the reason they have uniforms, is not because they think it will keep kids from being picked on, tho that is part of it, its because the parents dont want to spend the extra money on their kids that are trying to fit in, they have uniforms, so kids wont be late in the morning because they are hbusy picking out what to wear. theres the uniform, thats what you wear, nothing to debate about.
I spent four years among the social rejects of my school, and let me tell you something: I never once saw anyone get picked on because of the way they dressed. Except for me, of course, but that was a special case. When you wear shorts in the middle of winter, you except it to excite comment (but I'd have burned up in a uniform; my metabolism is odd that way). But hey, I knew a gay guy who was picked on extensively; maybe he shouldn't have been allowed to express his sexual orientation? Because, you know, things like freedom of speach are less important than having the student body all get along?
There's no use saying that clothing isn't speach, because it clearly is; when someone dresses like a goth, he's sending a message.
Edited to say that--and I hope nobody will take this the wrong way--"It simplifies getting dressed in the morning" is the feeblest reason to quash free speach I have ever heard. Although I don't doubt that it is a reason.
This is a touchy topic for me ... I hope people don't think I'm being rude here.
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Clothing and shoes are not the only reason why people are picked on, but its still one of the reasons. Besides, it is not all about being picked on, why dont you try avoided, or feeling out of place and not good enough when a bunch of people have stuff you cannot afford.Some people dont like people who dress trendy, or goth or punk, and would not give them the time of the day...ever. This way, it is very different.
Freedom of expression does not consist only in clothes.
I can proudly say that my freedom of expression and individuality does not consist of the things i wear, it consist of the things i know, the things i say, the way i few(view?) the world, not the way i dress.
My school has a uniform code, and I still don't talk to those people. And I sometimes make fun of them, but certainly not about their clothes. and I do it to their faces. Why? Because they used to do it to me. I dress differently nearly every dress down day (certain days were we wore what we liked), sometimes in all black, sometimes in all Old Navy, sometimes in all Southpole, sometimes in a mix. I never got picked on for what I was wearing, but I got picked on for nearly everything else. I always felt avoided and out of place, when I was around people who acted and thought differently than I did. Never because of clothes.
My point is, kids won't get picked on for their clothes, and people who do pick on others for their clothes will do it to someone who is smarter than they are, and they will be put in their place.
Anyway, most of the teasing I do is in good fun, and besides, if they can't take a joke, **** 'em.
Re: Is this right?
Originally posted by silver_tears
I go to a catholic high school in a little suburb of Toronto.So we have an enforced uniform policy in our school.
Dress pants, shirts, kilts, dress shoes, etc..
No hats are to be worn inside between 8:40 and 2:40 too.Do you think it's right that the school put into the policy that no piercings that are un natural are allowed? I don't mean the plain ears, double holes thing, I'm talking about eyebrow, lip, nose, etc....
Do you agree or disagree with it?
i went to a catholic high school myself. the same exact policy. we can't even have hair that goes past our eyebrows. white shirts, white socks, black leather shoes. i had no qualms about it. a school is an instituion of learning, not a fashion show. although we had occasions that we could wear civilian clothing.
these policies are enforced because they make the institute look organized, collected and united. i liked my high school uniform... but then again, i'm a geek 🤓
Gregory > I cant really argue or respond to anything you say, not to be rude, BF's responses make far more sense, since he gives some kind of view accross that doesnt involve only his expreiance.
You cannot generalise and make an asumption on something based on your experiance's alone. Research does not work that way, and if someone was doing a sociological survey on whether or not people get picked on in school because of cloathing, they certanly wouldnt say, ''no, they are not, because there are 2 incidents of that, we have found so far''
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Gregory > I cant really argue or respond to anything you say, not to be rude, BF's responses make far more sense, since he gives some kind of view accross that doesnt involve only his expreiance.
Well, I understand perfectly. But--since we're being blunt in an unoffensive way--I'm not sure you've done better. You've said that England has less bullying than America, but even if that's true (I don't doubt it), it doesn't mean that it's because of the uniform (I've always thought the English were just rather better at maintaining discipline). You've said that school uniforms reduce bullying, but I'm not sure what that belief is based on, besides common sense, which is not always very reliable.
You've talked about the purpose of school uniforms. There, at least, I can give hard information. According to an NAESP survey of schools with unifrom policies, the number one reason principles give for supporting school uniforms is not that it reduced bullying or keeps students from being late--it's that they think it makes their school appear professional.
Originally posted by Tptmanno1
I really don't care. I go to a school that has uniforms, but wiht 6 other schools in my city that I could have gone to, I picked the only one with uniforms. Accually it makes my life easier because i can rooll outta bes and get dressed without thinking.
I think i have concluded that it is the fact that those people who complain about it never went to school with Uniform. I have, and if i didnt have, the id probably complain too.
I didnt mind it, like you said, i know exactly what im wearing each day, dress up each morning with out thinking 😄
The reason USA has a lot more "bullying" has nothing to do with an established dress code or lack there of...
It's most commonly caused by the huge mix of nationalities that attend different schools. I'm sure that other countries are simialr to the US, but no where near on the same scale. People see the differences in other peoples cultures, and they choose to mock those individuals because of it. Racism holds more control over bullying than a dress code.
It'd be nice if kids and young adults were more mature than that. It'd be nice if all children were above such a petty thing...but generally speaking....they're not.
Who isn't guilty of saying some sort of offense slur towards another race at one point in their youth?
Here's what two sociologists say about the effects of school uniforms. It's just an abstract, unfortunately, but the author's words are clear enough:
"Sudent uniform use was not significantly correlated with any of the school commitment variables such as absenteeism, behavior, or substance use (drugs). In addition, students wearing uniforms did not appear to have any significantly different academic preparedness, proschool attitudes, or peer group structures with proschool attitudes than other students. Moreover, the negative correlations between the attitudinal variables and the various outcomes of interest are significant; hence, the predictive analysis provides more substantive results."
