The most fundamental question.

Started by debbiejo5 pages
debbiejo Dreamer

Yes, that's what many Churches teach....we all must learn from our tragedies....so sad really.....because it doesn't really help anyone...Not really....cause some never can find out what the lesson was supposed to be....Maybe they start blaming themselves...maybe they feel they need to be more religious, maybe they need too become missionaries (I knew a family like that one)...Maybe the baby would of turned out to be a murderer....maybe, maybe, maybe..... .There was no purpose for the baby dieing...no lesson in it...no lesson for the mother...We are born into a solid form and we die just like other solid forms...But the essence/energy cannot be destroyed...That is the bigger picture...

Great Vengeance Senior Member
Originally posted by debbiejo
Yes, that's what many Churches teach....we all must learn from our tragedies....so sad really.....because it doesn't really help anyone...Not really....cause some never can find out what the lesson was supposed to be....Maybe they start blaming themselves...maybe they feel they need to be more religious, maybe they need too become missionaries (I knew a family like that one)...Maybe the baby would of turned out to be a murderer....maybe, maybe, maybe..... .There was no purpose for the baby dieing...no lesson in it...no lesson for the mother...We are born into a solid form and we die just like other solid forms...But the essence/energy cannot be destroyed...That is the bigger picture...

Well thats nice to know 🙂

But seriously you refer to buddhism yes? It definately makes more sense than christiananity... Well moving on although it is true energy is never destroyed I doubt your identity is retained within the energy itself... It could be possible though since we dont fully understand these things yet and it certainly is nice to wonder about.

debbiejo Dreamer

Originally posted by Great Vengeance
Well thats nice to know 🙂

But seriously you refer to buddhism yes? It definately makes more sense than Christianity... Well moving on although it is true energy is never destroyed I doubt your identity is retained within the energy itself... It could be possible though since we dont fully understand these things yet and it certainly is nice to wonder about.

Well I do think buddhism makes more since than Christianity, but still don't agree with all of it.....I do feel that many things taught in the Metaphysics and quantum physics fields hold true....especially when you read about non-locality and the protons or is it neutrons...(can't remember right now,) I think that are in pairs can communicate from long distances...and if you alter one proton, the other will also adjust it's self....They're communicating some how.

debbiejo Dreamer

photons, photons...that's what I was trying to remember..... 😄 ^^

Great Vengeance Senior Member
Originally posted by debbiejo
Well I do think buddhism makes more since than Christianity, but still don't agree with all of it.....I do feel that many things taught in the Metaphysics and quantum physics fields hold true....especially when you read about non-locality and the protons or is it neutrons...(can't remember right now,) I think that are in pairs can communicate from long distances...and if you alter one proton, the other will also adjust it's self....They're communicating some how.

Yes I think I recall reading something about that, but anyway thats exactly what Im saying, we dont fully understand the properties of matter and energy yet...what buddism refers to as "essence" could have an actual scientific backing once further breakthroughs in the field are made.

tax Member

you are still not answering Philo's question. Do you know what 'being' is ?

tax Member

Hey Philo, the question that you have raised is challenging but at the same time it is interesting. I believe that you are a great thinker and will not be contented with answers we provide. Therefore, the question that you have raised is unanswerable.

Wonderer Senior Member

Originally posted by tax
Hey Philo, the question that you have raised is challenging but at the same time it is interesting. I believe that you are a great thinker and will not be contented with answers we provide. Therefore, the question that you have raised is unanswerable.

Originally posted by Philosophicus
The most fundamental question.
What is being? Can anyone ever define being/existence as such? What would be the difference between existence as such and non-existence as such - I am not refering to the existence of individual entities, but to existence/being proper, or all that is.

Well, that's how I used to think about things in a spiral of unanswerable questioning. Philosophicus/Philo was me (no literally - I was banned so I go under the name Wonderer now), but now I have become a Buddhist, so I think more sensibly:
To contemplate ideas about the ultimate, absolute, essence of the universe, God, nature, etc., is senseless, fruitless and bad for one's mental as well as physical health, as it creates confusion, frustration, intellectual conflicts, and ultimately, no real answers. We must simply accept the fact that we, as mere human beings, being very small parts of the whole of the universe, cannot know the essence of the truth of existence.However, we must accept the fact that some things are hidden from our knowledge and then strive to be in synchronisation with the vibration and rhythm of this mystic law of the universe. One can only make peace with the great unknown of the universe if one accepts the mystery of the Universe's essence like a flower of which the seed producing mechanism is hidden and broken when probed.
Originally posted by Wonderer
The universe meant for us to simply vibrate in its rhythm, to simply accept its beautiful mystery, not to disrupt the natural flow with senseless intellectual deconstructions.

