Originally posted by K3VIL
War Hulk:
Superman will stay fist to fist with War Hulk helped by Wonder Woman, seeing Diana in danger, Supes will go all out blasting him with heat vision and hitting at sonic speeds, during that timeSinister:
Flash would be knocking down Sinister with some good placed sonic speed physical attacks and then help Supes using the IMP, Infinity Mass Punch on WH knocking him unconsciousDeath:
Meanwhile he's dealing with WH, Supes will see Death wiping out Batman and Green Arrow, and decide to blast at 5000 Farhenheit degrees of Heat Vision the poor Logan, turning him into ashes.
Martian Manhunter's Force Vision destroy things at impatc, and ignite inflammable objects, it means Logan can be burned, or he can be knocked unconscious from Aquaman or MM, if they are busy, Kyle Rainer will blast and then stomp Death with a giant robot 100 feet talls and then cut Sinister's body in pieces and put them into force fields to avoid him to regenerateHolocaust:
Martian Manhunter and Aquaman gives troubles with their telepathy to a Millenia Giant, i mean a MILLENIA GIANT.Holocaust will become a scared cat.If they fight him Phiscally, MM can reach for few mins Supes league, Aquaman has lifted San Francisco, do i need to say more?
Originally posted by K3VIL
Sinister:
Flash would be knocking down Sinister with some good placed sonic speed physical attacks and then help Supes using the IMP, Infinity Mass Punch on WH knocking him unconscious
Sinister has complete control over his physical form at all times. Flash could literally beat Sinister to a pulp and he would just laugh and reform, stronger than last time. Meanwhile, he has superhuman reflexes, strength, and can fire plasma bolts. Using telepathy to predict Flash's movements, he can blast him through a wall.
Originally posted by Khellendros
Man, it only takes 100 pounds of TNT to knock Superman out these days?? Jeez, that's one hell of a power drop. Anyways. Wolverine gets knocked unconscious, heals up, and is back in the fight in minutes.
Originally posted by Khellendros
Sinister has complete control over his physical form at all times. Flash could literally beat Sinister to a pulp and he would just laugh and reform, stronger than last time. Meanwhile, he has superhuman reflexes, strength, and can fire plasma bolts. Using telepathy to predict Flash's movements, he can blast him through a wall.
Wolverine is no push over normally but as Death he is practically unbeatable. He:
Can channel immeasurable amounts of energy with that crazy sword.
Can take a punch from the class 100 Colossus and not even reel
Can take down two different and extremely powerful teams of X-men
Can reduce a base of huge power to nothing in minutes
Can resist huge levels of psychic power
Can threaten the mannites
CANT BE BEATEN BY MARTIAN VISION
Originally posted by Pepito
Wolverine is no push over normally but as Death he is practically unbeatable. He:Can channel immeasurable amounts of energy with that crazy sword.
Can take a punch from the class 100 Colossus and not even reel
Can take down two different and extremely powerful teams of X-men
Can reduce a base of huge power to nothing in minutes
Can resist huge levels of psychic power
Can threaten the mannites
CANT BE BEATEN BY MARTIAN VISION
I'm not saying Colossus is Superman's level although he's stronger than MM's class 80 but Logan simply ignored the punch. Superman MM and AM are not all that strong and where did Aquaman lift the whole of San Fran. If he did so he's a pointless character. Am and MM only exhibit great telepathy when the story calls for it. MM is an accomplished telepath but he's still not quite at the level of Xman, Cable and Jean (she was slowly transforming back into Phoenix). AM is limited to fish, is he not?
And I'm not a fanboy just because I disagree with the good news about DC
(Apocalypse combines energy and matter manipulation and increasable strength so he could take Green Lnatern)
Originally posted by Pepito
I'm not saying Colossus is Superman's level although he's stronger than MM's class 80
No, MM can achieve Superman levels of strenght.
Superman MM and AM are not all that strong
Yes they are.
where did Aquaman lift the whole of San Fran. If he did so he's a pointless character.
