My bet is on the Maul Brothers. For one Maul is the superior duelist, and was capable of fighting for a brief time against Darth Sidious, which points to tremendous speed. He'll get in close and push Malgus on the back foot.
Alone, Malgus vs Maul is a fight. Savage seals the deal. He can tank Malgus' lightning, and offer support to his brother. His powerful strikes will combined with Maul's sheer skill will be enough to overwhelm Malgus.
EDIT: I'd say if Savage were not here, Malgus would win. But Savage is here and he makes up for Maul's slack.
Sidious was going easy on Maul. In the book he increases his speed at the end beyond what Maul can contend with. Besides, you only need Dooku level speed to contend with Sidious for a brief time, and I'd say Malgus has it.
Savage can't tank Malgus' lightning. So theres that right away. Secondly, Maul and Savage likely won't even be able to engage Malgus before one of them is taken out with the Force.
Whats to stop Malgus from unleashing the same wave he did at the start of his False Emperor fight and push them both off the cloud?
1. Going easy on Maul is still fast, and he moved fast enough to require a pause for breath.
2. Maul manages to land a blow on Sidious.
3. Sidious is infinitely more powerful than Malgus.
Dooku could contend with Malgus for a lot more than a short time, Dooku contended with Yoda for quite a long time, so I fail to see your point there. Maul is probably faster than Dooku. And Malgus is weaker than Yoda, so Maul isn't going to have a hard time keeping up with him. And then his dueling abilities and Savage's help he can win.
Savage got up from successive bursts from Dooku's lightning, and was able to levitate dozens of stone pillars while being shocked by lightning. He's endurance abilities are immense and can easily withstand a shock or a blast from Malgus without going unconscious.
Unless you actually have a precedence for this.
Lol wait this battle takes place on a cloud? Okay finding it hard to still take you seriously. All three of them fall through the cloud and plunge to their deaths.
1. But how fast? Savage was also "keeping" up with him. Is Savage faster than **** too? That Sidious was going easy on them makes it impossible to suggest they were keeping up through their own speed as opposed to Sidious moving slowly enough for them to compete to make it interesting. He paused for breath after doing a backwards cartwheel. Sidious is old, he probably just pulled something or was showing off a bit too much.
2. When he's berserk with anger of Savage's death, which would give him a big anger boost. Also Sidious overpowers him as soon as he does this.
3. I wouldn't say infinitely. Malgus would give a good fight. Better than Maul and Savage did at least.
Maul isn't faster than Dooku. Maul isn't even faster than Obi-Wan. And I never suggested that Malgus would take Maul out in lightsabers in a short time. Malgus has defeated Aryn Leneer though, who has many similar feats as Maul does. So I don't think Maul would beat him in a lighstaber duel. But I never suggested Malgus would beat them in sabers. I only suggested he would win via the Force.
Malgus' lightning is more powerful and destructive than Dooku's is. I do have a precedent, as I wrote on the last page. Malgus bruned through a Jedi's torso while contending with his lightsaber defense. And he grew vastly more powerful after this point. His lightning would incapacitate or kill Savage.
Malgus slaughtered Kao Cen Darach, disarmed Satele Shan, slaughtered Ven Zallow and held his own against Aryn Leener. All of these opponents have demonstrated exceptional swordsmanship.
Lasting briefly against Sidious isn't a display of great skill, IMO. Luke skywalker, as of DE, outdueled Sidious at his greatest strength.
You talk about speed? Satele Shan is stated to be unbelievably fast, yet Malgus disarmed her. Aryn Leener also have insane speed feats, yet Malgus contended with her.
Maul isn't pushing Malgus back. Did you see what Malgus did to Kao Cen Darach?
Maul is not a match for Malgus, he will not last long against him.
Savage will tank Malgus's lightning? Malgus once destroyed a Jedi with his lightning storm who was powerful enough to collapse two buildings simultaneously. Malgus also one-shot Aryn Leener with his lightning storm when he got really angry at her.
Malgus will destroy Savage with his lightning.
Malgus would defeat this duo, he is that good.
Last edited by S_W_LeGenD on Jul 18th, 2014 at 07:36 PM
1. Savage was no way keeping up with Sidious. As soon as Maul got floored Sidious killed him and it explicit states in the novel that he was just too fast.
The only reason I assume that Maul could keep up with Sidious was because he wasn't schooled in this way and actually managed to land a blow on Sidious.
