pre-crisis superman vs Galactus

Originally posted by spideycarnage
if thats the case spiderman can beat hulk, magneto, surfer and maybe strange, thor because he once was cosmic spiderman in a few comics.
but i cant really say that cause it was a few comics that cosmic spidey appeard in.

And I'm not saying Superman is better than G as a result, just that particular version.

You're coming from off the wall now kid.

Originally posted by Darth_Erebus
I'm being childish? I'm not the one who believes Superman is on par with God which he apparently isn't as others have stated why.
It's apparently the truth because you say so. Glad to know you set me straight on that. [sarcasm] From now on I will accept everything you say as absolute truth[/sarcasm]

And I said why the interpretation is certainly believable in the other thread. He was becoming omnipotent/omniscient, becoming one with all that is.

The sword of Superman was created at creation.
Who existed before that!?

It's OBVIOUS who it was alluding to.

You don't have to take what I say as truth.
Though most of the time you should. 😉

Originally posted by Juntai
Superman w/ Sword of Superman was one with god, and omnipotent completely. Get that shit out of here. You don't even know what you're talking about.

I know you're a complete f*cking idiot! First of all, this isn't about the Sword of Stupidity or whatever. This is pre-crisis Superman vs Galactus. Get that sword sh*t out of here, you turd. I'm going to keep saying this until you stupid fanboys get it.

IN NO WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM COULD SUPERMAN DEFEAT GALACTUS! HE IS NOWHERE NEAR POWERFUL ENOUGH NO MATTER WHAT YOU GIVE HIM!

If Superman fought Galactus with the sword of Superman, he would still get swatted away like a fly, becuase Galactus would simply take the sword away from him. Superman would end up like these smilies:

giljotiinihangripvelho
chairbashblow

Any more of this sword of Superman crap is offtopic and spam.

Keep on subject. Pre-Crisis vs Galactus!

Allusions cant be treated as fact in debate to be fair Jun.

From the comic all we know for a fact is that it expanded Supes senses and made him omniscient. Nothing else.

even if the sword was raw, it would just mean superman would die with a sword projecting from his anus

Where does all this talk of omnipotence and being on par with God come from? The sword of superman was never shown to endow such abilities on Supes in the comic. Thats merely fanboy talk.

It came to pass that, in the course of a great battle for Truth and Justice, man and sword finally came together. For the first time the sword allowed itself to be grasped by the hand of a man. Holding it, Superman found himself expanding, spreading across the winds of the universe, the whole history of creation flooding his mind. His consciousness expanded, he was becoming an all-seeing, all knowing Protector. Then he let it go.

"You have done well, my son. You have earned your name. Your future is yours to make. Your greatness among living things is assured." This message was left in his head as the sword receded into the blackness of space once again. The sword remains out there. It waits until he who has earned it is ready to retrieve it and fulfill his ultimate destiny in Eternity (Superman Annual #10).

It granted him omniscience. Nothing more.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Where does all this talk of omnipotence and being on par with God come from? The sword of superman was never shown to endow such abilities on Supes in the comic. Thats merely fanboy talk.

It granted him omniscience. Nothing more.

And indeed it was God,
At the beginning of the comic,[page 4] it said "LET THERE BE LIGHT"
And the universe, as well as the Sword of Superman, were created.

Originally posted by Juntai
His person not just vision was expanding, he was becoming greater than the universe. He says it himself on page 38, "I was starting to expand, spread over the winds themselves." Later in the Prologue, page 40, it says, "When he was about to become one with the universe, an immortal"...
He was becoming omnipotent/omniscient.

Incorrect. He said he found himself expanding, he goes on to clarify by saying the history of creation flooded his mind and it further exapnds on this by saying "His consciousness expanded, he was becoming an all-seeing, all knowing Protector". Nowhere does it state that he physically became one with the universe but instead the focus is on his mind doing so. Find me a reference to him physically doing so, or you have nothing. The only conclusive property it gave him is omniscience and immortality. Anything else is opinion given whats actually stated.

It stating he was becoming one with the universe far from conclusively proves your point. Not when it makes several references to his mind becoming one with the universe. It stating that he was becoming an immortal doesnt equate to him being granted omnipotence.

Originally posted by Juntai
And indeed it was God,
At the beginning of the comic,[page 4] it said "LET THERE BE LIGHT"
And the universe, as well as the Sword of Superman, were created.

There were allusions to it being God with that line. It was likely the intention of the writers for us to think it was God. Given the fact that DC has no problem making direct references to God and having a very Christian themed cosmology, the fact that no direct statement was made saying it was God suggests the writers didnt want the Swords God connection to be canon. It wasnt stated it was God. Regardless of the allusions you cant claim it was only that it was heavily suggested to be God.

Finally where in any of the comic does it show that the sword equated him to God or that he could destroy God with the sword as some have claimed? It really doesnt. 😕

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Incorrect. He said he found himself expanding, he goes on to clarify by saying the history of creation flooded his mind and it further exapnds on this by saying "His consciousness expanded, he was becoming an all-seeing, all knowing Protector". Nowhere does it state that he physically became one with the universe but instead the focus is on his mind doing so. Find me a reference to him physically doing so, or you have nothing. The only conclusive property it gave him is omniscience and immortality. Anything else is opinion given whats actually stated.