He did, and I guess he is a pointless character, then.
Am and MM only exhibit great telepathy when the story calls for it.
No, you are wrong, MM is above Xavier and AM is Emma Forst level.
AM is limited to fish, is he not?
NO, he is not.
Originally posted by Pepito
I'm not saying Colossus is Superman's level although he's stronger than MM's class 80 but Logan simply ignored the punch. Superman MM and AM are not all that strong and where did Aquaman lift the whole of San Fran. If he did so he's a pointless character. Am and MM only exhibit great telepathy when the story calls for it. MM is an accomplished telepath but he's still not quite at the level of Xman, Cable and Jean (she was slowly transforming back into Phoenix). AM is limited to fish, is he not?And I'm not a fanboy just because I disagree with the good news about DC
(Apocalypse combines energy and matter manipulation and increasable strength so he could take Green Lnatern)
Interesting matchup. Of course, if you wanted the ultimate Apocalyse horseman fight, you should have put Harbinger on the team. Harbinger is, essentially, a cross between Doomsday, Nimrod and Amazo. EASILY Poccy's most impressive servant.
As for the current matchup - I guess it could go either way depending on how it's written. But there's a lot to be said for teamwork. JLA have it in spades.
Holocaust, by the way, IS weak to telepathy. Holocaust himself said so. The reason given is that during AOA, Poccy took great pain to kill as many psionics as he could, so Holocaust never had to learn how to deal with telepathic attacks; he's completely untrained in resisting them. As for why Nate didn't just...switch his mind off, well, it's because Nate is an idiot and never actually used telepathy against him. Neither did Exodus. If they had, the fight would have been over immediately. Go figure.
Apocalypse: "You can't beat me boy. I am too strong."
Green skyscraper weighing 300,000,000 tons drops on Apoc's head.
Apocalypse, using his last feat of strengh appears under the rubble.
A: "Urgh...is that best you have, annoying infidel?"
GL: "...No."
Another skyscraper, weighing 600,000,000 tons drops over Apoc.
A: "..." (He is dead)
a) Green Lanterns cannot drain life energy.
b) If post crisis Superman can move the moon how come he can be hurt by people below class 100 strength.
c) MM is quoted as having class 80 strength on all his bios I've seen so far and so he is class 80.
d) MM and AM are not over Xavier on the fact that Xavier was able to create Onslaught and defeat Shadow King who is supposed to be the untapped malign psychic energy of the entire world. Only die hard dc fans think MM is better than Xavier.
e) If Green Lantern coulddrop a 300000000 ton skyscraper on Apocalypse he would still survive what with his odd shapeshifting abilities and Green Lantern would make a very big dent in the Earth.
f) Telepaths aren't able to bring someone down instantly and in the eman time the horsemen won't be sitting around.
Originally posted by K3VIL
Wolverine can grow back from ashes after a shot of Heat Vision?No.
Originally posted by K3VIL
Flash's mental abilities and brain tasks can be done at LIGHTNING SPEEDS.Before Sinister even manage to read the mind of Flash he'll be knocked down.He grow back?Flash will drop him under the heat vision of Supes that will burn both him and Logan.Or Wally can simply take him to a volcano into the Hawaii or in other place of the world and let him being disintegrated.Or he can let him projecting plasma bolts and then take Sinister in the place where the plasma bolt was going and the poor Sin will hit himself.
Originally posted by K3VIL
What about the 12'000 F degrees Heat Vision Of Supes plus Martian Vision?Logan would be dead, stop being a fanboy.
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Apocalypse: "You can't beat me boy. I am too strong."Green skyscraper weighing 300,000,000 tons drops on Apoc's head.
Apocalypse, using his last feat of strengh appears under the rubble.
A: "Urgh...is that best you have, annoying infidel?"
GL: "...No."
Another skyscraper, weighing 600,000,000 tons drops over Apoc.
A: "..." (He is dead)
Originally posted by demigawd
Holocaust, by the way, IS weak to telepathy.