And Sidious can empower himself with the Force, he doesn't tire that easily.
Anyway considering Malgus is not Sidious, it doesn't really matter than Maul was not able to go toe-to-toe, being able to stand against Sidious even for a brief time is an impressive feat.
2. It had better be, Maul shouldn't be faster enough in normal terms to land a blow on he who speed blitzed the greatest duelists in the Jedi Order.
3. I mean it hyperbolic, what I mean is Sidious is so out of Malgus' lead that Sidious would probably slap him down like a punk. Sure he'd do better than Maul and Savage but lets be real they didn't do that well and at any time Sidious could have Force Choked them out and be done with it.
Maul's powers rival Dooku's, I'd say he could be faster than him, and yeah Maul is definitely faster than Kenobi lol.
Not sure why your comparing Leener's lightsaber abilities to Maul's. Maul may be comparable in terms of Force Power, but as Kas'im would say you can make up for that through exceptional bladework. Indeed the gap between Kas'im and Bane in that duel isn't likely that larger than the gap between Maul and Malgus. And regardless of the fact that Malgus is likely a better duelist Bane was quite royally schooled. I expect Malgus would have quite a hard time against such a master duelist.
Without Savage I would give it to Malgus, superior Force Powers would win out. But Savage is a game changer because he keeps Malgus on the back foot. It is harder for him to chain Force attacks because he's too busy fending of an exceptional duelist and a powerhouse working in perfect sync. And even if he managed to he's only going to be able to take out one brother. Two handed Force Powers are just a no no.
And that leaves the other, be it Savage or Maul, to exploit the opening Malgus leaves with a Force-based attack of their own. Or at the very least keep Malgus occupied while the other brother recovers. It is this kind of tag-teaming that will keep Malgus on the back foot, preventing him from properly using his Force-powers. And with that advantage superior bladework will win out I feel.
As I side note I'd add that numbers advantage gives Maul and Savage an advantage in Force powers, one of them can afford to drop their guard and launch a Force-based attack because the other will cover. And with Malgus momentarily stunned and a distance made between them they can chain an attack together like this and really get him on the back foot.
P.S. Yes Malgus lightining is stronger than Dooku's. But as I said if he can withstand multiple blasts of Dooku's lightning, even use Force powers while doing so, he can withstand one blast from Malgus. And that will be all Maul will give him. This isn't going to be like Ventress & Savage vs Dooku, because Maul unlike Ventress can pin Malgus down.
And the more pain Savage endures, the stronger he gets.
You are definitely going to need to provide prove that Malgus can one shot Savage Opress lol. Savage was an incredibly powerful Force user.
Savage "landed a blow" on Sidious too, remember. Sidious was too fast for Savage yes, and he was too fast for Maul as well which is also explicitly stated in the novel.
Nah, Maul was being schooled as well.
I know, but a backwards cartwheel is still something an old man isn't gonna pull off grinning. Sidious' expression always seemed to me to be something like "shit, maybe not do that again."
And? You act as if Malgus wouldn't do the same in his place. It isn't something that suggests Maul is better than Malgus, which is what you're trying to establish. Fighting a Sidious who's going easy on him isn't that impressive.
Agreed.
Sidious wouldn't slap him down like a punk. Malgus is only a tier lower than him and as I said, could put up a decent fight. I doubt Sidious could ragdoll him.
Maul is stated to be less powerful than Dooku and lol no he's not faster than Kenobi. He's not held the advantage in any of their CW duels barring the first and Kenobi humiliated him and Savage at the same time. Dooku is comfortably Kenobi's superior.
In raw speed, power and strength Leneer is very similar, is what I said. And Malgus was even with her even before his huge improvement following his epiphany. Afterwards I'd say he's superior to Maul.
That Kas'im comparison is a false one. Bane was defeating Kas'im in straight combat. It took Kas'im to pull out a lightsaber style Bane had absolutely no knowledge on to turn the tides. That's how exceptional bladework can triumph. Maul can't do that to Malgus though, so it's irrelevant to point out.
Like he kept Dooku on the back foot? Malgus will school him with lightning.
I will point out that Malgus is capable to bringing the Imperial Strike Team to its knees with lightning and can toss both strike teams back with TK. It's not as if overpowering multiple strong Force users is beyond him.
Blah blah, you're scripting the fight.