Or, to put it in plain English: school uniforms aren't worth squat, except a slight improvement in standardized testing.
Originally posted by Linkalicious
-Who isn't guilty of saying some sort of offense slur towards another race at one point in their youth?
Link, I don't want to call you a flat out racist, but I've noticed that you make a... separation between different races. I can't remember ever making a racist remark in my life. You can't blame bullying on racism, because frankly, though there is still racial tension, most places simply don't have a lot of it anymore. I know there is still racism in some places, but up here, it's incredibly rare to hear people making racist comments.
And also, you act as if Europe and the UK don't have people from different countries and of different races. Which, from what I've heard, is completely opposite of the truth.
well living in a high cost country as Norway school uniforms would be a good thing.
It creates pressure on the parents when they dont have a dress code, in that I mean it is a pressure from the kids/youths that you better wear the "right" stuff or else you are hung out. And the "right" stuff is always the expensive things.
When I went to school Levi`s denim were the thing, with the red label not the orange one. And a pair of levis was then about 600 Norwegian crowns which is around $ 80.
Dont think the disallowing piercing is the right thing though, taken the fact that you have to be 18 to be pierced in Norway if not the parents allow it. And no piercing studio will pierce anyone under 13 regardless of what parents allow it or not .
Even so i dont think it is right not to allow piercing, as long as they wear uniform, it is borderlinign to prejudice. Whats next no one with red hair is allowed in school?
At day-school - up until what we in Britain would call the higher-grade - ( 16+ ), uniformity of clothing is important so that the kids all feel part of the same large group of peers that is the school. If individuality is allowed then the pupils will form their own peer-groups where they can feel comfortable in the sameness that occurs here. This then generates a feeling of competition betwen the different sub-peer-groups where either you belong or you don't. If you don't belong then you are as a result out in the cold on your own. ( Young people don't - in the main - like that ). Some very few individuals WILL resist all efforts to make them conform to peer pressure and these individuals will be seen by the rest as weird and "out-there".
As has been said before, if all of the pupils in a school are made to dress the exact same way then their attentions are not distracted towards individuality and they will then be expected to concentrate more on their studies.
I see the times when the teachers and the school authorities try to compromise with the children by letting ear-rings be worn but not lip-rings etc' and I find this as duplicitous and dishonest as here too the authorities are showing prejudice in favour of accepted fashions as opposed to new ones.
Of course young-people should be encouraged to be individuals and to show their individuality by dressing as they like and by adorning themselves with whatever bling they like...BUT... this show of individuality might be better to be left until either after school hours or until after the time where concentration on studies is not quite so important.
I feel that these ideas do not apply in quite the same way by the time that the individual goes to university as by that time any individual jewellery or clothing style is firmly settled in the mind of the person and is unlikely to cause any upset with the other individuals at the university. In other words....by this time the person is more mature and settled in their own mind.
Originally posted by Darth Revan
Link, I don't want to call you a flat out racist, but I've noticed that you make a... separation between different races. I can't remember ever making a racist remark in my life. You can't blame bullying on racism, because frankly, though there is still racial tension, most places simply don't have a lot of it anymore. I know there is still racism in some places, but up here, it's incredibly rare to hear people making racist comments.
I don't act like that in any way shape or form. You've spent absolutely ZERO time getting to know me as a person, so I really don't find how you can judge me based on what little you know about me. I'm an ass.hole....there's no point in lying about that. I'm blunt, to the point, and I tell it how it is.
You don't get picked on for the clothes you wear, you get picked on for being different....and your Race is the most noticable difference about a person. Maybe you don't actually SAY the racial slur out loud, but everyone's had those "lets mother f**k another race" thoughts go through their head. hell, just knowing the definiton of the racial slur almost ensures that you've used the term in context at one point in your life. Lying on a message board to sound like a "good little boy or girl" gets you no where. Except maybe more cyber friends.
Originally posted by Darth Revan
And also, you act as if Europe and the UK don't have people from different countries and of different races. Which, from what I've heard, is completely opposite of the truth.
Hi, apparently your school is spending too much time teaching you not to be a racist to teach you simple reading comprehension. Did I or Did I not say:
I'm sure that other countries are simialr to the US, but no where near on the same scale.
live in Southern California? Know anything about the diversity of races in Southern California? The millions of illegal immigrants? The Asian, Indian, and European kids that come over to get a finer education? the thousands of soon to be gangster African American kids? the "I'm too good for you" white kids who were raised that way by their parents who believe themselves to be better than every other family on the block. I'm sure everywhere in the world has their own sorts of diversity, like i said...just not on the same scale. The US isn't considered a "melting pot" for nothing...
It may sound like callous bullsh!t to you, but its a reality. I don't make the rules, i just live by them. People don't like those who are different from themselves...that isn't exactly a new idea.
On 9/11 alone, I bet 1/2 of the US was probably cursing or slurring racial comments about Arabs and Muslims under their breath. Are those people actually racist? Probably not, they just had one of those moments of rage where stupid things get said...even if they aren't well thought out.
Yes, I'm a huggge racist. 🙄 I have only white friends, I would rather spit on other races than acknowledge them as my equal, and I would just assume kill one than help them out in any way, shape, or form. ❌
Well....THAT would be a racist. And THAT is one thing I am not. Just because I know and have said the terms....doesn't make me a racist. I have friends of all different races, and I accept anyone from any race as a friend....I'd love to "flat out" tell you what you can do with your notion of me being a racist....but to tell you the truth, i don't think it'll fit in THAT hole.
I'm an insensitive prick, that doesn't make me a racist.