Can Palpatine be turned?

If Lucas wanted a story about "trying to understand evil" and how "evil" can start out good, then Palpy must be given the same creds; therefore, Palpy must have a chance at redemption too. Geesh, if Vader can kill kids and be redeemed, why not Palpy?

Here's how:

If Obi could wait for years for Luke to grow up and have millions of death go on, why couldn't Obi wait another 10 years and have Luke truly master the force to a degree that's unheard of. If Luke was strong enough to beat the geriatric Vader and beat a near death Palpy with one finger, Palpy would have respected that... Cause Palpy only respects power. Luke would then use the mind trick and, pardon the expression, mind rape Palpy and find out why he turned evil and change the evil of his ways. Palpy would cry and say how sorry he was, and then he could be a force ghost and stand next to Yoda at the end.

Originally posted by Mist
yeah, but what the hell is the theater scene gonna be about?

Isnt the theatre scene going to be a homage to the GODFATHER wedding scene where all the Corleones enemies are taken care of ?

an assasination attepmt will be in that scene

you think so?

Well I don't think anyone is born evil. I think that everyone has potential to be good or evil. We all have choice in our lives. There is some good and bad in everyone, even if it's only a small amount of one or the other.

We just don't know the origins of Palpatine. Perhaps a Sith found him when he was very young and poisoned his mind. Perhaps if the Jedi had gotten to him first, he would have been good.

By the time of ROTJ, he had been assimilated into the Dark Side entirely so that he didn't have a trace of humanity left. By that point, I doubt anyone could have saved him. But I doubt he was like that his entire life.

It was Palpatine's destiny to be evil. His path was already set before him. I believe, regardless of who got to him first, there was no escape from his destiny. It was meant to be.

I doubt he was a jedi originally, because he was obviously a well-known senator with ties and such. To be honest, when i first heard mentiopn of the prequels by lucas on the interviews for the THX soup-ups of the originals he said that the story would tell about Palpatine's back story. I wasn't so much interested in his rise to power, but his fall to the dark side. I suppose it's not really about him, though, is it?

"you think so?"

yeah...sidious will be sitting in a balcony and i wouldnt doubt it if there would be an assasination attempt on him resembling lincolns assin. if you notice how the prequel movies resemble the american civil war in alot of ways what with the "seperatists"="confederates"...blah blah blah/.
so it would make sense if he threw that in there.

I thought the assassanation "attempt" by mace(as he called it) was in his office.

Yeah, it's in the office and Anakin should walk in and be like WTF? That's Mace whoa shite! Palpatine is a bad ass!

Originally posted by PENGUINER
If Lucas wanted a story about "trying to understand evil" and how "evil" can start out good, then Palpy must be given the same creds; therefore, Palpy must have a chance at redemption too. Geesh, if Vader can kill kids and be redeemed, why not Palpy?

Here's how:

If Obi could wait for years for Luke to grow up and have millions of death go on, why couldn't Obi wait another 10 years and have Luke truly master the force to a degree that's unheard of. If Luke was strong enough to beat the geriatric Vader and beat a near death Palpy with one finger, Palpy would have respected that... Cause Palpy only respects power. Luke would then use the mind trick and, pardon the expression, mind rape Palpy and find out why he turned evil and change the evil of his ways. Palpy would cry and say how sorry he was, and then he could be a force ghost and stand next to Yoda at the end.

Not only is that storyline appalling... but your basic point makes no sense. Just WHY does Paly therefore have to have a shot at redemption? He most certainly does not. Part of the moral tale is that some people are just bad- period (which is why it is ok to kill them in large numbers), Anakin's story is specifically why a GOOD person would turn bad; that does not follow that all bad people can therefore become good, or were ever good.

so youre saying he was born evil?

Well, we have no idea about that, but I was just saying Anakin proves nothing in that respect. The entire saga goes to show what HIS deal is; it's not going to be the same for everyone else, and most likely anyone else.

"Not only is that storyline appalling... but your basic point makes no sense. Just WHY does Paly therefore have to have a shot at redemption? He most certainly does not. Part of the moral tale is that some people are just bad- period (which is why it is ok to kill them in large numbers), Anakin's story is specifically why a GOOD person would turn bad; that does not follow that all bad people can therefore become good, or were ever good."

From your point then, Anakin was good and became evil.
Palpy was born evil; therefore not redeemable.

Then it begs the question, was Palpy when he was a toddler evil????

Again, if Anakin can kill kids and be redeemed... why not Palpy? I would think that that would be just as despicalbe....

He prolly can, just theres no reason for him to turn....if he were turned good....no movie. But i dont think he was born evil, i think he was at one point good. But as far as kids go...what about Tarkin and the operator that actually fired the Deathstar on Alderaan? Im sure they murdered more kids with one shot, than Anakin did younglings. Are they not able to ever be considered good? I know theyre all dead, but if they hadnt died....would they be forever evil? Or does that not apply since thyre not prominant force users?

Darned good point there, Darth Subjekt.

And by the way, my story about Palpy being turned by Luke, was a sarcastic one since the Saga is so vague on moral issues. How evil Vader could go to Force Heaven is beyond me. So will he see Padme too in the after life, too? And if the Saga is about how evil could be turned, well, like I said, Palpy deserves a turn, because as the Saga portrayed Anakin, no one is born evil.

I thought this was a great thread.
What if Anakin could have turned Palpy from all those times with him.
Palpy: Let's destroy planets with the Death Star.
Vader: You know, destruction of a planet is not all that great... Remember when you mother told you not to---
Palpy: Damn my mother!
Vader: Come on, Palpy, this evil thing is so getting old...

If Vader could have turned Palpy, he could still have fulfilled the prophesy of The Chosen One...

Originally posted by PENGUINER
"Not only is that storyline appalling... but your basic point makes no sense. Just WHY does Paly therefore have to have a shot at redemption? He most certainly does not. Part of the moral tale is that some people are just bad- period (which is why it is ok to kill them in large numbers), Anakin's story is specifically why a GOOD person would turn bad; that does not follow that all bad people can therefore become good, or were ever good."

From your point then, Anakin was good and became evil.
Palpy was born evil; therefore not redeemable.

Then it begs the question, was Palpy when he was a toddler evil????

Again, if Anakin can kill kids and be redeemed... why not Palpy? I would think that that would be just as despicalbe....

Because Anakin is different from Palpy. And again, I am not saying Palpy was definitely born evil. But even if he wasn't, it does not follow that he can become good again. I dunno why people think that.

And incidentally, yes, the Force DOES make a difference to the good/evil thing. That is part of its risk.

The saga does NOT say no-one is born evil. It only says Anakin wasn't. That is not meant to be a general lesson!

Anakin fulfilled his destiny, that is his get out clause. It is not forgiveness for everything he ever did.