Malgus is the superior duelist in my opinion anyway, due to his greater power. And you're assuming the brothers would get a chance to recover. Remember that they're on a cloud, Malgus could just push them off.
Even together I doubt they'd exceed or match Malgus' power. Malgus overpowered a Jedi who collapsed 2 buildings at once with TK. And his thoughts suggest he could have overwhelmed him in TK.
It's not as if Dooku's lightning is cumulative. If Savage can tank one blast from it it only makes sense he can tank multiple blasts of the same level of power.But Malgus' lightning will exceed Savage's ability to tank in a single blast and take him out. It's like you're suggesting that because his armor tanked multiple blaster bolts that it can tank a cannon fire. It doesn't work that way.
Unless that pain kills him or he gets knocked out.
So was Aryn Leneer and guess what? Malgus one-shot her after he achieved Oneness with the darkside.
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Last edited by Nephthys on Jul 18th, 2014 at 08:18 PM
1. Not trying to equate Maul with Sidious here, I understand that Sidious wasn't trying very hard, but you have to have impressive speed to fight Sidious as evidenced by the failure of the Jedi Strike Team.
Savage didn't land a blow in combat, I think it was down to Sidious lacking appropriate area to dodge or really just not caring.
No I'm not? I'm using this as proof to equate Malgus with Maul, I don't think Maul can outfight Malgus through superior speed, but his more than fast enough to keep up with him and close gaps quickly.
2. A tier lower than Sidious is like Plagueis, Marek, Kun etc. but you probably think Malgus is as powerful as them so what evs.
He ragdolled Maul and Savage at the same time. I kick or a push and Malgus would probably be weak enough to be ragdolled. But this isn't about Sidious.
3. Kenobi "defeating" Maul and Savage does not seem a feat of speed to me, just a very powerful offense mixed with a perfect defense. But ultimately Maul has prove himself to be a considerably superior Force user to Kenobi by Force gripping him (just like Dooku) which indicates superior speed.
4. I'd reverse that and say Bane knew everything about Kas'ims normal style. He should have had adequate knowledge of Ataru. It was not as if Kas'im's style was unique and ground breaking, no more than Maul's style.
Anyway, I see no evidence that suggests Malgus is a superior duelist to Maul, who brought his mastery of Juyo to incredibly high levels and backed that up with mastery over Jar'Kai and Teras Kasi, he was one of the most skilled lightsaber duelists in Sith history. Malgus was just brute force brute force brute force, bit of skill go.
Anyway your not hearing me, with two duelists to focus on Malgus won't be able to apply his power, he'll have too much to deal with and it will leave him too exposed. And if he does the other can take him before he can land a killing blow. TK is useless if you can't use it.
And pain is culmative, which each shock Savage's body would have weakened. Let me give you a low down of what this power does:
Prolonged exposure to intense electrical fields (such as a sustained current of Force lightning) caused most humanoids to experience sudden and massive calcification of their skeletal system; the abrupt drop in blood minerals provoked muscular micro-seizures all over the victim's body.
With each blast he gets weaker and weaker and his ability to defend against the blasts grow weaker as well. Eventually Malgus would have passed out. Obviously. Its common sense to assume that someone who has just been shocked by lightining will be weaker than before, this is why Force Users often have to be worn down before you can choke them out. You have to whittle away at their defenses.
Oh and sure, Malgus can just spam oneness. And no way does Leener have the endurance capabilities Savage has.
So, any actual proof?
And by the way, they are not on a cloud, you can't stand on clouds. OK?
Registered: Jul 2014
Location: Off learning Ground Realities
Can someone show me when Malgus ever used Maelstrom on a force user?
I've just only ever seen it once, on a non force user. This means it really can't be used in an argument against force users.
The whole point of Maelstrom is that it takes ages to actually reach full power, and that a good FORCE BARRIER must be thrown up.
Malgus never showed the ability to actually save himself from anyone who'd try and stop it through the force, and that's a pretty essential part
__________________ "i admire u choose cersei as ur avi sel. at least u know that ur one sick *****, i can respect that" - Inturpid.
Jul 17th, 2014 10:58 PM
And I never suggested that Malgus would take Maul out in lightsabers in a short time. Malgus has defeated Aryn Leneer though, who has many similar feats as Maul does. So I don't think Maul would beat him in a lighstaber duel. But I never suggested Malgus would beat them in sabers. I only suggested he would win via the Force.
And no way does Leener have the endurance capabilities Savage has.