Originally posted by Khellendros
Oh yeah, because SUPERMAN is going to brutally kill someone with his heat vision. Because that's completely in character.He has to plan out what he's gong to do to some extent, even if it's only a few moves ahead. that's all Sinister needs. Superman can go ahead and use his heat vision, Sinister will just regenerate. How exactly will Wally take Sinister to a volcano? If he stays in contact with Sinister any longer than it takes to land a punch, he's getting a plasma bolt in the face.
Those two powerhouses waste time trying to hit Wolverine, who is dodging and deflecting with his sword, and they leave themselves open to getting attacked by War.
Sure, GL could do that if he WANTED to waste his energy on an idiotic plan like that. Apocalypse can teleport out of the way, come back as the rubble clears and make it look like it hit and had no effect just to f*ck with GL's head. He could grow to the size of the skyscraper and knock it aside. Hitting apocalypse with large heavy things is a VERY bad idea.
In their last fight in the AoA universe, Holocaust and Nate are fighting. At one point, Nate hits Holocaust with thousands of telepathic spikes. He's hurt, but he keeps fighting. Holocaust may not be totally invulnerable to telepathy, but he is not going down instantly from it.
What he said.
Originally posted by Khellendros
Oh yeah, because SUPERMAN is going to brutally kill someone with his heat vision. Because that's completely in character.
Originally posted by Khellendros
He has to plan out what he's gong to do to some extent, even if it's only a few moves ahead. that's all Sinister needs. Superman can go ahead and use his heat vision, Sinister will just regenerate. How exactly will Wally take Sinister to a volcano? If he stays in contact with Sinister any longer than it takes to land a punch, he's getting a plasma bolt in the face.
Originally posted by Khellendros
Those two powerhouses waste time trying to hit Wolverine, who is dodging and deflecting with his sword, and they leave themselves open to getting attacked by War.
Originally posted by Khellendros
Sure, GL could do that if he WANTED to waste his energy on an idiotic plan like that. Apocalypse can teleport out of the way, come back as the rubble clears and make it look like it hit and had no effect just to f*ck with GL's head. He could grow to the size of the skyscraper and knock it aside. Hitting apocalypse with large heavy things is a VERY bad idea
Originally posted by Khellendros
In their last fight in the AoA universe, Holocaust and Nate are fighting. At one point, Nate hits Holocaust with thousands of telepathic spikes. He's hurt, but he keeps fighting. Holocaust may not be totally invulnerable to telepathy, but he is not going down instantly from it.
Originally posted by Pepito
a) Green Lanterns cannot drain life energy.b) If post crisis Superman can move the moon how come he can be hurt by people below class 100 strength.
c) MM is quoted as having class 80 strength on all his bios I've seen so far and so he is class 80.
d) MM and AM are not over Xavier on the fact that Xavier was able to create Onslaught and defeat Shadow King who is supposed to be the untapped malign psychic energy of the entire world. Only die hard dc fans think MM is better than Xavier.
e) If Green Lantern coulddrop a 300000000 ton skyscraper on Apocalypse he would still survive what with his odd shapeshifting abilities and Green Lantern would make a very big dent in the Earth.
f) Telepaths aren't able to bring someone down instantly and in the eman time the horsemen won't be sitting around.
b)Cause if you can lift a huge object doesn't mean you cannot be hurt by someone who's not in you strenght league.The Thing or Colossus for example, can punch Supes, he'll feel it, but being injured, maybe knocked back or slightly moved, but nothing more.
c)Super Strength: The Martian's superhuman strength comes from his plasmorphic structure formed from immensely long and complex molecular chains, augmented with his psionic and telekinetic abilities allowing him to lift incredible weights without these weights crumbling under the stress. The Martian has been seen lifting small tankers out of the ocean for short distances. By modifing the density of these bio-polymers, the Manhunter can make himself stronger by forcing the polymers into tighter bundles. At a rest state, the Manhunter can lift approximately 20 tons. Given a few minutes to reconfigure, he could match Superman pound for pound for about a minute. Then the bio-polymer would begin to suffer under the strain and begin to unravel. While the Manhunter's strength can be on par with Superman and he lacks the long term endurance and stamina of the Kryptonian. This probably has to do with the Kryptonian's storage and creation of MetaATP which the Martian biology would not have developed being so far from the Earth's sun.
d)MM was once linked with all the living beings in D.C. Universe, his mind was able to analize the Doomsday Engine called Mageddon, which mind is pure destruction, a contact like that would put Xavier into coma.
