink in that panel. Presumably the entire background being colored pink in another panel indicates the background is using telepathy.
Exodus reflecting Sersi's attack really isn't a feat of active telepathy just as Apocalypse reflecting Jean's energy back at her. The mental energy that harms her is her own green energy signature reflected back at her.
Using that feat to attribute anything more than mental defenses to Exodus would be fallacious, just as with the Apocalypse-Jean incident.
However Exodus has other telepathic feats to his name for him to be acknowledged as a telepath.
I'm not aware of when exactly that speech between the Celestial and Apocalypse occurs issue-wise or chronology-wise. It's interesting though that Apocalypse doesn't converse via telepathy, and that the Celestial for some reason feels the need to explain it's using telepathic communication to Apocalypse - of course that's really neither here nor there. What is relevant to that scan however is that in that scan of supposed telepathy, Apocalypse reacts to it as a novel thing.
Normal durability characters often take energy attacks without suffering what should be the full consequences. Chalk it up to writers not wanting characters to die that easily.
The creature emerged from beneath the ground. Sand falls from it as it surfaces - they are clearly speech bubbles at any rate. There's still nothing to suggest anybody speaking through it, besides wishful thinking.
I didn't say that you did propagate this, the thread is about myths propagated. At some point someone disseminated this myth, and I've seen it pop up in multiple threads. I felt like addressing it.
I think the myth as stated above is busted others are welcome to disagree, there's a thread already to discuss it elsewhere anyway.
It's meant to take place way back when Apocalypse first bonds with and gains Celestial technology to his disposal.
Apocalypse pretty much discovers the power of telepathy for the first time there.
Apocalypse's power set has always been very flimsy. Back in Rise of Apocalypse, his mutant ability wasn't just to alter his atomic structure, but he also displayed energy projection and levitation (telekinesis) before coming across any technology at all. It's rather unclear just what exactly the Celestial tech granted Apocalypse. But if anything, I'd say that it could have been telepathy.
So, what's with the big explosion when the creature shows up?
Perhaps the creature decided to enter with a bang? I don't know. What I do know is that the speech is quite clearly as depicted smooth unbroken vocal speech balloons - firstly as off-panel speech and then later the same style used pointing towards the creature.
The rest is just supposition. "Telepathic communication bubbles, as seen by the artist, could maybe just be normal speech bubbles." Does that mean throughout the entire issue everyone is telepathically conversing? It makes no sense.
Telepathy in comics is depicted with double dashed lines breaking the balloon, be it a cloud balloon or a smooth balloon. If a comic reader knows this, I have no reason to doubt a comic artist knows this.
I don't have access to my comics right now, but if it's really necessary then I can have a look at Jim Cheung's other comics to see if he's as ignorant of this and inept as you believe him to be...
Myth: Batman's kick hurt Spectre Tales of the Unexpected #4
How many times did we hear that Batman hurt the Spectre with the bat-kick? To many to count, but in reality it did nothing and Sprectre even mentions he made to make Batman feel good about the situation as it was hopeless for him.