Originally posted by kimahri45k
"the only difference between him and normal universe colossus is his sexuality... "So what your saying then is you do acknowledge that Colossus is gay, even though you find it hard to digest.
Of course (in ultimate x-men), it's pretty obvious to anyone who can read between the lines...
Originally posted by kimahri45k
Well why is it so hard to except, why does it bother you so much if he is... like other's have said, doesn't it make for an intresting story?
It hasnt made anything more interesting... it hasnt been a focus of any plot ive read so far (if there has been one then i apologise), its just in the background... marvel suggests it but so far hasnt come out and blatantly said it (as far as i know)...
Look... all im saying is... if marvel really wanted to break new ground and make such a big change to a character, why not wolverine? or spiderman? or captain america? or thor?
Don't know what happened to thor in ultimates, captain america doesn't sleep with anyone (when's the last you'd hear of him in bed with someone) Spiderman is probably married to Mary Jane or Gwen Stacy (I don't bother with Ultimate Spiderman)... And Wolverine, if he was going to sleep with guys, he's probably be Bisexual cause he really sleeps around.
Lets put it this way.
If you were a fan of alpha flight back when before Northstar came out, would you have believed rumors spread.
I think the reason why Mark Miller wanted to make Colossus gay in the ultimate universe is because he isn't a mainstream hero like Cap or Wolverine, its easier to work a story around that fact...
Lets put it another way, what if in the ultimate universe instead of being male, Colossus or another x-men was now female.
And is it a big change like you say, does it change his character any... no, he's still Colossus, regardless if he wants wolverine or not.
Originally posted by kimahri45k Don't know what happened to thor in ultimates, captain america doesn't sleep with anyone (when's the last you'd hear of him in bed with someone) Spiderman is probably married to Mary Jane or Gwen Stacy (I don't bother with Ultimate Spiderman)... And Wolverine, if he was going to sleep with guys, he's probably be Bisexual cause he really sleeps around.
Yet colossus has been with kitty pryde, it was hinted he and marrow could get together, he almost did with rogue, callisto too... and in astonishing x-men he's all but back with kitty...
Lets put it this way.
If you were a fan of alpha flight back when before Northstar came out, would you have believed rumors spread.
I honestly dont know... because i dont know whether he was originally intended to be gay or not...
I think the reason why Mark Miller wanted to make Colossus gay in the ultimate universe is because he isn't a mainstream hero like Cap or Wolverine, its easier to work a story around that fact...
Lets put it another way, what if in the ultimate universe instead of being male, Colossus or another x-men was now female.
but they simply dont have the guts to do it with a major character due to the amount of flak they'd get...
and to my knowledge they still havent focused on it properly...
and the gender thing would suck...
And is it a big change like you say, does it change his character any... no, he's still Colossus, regardless if he wants wolverine or not.
but not the colossus ive known and read about for the past 15 years... he is different... my point was that people say that these characters change so much so something like sexuality can change... i disagree... they are too alike to have that changed... just imo...
Exacly... you agree they are different, the fact is that the ultimate universe is different.
Its not a new chapter in the x-men universe, its not some side step in a reality altering event, its a whole new universe, allowing the marvel writers to do with the charaters as they like, giving them the chance to make changes that make sense to them.
If Mark Miller has decided to change charatcers, even their sexuality, who are we to tell them their wrong in their ideas... I personally hated that they killed the Beast in it, but I still like the ultimate universe.
Originally posted by kimahri45k
Exacly... you agree they are different, the fact is that the ultimate universe is different.
Its not a new chapter in the x-men universe, its not some side step in a reality altering event, its a whole new universe, allowing the marvel writers to do with the charaters as they like, giving them the chance to make changes that make sense to them.If Mark Miller has decided to change charatcers, even their sexuality, who are we to tell them their wrong in their ideas... I personally hated that they killed the Beast in it, but I still like the ultimate universe.
but thats what im saying... look at the characters... cyclops is with jean, he and logan hate each other... colossus is the exact same bar his sexuality...
if they had completely changed him and made him gay, i would not have had a problem with it, but it seems the only thing they did change was his sexuality...
There are differences in the personalities of the others, though. Let's not forget the Cyclops left the X-Men, and that when he returned after being left to die, he blasted the hell out of Wolverine. Jean and Xavier are much less averse to using TP in less than noble ways. Be they slight differences or huge, they are differences. That's why Colossus sexuality doesn't bother me much.
This also raises the issue of expectations that people have that are based on what they assume is true. For example, for some reason unbeknownst to me, people often assume that I'm hetero when they first meet me. I've been at my current job for about 6 weeks, and people still assume that I'm straight. I haven't done anything to encourage that thinking, other than saying that I liked someone's hair one day.
My point is that what we come to see and love has more to do with us than the other party. Is it so difficult to believe that Colossus in 616 could turn out to be homosexual? I don't think so. It happens every day. People stop living out others expectations of them and start living life as who they are. I had a professor tell me that he's homosexual, but that he didn't realize it until he was older. He's still married, incidentally, and everyone, including his wife, knows that he's gay.
Besides, if people can accept Scott and Jean growing apart and their relationship failing, why is it so difficult to believe that someone could decide that they are attracted to people of the same sex?
It'll be a very long time before Marvel has a homosexual flagship character. Can you imagine a gay Cap? It'd be the kiss of death for the House of Ideas with the power that "Christian" conservatives wield in the US now.