MM mind is sufficiently powerful to have effect on a Millenia Giant, which power is around 1/10 of Galactus at full power.4Millenia Giant were destroying a world, and even a full charged energy Superman with the energy of a city in his body was having problems into slowing down one of them
e)What about GL stabbing Apoc with a spear, blasting him, and throwing him into space, or perhaps into the sun?Or maybe put him in a force field and create spikes into the force field stabbing his brain?Not enough?What about GL blasting with an energy blast able to level a city the poor Apoc?
f)Maybe Marvel telepaths, cause D.C. telepaths works on a higher level, only Dragonmoon can be put on the level of MM and the actual AM
Originally posted by Khellendros
In their last fight in the AoA universe, Holocaust and Nate are fighting. At one point, Nate hits Holocaust with thousands of telepathic spikes. He's hurt, but he keeps fighting. Holocaust may not be totally invulnerable to telepathy, but he is not going down instantly from it. [/B]
Those weren't telepathic spikes. They were telekinetic.
Originally posted by K3VIL
a)A GL ring restore the energy of Oa battery.Kyle with his ring was able to beat Terminus during AVENGERS VS JLA crossover through manipulating the energy of his spear.He can create a force field that prevents Apoc to absorb ambiental energyb)Cause if you can lift a huge object doesn't mean you cannot be hurt by someone who's not in you strenght league.The Thing or Colossus for example, can punch Supes, he'll feel it, but being injured, maybe knocked back or slightly moved, but nothing more.
c)Super Strength: The Martian's superhuman strength comes from his plasmorphic structure formed from immensely long and complex molecular chains, augmented with his psionic and telekinetic abilities allowing him to lift incredible weights without these weights crumbling under the stress. The Martian has been seen lifting small tankers out of the ocean for short distances. By modifing the density of these bio-polymers, the Manhunter can make himself stronger by forcing the polymers into tighter bundles. At a rest state, the Manhunter can lift approximately 20 tons. Given a few minutes to reconfigure, he could match Superman pound for pound for about a minute. Then the bio-polymer would begin to suffer under the strain and begin to unravel. While the Manhunter's strength can be on par with Superman and he lacks the long term endurance and stamina of the Kryptonian. This probably has to do with the Kryptonian's storage and creation of MetaATP which the Martian biology would not have developed being so far from the Earth's sun.
d)MM was once linked with all the living beings in D.C. Universe, his mind was able to analize the Doomsday Engine called Mageddon, which mind is pure destruction, a contact like that would put Xavier into coma.
MM mind is sufficiently powerful to have effect on a Millenia Giant, which power is around 1/10 of Galactus at full power.4Millenia Giant were destroying a world, and even a full charged energy Superman with the energy of a city in his body was having problems into slowing down one of theme)What about GL stabbing Apoc with a spear, blasting him, and throwing him into space, or perhaps into the sun?Or maybe put him in a force field and create spikes into the force field stabbing his brain?Not enough?What about GL blasting with an energy blast able to level a city the poor Apoc?
f)Maybe Marvel telepaths, cause D.C. telepaths works on a higher level, only Dragonmoon can be put on the level of MM and the actual AM
I would've said the same thing.
Xavier is actually slightly above Moondragon except when she's using the mind gem - he survived a mental blast from Galactus in the Skrull destruction story.
It is very stupid to think that Superman can lift the moon and be hurt by earthly energy bolts or electricity (which has happened before). If Superman lifted the moon he would be in Galactus's strength range. Was Superman enhanced when lifting the moon?