The Beyonder (secret wars version) VS The Living Tribunal

Originally posted by wrathofachilles
And he didn't will Warlock away because he chose not to, not because he couldn't. He stripped the power of the IG, which nobody else could touch, including Eternity itself.

If the LT could just "will" Warlock away, why was there a trial?

No, the LT had to convince Warlock to agree to relinquish the gauntlet so that the power of the gems could be disabled. The LT couldn't have done that without Warlocks' permission. If Warlock refused, a battle would have ensued and the outcome of that fight isn't as clear cut as you'd think... if Korvac can withstand the LT's judgement, don't you think Warlock with the gauntlet can?

Dude you need to let the LT thing go.

Do you not understand the concept of a 'tribunal?' I don't mean to be rude, but that knowledge is necessary to get my point. A tribunal is a court of three individuals *or three faces in this case* that judges an offending individual. He's not going to will someone away without a trial, that's the entire point of the character of the Living TRIBUNAL. LT negated the effects of the IG with a snap of a finger. He wouldn't have to fight Warlock, he'd just snap his fingers and destroy him. Yet he had to give Warlock the chance to a fair trial because that is his place in the multiverse: he is the judge of the One.

🙄 So did LT have a trial with Thanos with the Heart or Korvac Wrath?

He stopped Warlock's attack with a snap of the finger, but Warlock could've attacked again. The Gauntlet grants wishes as well. LT makes a wish, the wielder of the IG can do the same. It'll be the same thing, one person wishes one thing with their power, the other person does the same. LT himself reasoned with Warlock instead of fighting him, stating that their struggle for the Gauntlet would destroy the universe.

He can't have a trial with the Heart-powered Thanos because Thanos can will HIM out of existence. No trial is going to do any good. Trials are held by stronger bodies over weaker bodies, such as the courts over a criminal. The trial is intended to be fair to the weaker body, that's the point of them. The fight would destroy a universe if the wielder of the IG desired to be so, but it doesn't affect LT, it only affects everything else. LT is immune to the IG.

If the fight would destroy the universe, then why not just snap his fingers and remove the Gauntlet rather then appealing to Warlock during the trial? Oh wait, he CAN'T!

[Contradiction]Wrath, first you argued LT could've just will Warlock out of existence, now you say that their FIGHT would result in the destruction of the universe. Why fight? If he determines Warlock is unfit, then just will Warlock out of existence or the Gauntlet off his hand or just stop the gems from working together. Yet he reasoned with Warlock and stated that their STRUGGLE (LT has to struggle) would end the universe.[/Contradiction]

Wrath you call me a child. Hmm well i thought id point some stuff out about you. You dont know what your talkinga bout hall the time in this thread, you never even read any of the comics, you turn away from irifutable evidance, witch has been put infront of you at least a few times. Why fight when you already lost, stop writing on this thread already its pointless and annoying.

No, I said LT can will Warlock out of existence but if Warlock chose to resist, HE could destroy the universe. LT doesn't have to fight, he can negate the effects of the IG. Warlock can wish total destruction in a response to LT's request, but after he does so, that's when LT can snap his fingers. It's already been stated he's above the Infinity Gauntlet. He 'reasoned' with Warlock because, again, he's a tribunal, he exists to play fair so to speak.

Mider, shut up. If you're not going to debate me then keep your mouth shut. At least Beyonder includes facts to debate me with. We do not see eye to eye on the Beyonder vs. the Living Tribunal, but you don't even argue with me. You are the one resorting to insults, so that's why I call you a child, because that's what children do when they don't know what to say. There is no irrefutable evidence, there is only opinion, and you haven't even backed yours up with anything that makes sense. You have made statements contrary to fact, such as Living Tribunal cannot destroy universes. THAT IS ONE OF HIS POWERS! GO LOOK IT UP! I will not argue with someone who knows nothing of the character. Period.

I thought this post was going to be closed. Apparently it is not revolving around the discussion of both specified contenders, but rather a name calling match. The choice use of "kid" and "child" in referencing (or rather insulting) others is becoming tiresome. I do not think there was an age limit to register with this forum. One's own exposure to the comics should be sufficient to back up or refute an argument.