Sorry, what, "if they had completely changed him and made him gay"...
how would you have Colossus act in ultimates then, like a flamboyent gay man worrying about his waistline each day.
Thank you Cosmic flame for putting your's forward, its like I say, you can't judge a person on there sexuality at all based on how they act.
And you're right about the conservative view held these days, it seems to affect the minds of some many people.
Originally posted by Cosmic Flame
There are differences in the personalities of the others, though. Let's not forget the Cyclops left the X-Men, and that when he returned after being left to die, he blasted the hell out of Wolverine. Jean and Xavier are much less averse to using TP in less than noble ways. Be they slight differences or huge, they are differences. That's why Colossus sexuality doesn't bother me much.
Cyclops and Logan have always hated each other... but Cyke is barely 16 so you'd expect him to be less reserved than normal...
This also raises the issue of expectations that people have that are based on what they assume is true. For example, for some reason unbeknownst to me, people often assume that I'm hetero when they first meet me. I've been at my current job for about 6 weeks, and people still assume that I'm straight. I haven't done anything to encourage that thinking, other than saying that I liked someone's hair one day.My point is that what we come to see and love has more to do with us than the other party. Is it so difficult to believe that Colossus in 616 could turn out to be homosexual? I don't think so. It happens every day. People stop living out others expectations of them and start living life as who they are. I had a professor tell me that he's homosexual, but that he didn't realize it until he was older. He's still married, incidentally, and everyone, including his wife, knows that he's gay.
Colossus doesnt live out expectations that anyone sets, he never has... he lives in possibly the most accepting family in all of marvel... he's a mutant, i don't think being gay would trouble anyone in that house...
Besides, if people can accept Scott and Jean growing apart and their relationship failing, why is it so difficult to believe that someone could decide that they are attracted to people of the same sex?
I do not nor have i ever believed a person chooses to be gay, they either are or there arent...
Colossus has been around for what, 40 years? Not once have they even hinted that he may be gay...
It'll be a very long time before Marvel has a homosexual flagship character. Can you imagine a gay Cap? It'd be the kiss of death for the House of Ideas with the power that "Christian" conservatives wield in the US now.
My point exactly... Colossus is imo Marvels attempt to be PC without rocking the boat... make a minor character gay and you please everyone...
Originally posted by kimahri45k
how would you have Colossus act in ultimates then, like a flamboyent gay man worrying about his waistline each day.
You took that the wrong way entirely... and you know thats not what i meant...
Thank you Cosmic flame for putting your's forward, its like I say, you can't judge a person on there sexuality at all based on how they act.
And you're right about the conservative view held these days, it seems to affect the minds of some many people.
i am not nor have i ever been a conservative... and i am insulted you'd make such a broad statement...
Tell me this... if your favourite character happened to be gay from his inception, how would you feel if they turned around and made him straight one day?
Originally posted by pr1983Tell me this... if your favourite character happened to be gay from his inception, how would you feel if they turned around and made him straight one day?
oohh good point
and besides the reason these comics have been around for so long is the fans devotion. is it too much to ask that they respect that?
"My point exactly... Colossus is imo Marvels attempt to be PC without rocking the boat... make a minor character gay and you please everyone..."
Actully you don't please everyone, just you... A gay character in a major roll has more significance to people like myself, rather then throwing them to the back.
I made a point eariler that the ultimate universe lets marvel writers do what they like with the characters, change them around... If you noticed in an earlier ultimate x-men book, Nick Fury, long time in the marvel universe as being a white guy, in the ultimate universe is now Black.
Doesn't it drop something there, if they can make Nick Fury black, its just as well making a character gay.
Can you honestly say you know this Colossus's sexual preferance in the ultimate universe? Can you?
And lets just say that I wouldn't kick up a fuse about if they turned a long tiem gay character straight in another format, I.E if they turned northstar straight in the ultimate universe, he'd still be gay in the reguler run of marvel.
Again, Nick Fury... white to black, Colossus... straight to gay.
You guys ever notice Colossus hand placement during those "fast ball specials" ....No wonder he's always calling for them!
Colossus: Hey logan let's get that cat outta the tree
Logan: alright, i'll get the ladder
Colossus: NO..... there's not enough time, we need a fastball special
Logan: oh great here we go again!
Originally posted by kimahri45k
[B]Actully you don't please everyone, just you... A gay character in a major roll has more significance to people like myself, rather then throwing them to the back.
I was talking about appeasement... i didnt mean overjoyed... but just enough to fob off those who would protest... 😬
I made a point eariler that the ultimate universe lets marvel writers do what they like with the characters, change them around... If you noticed in an earlier ultimate x-men book, Nick Fury, long time in the marvel universe as being a white guy, in the ultimate universe is now Black.
Doesn't it drop something there, if they can make Nick Fury black, its just as well making a character gay.
Good point... but to me thats not much of a change... it really isnt... and im an slj fan too so maybe im biased...
Can you honestly say you know this Colossus's sexual preferance in the ultimate universe? Can you?
Pretty much... if he turned out to be straight i'd be pretty surprised... all hints and indications so far point to him being gay and being infatuated with wolverine...
And lets just say that I wouldn't kick up a fuse about if they turned a long tiem gay character straight in another format, I.E if they turned northstar straight in the ultimate universe, he'd still be gay in the reguler run of marvel.
and how long before they change the normal universe version to match?
Again, Nick Fury... white to black, Colossus... straight to gay.
Maybe the same thing to you, but not to me...