As you can see, Buddhism (Thanks again to Shakyamunison who introduced it to me, and who I see as my teacher on Buddhism) makes me think differently about things; I think and feel more sensible and peaceful now.

debbiejo Dreamer

You found your happy place... 😊

Wonderer Senior Member
Originally posted by debbiejo
You found your happy place... 😊

Yes!

debbiejo Dreamer
Originally posted by Great Vengeance
Yes I think I recall reading something about that, but anyway thats exactly what Im saying, we dont fully understand the properties of matter and energy yet...what buddism refers to as "essence" could have an actual scientific backing once further breakthroughs in the field are made.

Sure can, and so does other beliefs... 😄

Wonderer Senior Member

Please people, no fruitless scientific probing here! Whatever Science 'teaches' us, we can never know the real meaning of (because we are part of everything and not the 'creators' of it.

The universe meant for us to simply vibrate in its rhythm, to simply accept its beautiful mystery, not to disrupt the natural flow with senseless intellectual deconstructions.

finti Senior Member

is it sales on flowers here or???

Atlantis001 The one without a name

I think that it cannot be answered completely since it is a very fundamental question. Explanation are based on the reduction of something to other more fundamental concepts, and we cannot answer this one if there is no more fundamental concepts. Anyway, in my opinion that doesn´t mean that we can´t get the meaning, just that we... well, lets say we can´t create a statement that corresponds to the answer of this question, or using other words... we cannot communicate the answer, but we can understand it individually.

Anyway, there is a good way to think about it in my opinion. For me being/existence is everything that we can make reference to, classify, judge, think about, etc... using substantives, adjectives, and logical reasoning to do that, for example. Non-existence is something that we cannot make reference to, I already made a mistake when I tried to judge, and explain non-existence in this same sentence.

Even the act of writing "non-existence" as a substantive (or understanding it as something) is a mistake since it cannot be referred to. Its is like Shaky´s nothingness.

Legend Of Chibi Your soul.

Re: The most fundamental question.

Originally posted by Philosophicus
What is being? Can anyone ever define being/existence as such? What would be the difference between existence as such and non-existence as such - I am not refering to the existence of individual entities, but to existence/being proper, or all that is.

You would have no being if there was nothing there to have give it, nothing happens for no reason.

If there isn't a great, powerful invisible being there is NO BEING ATALL.

Shakyamunison Nam Myoho Renge Kyo

Re: Re: The most fundamental question.

Originally posted by Legend Of Chibi
You would have no being if there was nothing there to have give it, nothing happens for no reason.

If there isn't a great, powerful invisible being there is NO BEING ATALL.

How do you know this?

You are assuming that there was a beginning. What if the universe was and is like the biblical god? No beginning and no end.

Wonderer Senior Member

Re: Re: Re: The most fundamental question.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
How do you know this?

You are assuming that there was a beginning. What if the universe was and is like the biblical god? No beginning and no end.

Exactly. The universe does not have a beginning or an end, everything is eternal and infinite. All is one solid continuity...If you say that everything started somewhere, then what was before that? Obviously something must have been before everything started, and that regression makes things eternal and infinite.

Atlantis001 The one without a name

Maybe the universe does not have a beginning or an end, but time does... time is just a part of the universe, and maybe the universe could still exist without a time.

Wonderer Senior Member

Time only exists in the mind, so Time's limits or origination and end also exists only in the mind. That's it! If there were no humans in the universe, then time would not exist!

Mindship Snap out of it.

Originally posted by Philosophicus
Your description of awareness seems fine, but the question here is about being as such - You say that it's a physical state of existence, but I'm not pondering what the state of being is, rather existence as such, or being as such.

So, the question remains, what is existence/being as such?

I liked one physicist's response to this question, Why is there Something instead of Nothing? He said, Because Nothing is unstable.

But then one can still ask, Why is "nothing" unstable?

My guess is, this is a question beyond what the human intellect can know, that the Ultimate Reality is Mystery, and to even ask "Why is the Ultimate Reality Mystery" would seem to merely prove that point.