I already threw in my 2-cents about both contenders, so I'll not repeat myself on that subject matter. Living Tribunal specified he dwarfed the might of the Infinity Gauntlet. I think he is beyond arrogance unlike some other cosmic characters tend to have, so his evaluation should be decent enough to conclude Warlock w/ IG would be a nonfactor to him if truly required. But his purpose is most often to judge/decide. Whether Living Tribunal could remake the chaos Warlock could have created or if it would have been slightly different from the original is debatable.

Age makes no difference, you're right. Maturity does. I don't care if 12 year olds post here as long as they can bring something to the debate and not rattle off pointless banter nor insult someone who asks them to write like a grown-up. I don't care if someone thinks Beyonder is the most powerful being of all, as long as they don't make ridiculous statements about how the Living Tribunal is not that powerful or that he can't do this and can't do that.

Originally posted by radioboy121
Living Tribunal specified he dwarfed the might of the Infinity Gauntlet.

To which the also omniscient Warlock retorted "An assertion yet to be proven"

Originally posted by Krissy Von Doom
To which the also omniscient Warlock retorted "An assertion yet to be proven"

Living Tribunal has a defined placement within the universe/multiverse. Warlock gained omniscient powers through the gauntlet, which granted him a certain level of cosmic awareness, but not true enlightenment. He's still flawed with the powers granted to him (remember the extraction of Magus and Goddess that he wasn't immediately aware of). Likewise, Phoenix gained Beyonder's power for an issue, but she wasn't completely enlightened. She had enough trouble with a sentinel.

Sighs i think this thread should finally be closed, There is no point in this debate anymore, most of you have a silly notion that the LT is invincible witch he is not, The Beyonder with all his powers could still be hurt he could heal but he could still be hurt. I say the Beyonder can defeat the LT cause he himself said that he was worried about the Beyonder and how he didnt act when The Beyonder killed death.

Originally posted by radioboy121
[B]Warlock gained omniscient powers through the gauntlet, which granted him a certain level of cosmic awareness, but not true enlightenment. He's still flawed with the powers granted to him./B]

How much cosmic awareness does the Living Tribunal have if he thought that a supernova would kill Korvac? 😱

Anyway, yes Warlock was still a flawing being with the gauntlet, I believe that's why there was a trial, he was too "detached" to have the power of a supreme being.

LT is as invincible as the One allows him to be as his powers derive from the One Above All, meaning the One can grant him all of his power technically, not that he would. At any time Marvel can 'change their mind,' but it is understood that he transcends any and all forms of sentient life. He is above the properties and laws of the multiverse and thus all of existence. There is really no such thing as invincible because Marvel always comes up with some ludicrous new storyline, but he is as invincible as a character can be.

And you have to specifically ask Paola to close the thread; she won't do it on her own. Much like the Living Tribunal, she only acts when absolutely necessary. There are plenty of threads that should have been closed long ago, but nobody asked her to close them.

Shut up Wrath, for crying out loud just shut up.

The Living Tribunal may be the highest entity the has been not not the highest there ever will be. He has been run off by Korvac, He was scared of the Beyonder, he could do nothing to the Brothers and was distroyed by Thanos. The LT does not transend the power of everything for crying outloud, he never snaped his fingers, thus removing the power of the gauntlet, I will admit he is stronger then the IG but when it comes to villians the likes of Korvac, or Onslaught, who can evolve beyond there set weaknesses, and others the likes of The Beyonder, Enthropy, The Brothers, The Infinites, All who have threatened existance one time or another.

That Korvac comic was a "What-If". It doesn't really pertain to actual marvel continuity.

LT is the highest, nuff' said. What exactly are you guys arguing against LT that pushing this topic past 1 page? 🤨

Originally posted by Mider
Shut up Wrath, for crying out loud just shut up.

Don't bash other members. It's against the rules.

Originally posted by Krissy Von Doom
If the LT could just "will" Warlock away, why was there a trial?

No, the LT had to convince Warlock to agree to relinquish the gauntlet so that the power of the gems could be disabled. The LT couldn't have done that without Warlocks' permission. If Warlock refused, a battle would have ensued and the outcome of that fight isn't as clear cut as you'd think... if Korvac can withstand the LT's judgement, don't you think Warlock with the gauntlet can?

The trial was held in order to determine if Warlock was worthy of using the IG. Eternity brought forth a case that Warlock was mentally unstable and shouldn't be allowed to use the IG. LT declared Warlock unworthy and ordered him to distribute the gems apart. Warlock, though omnipotence saw that resistance was futile, agreed to distribute to gems.