Priestjim> For the love of Neo. Please re-read my next to last (longest) post.
Tshirt> Or perhaps the Architect simply cannot see more than two choices, being bound as he is, by the parameters of perfection (mathematical at least).
EITHER “return-to-Source” OR “return to Matrix” with the corresponding consequences. I adhere to the belief that it is the Smith-virus which is the cataclysmic system crash, since it was the very first act as The One that Neo performed: Creating a virus.
We’ve already seen legions of Smith, and in Revolutions it looks as if pretty much everyone has been taken over. Has he killed the connected humans? Or can the virus be “erased”? It is perhaps by finally transcending the boundaries of “the systems of control” that Neo MAY end the war. By not doing what the One is supposed to, he fulfils the prophecy after all.
If that’s the case it’ll be one of my favourite noodle-bakers for months.
Originally posted by Wolfwood
well, as I heard someone say before in another forum, it's probably going to be a sort of "battle of philosophies" and we'll just have to wait to see which one wins out in the minds of the W. Brothers.I disagree with Jedi, I think that the humans do have a choice, but the choices they have are limited, but heck, I'm just a newb so by default you can choose to ingnore me and listen to jedi 😉
I agree. Humans do have a choice. The computer program analogy is nice, but not complete. One could look a program and determine what will happen next. BUT, that doesn't factor in input from an outside source. (aka humans) You can look at ETM and know what happens during the intro. But once a human starts to control a character, you do not know what will happen. You have probabilities, but do not know exactly.
If someone can see our future actions, that does not affect what we choose. Just that they know our choice.
Finally, the movies will end with no clear decision on this issue. There will be a "battle of philosophies" with no winner.
Originally posted by The Omega
Tshirt> Or perhaps the Architect simply cannot see more than two choices, being bound as he is, by the parameters of perfection (mathematical at least).I adhere to the belief that it is the Smith-virus which is the cataclysmic system crash, since it was the very first act as The One that Neo performed: Creating a virus.
We’ve already seen legions of Smith, and in Revolutions it looks as if pretty much everyone has been taken over. Has he killed the connected humans? Or can the virus be “erased”?
I can buy both of these. Don't fully support either but don't vote against them at all.
Good night.
But what if they tell us what they see. Doesn't that create a paradox? And infinite loop with an infinite feedback? It is like the time-machine paradox. If I create a time machine, I won't be able to change things in the past because if I change them I would have no reason to create the time machine, but I don't create the time machine, how would I change them etc...
I just thought of something. What if, Neo gains the ability to rewrite the CODING of the MATRIX itself, not just the little programs like those that control bullets and gravity, but the conditionals in the entire program? i mean, think of it like this...
the archie sees that there are only TWO possible explanations, two conditionals (thanks for the idea, Omega),
1) one is Neo goes through right door, recycles Matrix, rebuilds Zion...
2) two is Neo goes through left door, attempts to save Trin, fails, Smith kills Neo, Matrix and Zion dead.
But Neo gains the power to ADD a conditional, something the Archie thought previously impossible, Neo adds
3) three is, Neo goes through left door, saves Trinity, Destroys Smith-virus, joins with Machines, world is saved and there is a future for both species...this would invalidate the Archies phrase that they won't meet again, b/c Archie is basing this phrase on the fact that Neo will die by Smith... NEO WOULD TRULY BE THE ONE, THE ULTIMATE HACKER
JediHDM> I think you’re on to something here. Your theory still has the machine-AI’s telling the truth, but they can only speak from their AND/OR point of view.
The prophecy is NOT true. Not in the actual sense of it (the way we knew it when Reloaded started), but in “another” sense. There is something here, I can’t quite put my finger on it yet, but it deals with the evolution of the anomaly through the cycles of the Matrix…
I’ll get back at it…
i'll help you...each time the matrix is reloaded, it becomes more corruptes, because there is more and more human "choice" causing the codes to become more and more wild, if you will...therefore, each time, the anomaly becomes, i guess you could say, more reserved from the rest of his species, yet, more a part of them...almost like the one was created by the machines, and the original choose what the machines WANTED him to, but each time the anomaly is created, he becomes, almost more human, until...NEO, the sixth, (which, biblically speaking, means he IS HUMAN) who LOVES another, more even then he loves his fellow man...
(Dives for cover)
NOT Sifer’s Love-theory again!! Neo help us all…. 😉
The MORE human, though, I like. The most human, or… human… argh, it’s late. I can’t gather my thoughts anymore.
The Matrix becoming more corrupted is not a bad idea. The Mero can collect MORE rogue programs, it’s like the system needs a good defragmentation but can’t get it. I don’t think Neo loves another more than he loves his fellow man.
I’m with the c)-choice theory here. That Neo realises he must make ANOTHER, a third (Trinity – yes, it’s time to over-analyse) choice, to save both man and machine (as the Oracle said).
He’s more rebellious by nature (“Your predecessors had more respect”), and in this affinity for disobedience against the system I think lies the answer.
Originally posted by The Omega
The prophecy is NOT true. Not in the actual sense of it (the way we knew it when Reloaded started), but in “another” sense. There is something here, I can’t quite put my finger on it yet, but it deals with the evolution of the anomaly through the cycles of the Matrix…
I’ll get back at it…
Prophecies are not "true" or "not true". They are either fulfilled or not fulfilled.
A prophecy is defined as: a) An inspired utterance of a prophet, viewed as a revelation of divine will.
b) A prediction of the future, made under divine inspiration.
The prophecy is in M1 was stated as follows:
MORPHEUS When [the man born inside the Matrix] died, the Oracle at the temple of Zion prophesied his return and envisioned an end to the war and freedom for our people. That is why there are those of us that have spent our entire lives searching the Matrix, looking for him.
Up to this point, that person has not appeared. The war has not ended their is not freedom for the people. The propechy is UNFULFILLED. It could still happen in the future. When it does, it is fulfilled. If it does not happen with Neo, then maybe the next guy.
The only other option is that their was no prophecy to begin with. That the whole "One" thing was just made up and passed down the line. That it did not come from the Oracle the Temple of Zion.