It stating he was becoming one with the universe far from conclusively proves your point. Not when it makes several references to his mind becoming one with the universe. It stating that he was becoming an immortal doesnt equate to him being granted omnipotence.

There were allusions to it being God with that line. It was likely the intention of the writers for us to think it was God. Given the fact that DC has no problem making direct references to God and having a very Christian themed cosmology, the fact that no direct statement was made saying it was God suggests the writers didnt want the Swords God connection to be canon. It wasnt stated it was God. Regardless of the allusions you cant claim it was only that it was heavily suggested to be God.

Finally where in any of the comic does it show that the sword equated him to God or that he could destroy God with the sword as some have claimed? It really doesnt. 😕

At the beginning of the comic, it said "Let there be Light" we know for a fact this is God. God created all. It shows a bunch of light, and . .. what? Oh right, the Sword of Superman. It goes into explain how that being created all and the universe was created, and that one day the one who carried the same name as the sword, would wield it as his birthright.

And to clarify using gods power farther, on page 36

"In the magic words, "let there be light", spoken in the right place, and in the right tongue. The universe was created.

In an echo of that magic, in the city of metropolis, a power begins to gather. Drawing strength from the primeval matter in Superman's hand"

That was when he became one with all that is.
So it's clarified as the same power that created all he's tapping into.

And I doubt it would hold much relivence to most...but it certainly helps farther back the theory.
At the end of the comic, the voice that talks to him, is written in the same writing used by the angelic host.

I dunno, we're just not going to agree on this one, I think.
You don't think there's sufficient proof, I see sufficient proof.

However, its one shot, and we'll never know.
But if any-time Superman would be able to defeat Galactus, it's while holding this weapon, imo. Or the other one shot appearance.. Superman Prime, though he's next to featless.

Originally posted by bench261
one more thing, why the hell would galactus destroy the universe? he needs to feed.

galactus will kill superman like a kryptonian insect that he is.

galactus makes beings at will more powerful than superman.

i'm pretty sure he can just read superman's molecular structure and know he's weak to kryptonite and just blast him with a k-beam leaving him to an inch of his life, so he can be his new herald.

superman is a super human. galactus is an omnipotent being. if he felt like it, he can clone an army of supermen

galactus is far from omnipotent.
For example 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 is far from infinity.
galactus has battled many limited beings to a stand still (any being that is not living tribunal, thanos with i.f., or infinity is a limited being).
galactus has died to a limited power.
marvel says that if g armor is removed then he would turn into a small sun. Thus how can he be all powerful. He even uses machines and technology to do a lot of his work. Doesn't sound like an omnipotent being to me. And lastly, why are people assuming regular superman. No herald of g can compare to pre-superman (regular superman yes). All the heralds combined couldn't compare to thousands of galaxies of power that superman prime possesses. If any disagrees with anything I've stated then say in detail to what you disagree with. I will try to back up anything I have said

Well I agree that most versions of superman would be stomped I believe some may have the potential to beat him. If not prime then hyperman has a good chance.

Originally posted by ChaoticReign
Well I agree that most versions of superman would be stomped I believe some may have the potential to beat him. If not prime then hyperman has a good chance.

Hyperman has a chance?

Hyperman will blink Galactus out of existence.

Originally posted by Juntai
It did say, as a fact, that Superman was becoming one with the universe, and nowhere does it say that it was only a sense of omniscience. You're the one assuming now by declaring such. However, earlier a couple pages back, it did pretty much say he was omniscient "All Knowing" though. So he was both. 😉

It said he was becoming one with universe. It never said physically thats your assimption and given that it was previously stated that his consciousness expanded across the universe and that his mind was filled with all the knowledge of the universe its an assumption that is very much unsupported.

Its quite obvious that it was God who spoke to Supes. My arguments is that its not something thats necessarily canon. Regardless it doesnt matter as the only conclusive abilities Supes got were immortality and omniscience. Your assumption, your interpretation isnt stated or shown foe definite on panel, therefore it cant be brought up as fact in a debate. Thats the crux of the matter.

I thought Superman prime was Post Crisis ?

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
It said he was becoming one with universe. It never said physically thats your assimption and given that it was previously stated that his consciousness expanded across the universe and that his mind was filled with all the knowledge of the universe its an assumption that is very much unsupported.

Its quite obvious that it was God who spoke to Supes. My arguments is that its not something thats necessarily canon. Regardless it doesnt matter as the only conclusive abilities Supes got were immortality and omniscience. Your assumption, your interpretation isnt stated or shown foe definite on panel, therefore it cant be brought up as fact in a debate. Thats the crux of the matter.

where'd you get the idea he was immortal? 😕

even the omniscient aspect is open to interpretation. in one sentence it says he knows 'everything' while in the next it says he is STARTING to be an all-seeing protector. the 2 sentiments seem to be at odds.

anyway, for those who've never seen the controversial issue, here are the relevent pages.

here are the other pages. even here it says superman was ABOUT to be an immortal. i guess for the debate we can assume he has the full power of the blade and so is immortal. but he never DID gain actual immortality. anyway, read 'em and see for yourself.

now you all can make your own decisions. 😉

oh, and a tip of the cap to bw for letting me in on how to host scans! 😄

Originally posted by leonidas
where'd you get the idea he was immortal? 😕

You've answered your own question with your subsequent post. One of the powers the sword granted was apparently immortality as you've shown.